Automotive News, Media & Press - Nurburgring in USA?! Replica proposed for Vegas area.

http://www.gizmag.com/nurburgring-replica-las-vegas/21801/

Replica of iconic Nurburgring racetrack proposed for Las Vegas
By Chris Weiss

13:15 March 13, 2012

Germany's Nurburgring is possibly the most famous racetrack in the entire world. Not only does it host racing competitions, but it also provides the ultimate testing grounds for new cars and prototypes - manufacturers from around the world travel to Germany to test their cars. Speedway Motorsports wants to make some of those journeys a little shorter, by building an exact replica of Nurburgring just outside of Las Vegas.


The United States has plenty of racetracks of its own - in fact, Speedway operates eight of them - but it doesn't have anything the caliber of Nurburgring, largely considered one of the most difficult racetracks in the world thanks to about 16 miles (26 km) of twisting, hilly terrain. Unlike the enclosed stadium tracks in the US, Nurburgring is integrated into its rolling, wooded surroundings and even has a 12th century castle located inside its perimeter. So, it's like quintessential European countryside bottled up into one of the world's most demanding pieces of asphalt - it's no wonder it is famous the world over.


Speedway may not be able to duplicate the history or ambiance of the original racetrack, but it does plan to duplicate the turns and features of the track itself. Its track would be an exact replica of the original, located on 8,000 acres (3237.5 hectares) of land about 10 miles (16 km) from its existing Las Vegas Motor Speedway. The company doesn't have any plans to hold racing events at the proposed track - that's kind of what Las Vegas Speedway does - but the track would take on the role of a test bed for manufacturers and car owners, providing a much closer destination for US-based entities.

In a recent interview with Sirius XM Sports, Speedway CEO Bruton Smith said that he's already been in talks with Nevada's governor, the Bureau of Land Management and several German contacts, who are presumably connected to or knowledgeable about the original track. If the project gets the go-ahead, Smith and company plan to work closely with German engineers, using photographs, aerial topography and other resources to replicate every curve and hill to a T.

Las Vegas seems like the perfect destination for a faux 'Ring. The city already has a history of both motorsports and the cloning of iconic European destinations like the Eiffel Tower and Colosseum. The greater state of Nevada has more public land than any other state except Alaska, so it's not like there's a lack of space.

While the dry, hot Nevada desert may contrast the Eifel Mountains where the original Nurburgring is located, it could work well for auto manufacturers. Manufacturers could conceivably use the track for hot-weather testing as well as performance testing. Smith even believes that German manufacturers like Audi and Mercedes-Benz would come overseas to use the track, because a Vegas location would allow for year-round testing, whereas the actual Nurburgring experiences cold, snowy winters.

Source: Autoguide, Sirius XM

:usa: that would be amazing to see

Please let this happen. Please.

Badass

Let us all pray that this will happen.

If this happens I would seriously consider moving out west.

F1 track, now this possibly? Ballin outa control

I fully support motorsports as a hobby and/or a way of life but this is a huge waste of money IMO.

This would be very cool if it were to actually happen. :nod:

Never ever happen

...and the number of automotive related deaths rises.

Any proposed final construction costs? Making a 15 mile road, not that big of a deal. Making an exact copy of a 15 mile hilly, curvy racetrack that's across the world....eh something different.

I hope somebody gave them a rough number on building it. My god would that be expensive, the payback would be decades if not a century.

...and the number of automotive related deaths rises.

Compared to what the amount of deaths that occur drag racing or street racing? I don't think so.

Slim chance of it happening. Unless they could get some donations from big corps who could use it.

But even GM has their own proving grounds and access to any number of tracks here...they still go to the Ring for bragging rights. It's a marketing thing more than a "proves something" thing.

"Build it....and they will come" - Bruton Smith 2012

BTW - Since it'll be an exact replica, will you still have to speak German? 'Cuz I no sprechen....

Compared to what the amount of deaths that occur drag racing or street racing? I don't think so.



I do. There are always people that over estimate their abilities...and if driving on the ring is as easy as driving in a straight line, road racing/auto cross would probly be more popular...and most of the tracks we have are not even on the same level of difficulty that Nurburg has.

Basically saying the weekend enthusiast cane go drag on the weekend with little danger. You get an inexperienced driver on the ring with other drivers and the chance for an accident rises. I would love to drive the ring, but when you don't know anything about the other people next to you, I wouldn't be so sure.

Eh, I hope it doesn't happen. What they should do instead is make a different track that's comparative in nature, but not an exact replica.

Should be expensive as hell to build! I don't think it will ever happen.

It will never be an exact replica anyway because Im sure the altitude and air will be completely different. Also, with the track surface being brand new (and probably at least slightly different) im betting times will greatly vary compared to the track in Nurburg.

I will run it if it's built :D I do damn good on that track on Forza so i gotta be a pro huh? haha

I do. There are always people that over estimate their abilities...and if driving on the ring is as easy as driving in a straight line, road racing/auto cross would probly be more popular...and most of the tracks we have are not even on the same level of difficulty that Nurburg has.

Basically saying the weekend enthusiast cane go drag on the weekend with little danger. You get an inexperienced driver on the ring with other drivers and the chance for an accident rises. I would love to drive the ring, but when you don't know anything about the other people next to you, I wouldn't be so sure.

