forced induction help
12-07-2008, 04:30 PM
#1
forced induction help I am building a 408 for the street and strip for my 99Ta m6. I cant decide how to hit my goal. My goal is 600 /700 at the tire . I would love to turbo it but there hardly any room under the hood. I have thought about buying the ebay kit and cutting the T4 flange of and welding a T6 flange. I have about 3000 to build a forced induction kit . What kink of turbo would I use for a 408 ci ? What kind of kit ? 
12-07-2008, 04:37 PM
#2
i dont think 3,000 is gonna do it for turbo or supercharger.
Even if you go with the ebay kit, add a turbo, injectors, tuning, misc things i would say easily 5 k on the cheap side. Realisticly buying a kit probably gonna spend 7k to get it tuned and running good without touching drivetrain or motor.
All that being said talk to modular turbo, or FI look @ master power turbo's, or Turbonetics tc76.
Chris
Even if you go with the ebay kit, add a turbo, injectors, tuning, misc things i would say easily 5 k on the cheap side. Realisticly buying a kit probably gonna spend 7k to get it tuned and running good without touching drivetrain or motor.
All that being said talk to modular turbo, or FI look @ master power turbo's, or Turbonetics tc76.
Chris
12-07-2008, 05:19 PM
#3
+1
I prefer to determine the budget AFTER the build is complete! LOL....
If I spend $10k on my current project, I will tell people that I came in well UNDER my $12k budget, and I will feel better about all the money I spent!
Seriously though,
There is no way you can account for everything you will need for a unique build to the penny up front, but you better up your budget by $5k, or go the nitrous route for now.
If you are planning on just cruising on the street for a while, you might be able to get it rolling for $4k.
BUT, as soon as you hit the track and/or throw some sticky tires on there the trans or rear end will fail soon.
Those items will set you back another $5k-ish.
It is always better to put off the build until you have the cash to do it right as opposed to scrimping on parts which will come back to haunt you later.
The last thing you want is a half assed setup that does not perform well or breaks parts.
The best estimate you could get would be from a member who has built something similar to what you have in mind.
Do some searching on here and PM the owner for the build $$$.
Don't get me wrong, I am "budget" oriented myself.
But for me the term means spending money wisely on the parts that matter the most.
Good luck!
I prefer to determine the budget AFTER the build is complete! LOL....
If I spend $10k on my current project, I will tell people that I came in well UNDER my $12k budget, and I will feel better about all the money I spent!
Seriously though,
There is no way you can account for everything you will need for a unique build to the penny up front, but you better up your budget by $5k, or go the nitrous route for now.
If you are planning on just cruising on the street for a while, you might be able to get it rolling for $4k.
BUT, as soon as you hit the track and/or throw some sticky tires on there the trans or rear end will fail soon.
Those items will set you back another $5k-ish.
It is always better to put off the build until you have the cash to do it right as opposed to scrimping on parts which will come back to haunt you later.
The last thing you want is a half assed setup that does not perform well or breaks parts.
The best estimate you could get would be from a member who has built something similar to what you have in mind.
Do some searching on here and PM the owner for the build $$$.
Don't get me wrong, I am "budget" oriented myself.
But for me the term means spending money wisely on the parts that matter the most.
Good luck!
12-07-2008, 10:04 PM
#4
+1
I prefer to determine the budget AFTER the build is complete! LOL....
If I spend $10k on my current project, I will tell people that I came in well UNDER my $12k budget, and I will feel better about all the money I spent!
Seriously though,
There is no way you can account for everything you will need for a unique build to the penny up front, but you better up your budget by $5k, or go the nitrous route for now.
If you are planning on just cruising on the street for a while, you might be able to get it rolling for $4k.
BUT, as soon as you hit the track and/or throw some sticky tires on there the trans or rear end will fail soon.
Those items will set you back another $5k-ish.
It is always better to put off the build until you have the cash to do it right as opposed to scrimping on parts which will come back to haunt you later.
The last thing you want is a half assed setup that does not perform well or breaks parts.
The best estimate you could get would be from a member who has built something similar to what you have in mind.
Do some searching on here and PM the owner for the build $$$.
Don't get me wrong, I am "budget" oriented myself.
But for me the term means spending money wisely on the parts that matter the most.
Good luck!
I prefer to determine the budget AFTER the build is complete! LOL....
If I spend $10k on my current project, I will tell people that I came in well UNDER my $12k budget, and I will feel better about all the money I spent!
Seriously though,
There is no way you can account for everything you will need for a unique build to the penny up front, but you better up your budget by $5k, or go the nitrous route for now.
If you are planning on just cruising on the street for a while, you might be able to get it rolling for $4k.
BUT, as soon as you hit the track and/or throw some sticky tires on there the trans or rear end will fail soon.
Those items will set you back another $5k-ish.
It is always better to put off the build until you have the cash to do it right as opposed to scrimping on parts which will come back to haunt you later.
The last thing you want is a half assed setup that does not perform well or breaks parts.
The best estimate you could get would be from a member who has built something similar to what you have in mind.
Do some searching on here and PM the owner for the build $$$.
Don't get me wrong, I am "budget" oriented myself.
But for me the term means spending money wisely on the parts that matter the most.
Good luck!
Chris
12-08-2008, 10:56 AM
#5
Unless you can fab everything yourself, get a used/cheaper turbo, and already have a fuel system and other components for the build I dont think $3000 is going to cut it either. Id say get an Nitrous kit, spray a 150-200 shot, and you will be there easily on a higher compression forged 408.
12-08-2008, 11:18 AM
#6
Well if you are not counting the engine, trans, rear end ,clutch or stall, fuel system ,tuning then in pure hardware you could do a kit for this with fabbing and buying like that modular turbo setup or used sts or other used kit. Twin turbo forget it not very likely for any 3000 but single is doable and you can cut corners. the master powers do seem decent for cheap. you can even skip intercooler for now and just run alc injection.
You should use a quality gate and quality blow off. Not knock offs. You can cheap on piping of course. If you run a gravity feed setup you don't need recirc oil pump simpler yet.
So its doable not counting fuel, tuning,trans,rearend or motor costs.
fuel for 600 is pretty cheap..some 60s and a single intank pump maybe a boost a pump think will work for 700 rwhp. Would. need serious twin tank or huge single etc for much past 700rwhp.
Remember you are going to need really good clutch if m6 and built trans and good stall if auto. Stock rearend might live briefly behind an auto. Longer if you dont' track the car and get traction on really sticky tires.
There are few kits out there used. The sts work decent with some tweaking. Been in couple of sts cars an lt1 and ls1. Used procharger setup would be nice also.
Just be careful as many guys have been burned on this forum over last few years buying turbo kits and never recieiving them...me included. I went BIG name this time and it was shipped ahead of promised date. And generally very happy with quality,completeness,fit and finish of the kit and of course power output. So you might want to just save up a bit more and get a twin or something a bit nicer.
On the same not a third gen guy in our car club did up an ebay type of setup with master power t70 and he has run 11.2 at 126mph with a built 383 think it is .Not too shabby and more in it. So the budget builds can be done.
You should use a quality gate and quality blow off. Not knock offs. You can cheap on piping of course. If you run a gravity feed setup you don't need recirc oil pump simpler yet.
So its doable not counting fuel, tuning,trans,rearend or motor costs.
fuel for 600 is pretty cheap..some 60s and a single intank pump maybe a boost a pump think will work for 700 rwhp. Would. need serious twin tank or huge single etc for much past 700rwhp.
Remember you are going to need really good clutch if m6 and built trans and good stall if auto. Stock rearend might live briefly behind an auto. Longer if you dont' track the car and get traction on really sticky tires.
There are few kits out there used. The sts work decent with some tweaking. Been in couple of sts cars an lt1 and ls1. Used procharger setup would be nice also.
Just be careful as many guys have been burned on this forum over last few years buying turbo kits and never recieiving them...me included. I went BIG name this time and it was shipped ahead of promised date. And generally very happy with quality,completeness,fit and finish of the kit and of course power output. So you might want to just save up a bit more and get a twin or something a bit nicer.
On the same not a third gen guy in our car club did up an ebay type of setup with master power t70 and he has run 11.2 at 126mph with a built 383 think it is .Not too shabby and more in it. So the budget builds can be done.
12-09-2008, 08:39 AM
#7
I am building a 408 for the street and strip for my 99Ta m6. I cant decide how to hit my goal. My goal is 600 /700 at the tire . I would love to turbo it but there hardly any room under the hood. I have thought about buying the ebay kit and cutting the T4 flange of and welding a T6 flange. I have about 3000 to build a forced induction kit . What kink of turbo would I use for a 408 ci ? What kind of kit ?
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12-09-2008, 09:52 AM
#8
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Also keep in mind it all the small stuff that will tack a grand on the build easy IE: all of your -AN fittings @ $25-45 ea, braided line, hooking your down pipe to your exhaust, clamps, T bolt clamps, hangers, silicone couplers, rerouted radiator hoses and heater hoses, a different air filter set up, header wrap, heat shields, wiring connectors, bolts, and all the other little stuff. Just keep that in mind. Seems like every build I am out picking up some small stuff and it all adds up. G
Last edited by jfg455; 12-09-2008 at 09:58 AM.