Very true, the Ring by design utilizes a very different driving style. There was an article about that in one of my many car magazines I read. It was saving how it not uncommon to see beater cheap weekend cars driven by "ringers" to be blowing the doors off tourist and newbies in cars that are much faster over all.

it would be better if we could come up with our own badass track that really tests drivers and have its own original name, we shouldnt have to copy the germans. lets be original

I was thinking that myself. Kind of a rip-off, lets the German's have their famed Nurburgring and us have our own crazy ass track. Make it even more intense and insane so IT becomes the new test bed for everything. Wouldn't that tick everyone off.

I was thinking that myself. Kind of a rip-off, lets the German's have their famed Nurburgring and us have our own crazy ass track. Make it even more intense and insane so IT becomes the new test bed for everything. Wouldn't that tick everyone off.

Not sure that's possible :lol:

Not sure that's possible :lol:

Defiantly not enough elevation changes to rival the ring in that category haha, but perhaps just some super tricky corner set ups :D

I would love to take a ride in the "ring taxi" to fully experience that what that road is like. They say some of those turns have you practically staring straight up into the sky as you crest the hills :eek2:

Defiantly not enough elevation changes to rival the ring in that category haha, but perhaps just some super tricky corner set ups :D

I would love to take a ride in the "ring taxi" to fully experience that what that road is like. They say some of those turns have you practically staring straight up into the sky as you crest the hills :eek2:

I know Vegas is basically flat
elevation changes are a real test of driver and machine

Anyhow why do we need the ring in the USA?
we have awesome tracks like
Leguna Seca, Road Atlanta, Pikes Peak

I know Vegas is basically flat
elevation changes are a real test of driver and machine

Anyhow why do we need the ring in the USA?
we have awesome tracks like
Leguna Seca, Road Atlanta, Pikes Peak

We don't have any tracks LIKE the Ring though. Nothing that tests cars and drivers like that.

Look up Travis Prastrana when he breaks the record
at Pikes Peak and tell me we don't have anything on the Ring

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IdXJYc4CpXA

Look up Travis Prastrana when he breaks the record
at Pikes Peak and tell me we don't have anything on the Ring

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IdXJYc4CpXA

Like I said, there is nothing like the Nurburgring anywhere else in the world. Pikes Peak is awesome, but not the same.

Should be pretty sweet! I was wondering when someone was going to build an American version of the ring

I still don't see why people make such a big deal about the ring.
There are better tracks than the ring.

Isle Man TT for one.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QVXc29ZgutI

I still don't see why people make such a big deal about the ring.
There are better tracks than the ring.

Isle Man TT for one.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QVXc29ZgutI

Also a great track. Also very much in the spirit of the Nurburgring, and something we have nothing similar to in this country.

Are you implying the Ring is the top dog because it is such a hard coarse to race on or because it's old and winds thru Medevil towns and castles?

Because Europe is like how many hundreds of years older than the USA?
How would we have race tracks that wind thru castles and hundreds of year old towns

Besides the people in the USA are so tight a$$ed about racing and wanting to sue everybody for every little stupid thing no one would even consider doing something like that over here.

I have nothing against the Ring, it's a cool track but when I watch people racing on there I don't get that ooh tinglely feeling like it's the $hit like you are making it out to be and all the German car makers make it out to be. And that all the American car builders should spend thousands of dollars shipping our cars over there to test on that track. Actaully when I watch the video of cars racing on the ring it looks rather boring. It's just a super long ass track with mainly lots of high speed turns, imo not a whole lot of 100 to 0, 0 back up to 100 type turns, no negative camber down hill sweepers, I mean even Laguna Seca which is a lot smaller and tighter of a track I feel has more technical and harder turns.

There are a lot of good tracks in the USA, ones with crazy and technical turns
ones with crazy ass elevation rises and drops. Where when the guy racing on them goes ripping thru your heart is stopping when you watch the guy go over the rise or down the chicane into some crazy corkscrew or something. Like when you watch them race and you just feel something epic is taking place I just don't get that with the Ring.

Road Atlanta
Infineon Raceway
Virginia International Raceway
Watkins Glen
Mazda Raceway Laguna Seca
Road America

Have you actually raced on or seen races or videos of any of these tracks?

Are you implying the Ring is the top dog because it is such a hard coarse to race on or because it's old and winds thru Medevil towns and castles?

Because Europe is like how many hundreds of years older than the USA?
How would we have race tracks that wind thru castles and hundreds of year old towns

Besides the people in the USA are so tight a$$ed about racing and wanting to sue everybody for every little stupid thing no one would even consider doing something like that over here.

I have nothing against the Ring, it's a cool track but when I watch people racing on there I don't get that ooh tinglely feeling like it's the $hit like you are making it out to be and all the German car makers make it out to be. And that all the American car builders should spend thousands of dollars shipping our cars over there to test on that track. Actaully when I watch the video of cars racing on the ring it looks rather boring. It's just a super long ass track with mainly lots of high speed turns, imo not a whole lot of 100 to 0, 0 back up to 100 type turns, no negative camber down hill sweepers, I mean even Laguna Seca which is a lot smaller and tighter of a track I feel has more technical and harder turns.

There are a lot of good tracks in the USA, ones with crazy and technical turns
ones with crazy ass elevation rises and drops. Where when the guy racing on them goes ripping thru your heart is stopping when you watch the guy go over the rise or down the chicane into some crazy corkscrew or something. Like when you watch them race and you just feel something epic is taking place I just don't get that with the Ring.

Road Atlanta
Infineon Raceway
Virginia International Raceway
Watkins Glen
Mazda Raceway Laguna Seca
Road America

Have you actually raced on or seen races or videos of any of these tracks?
I'm tired of repeating myself, so I'll just say a nice blanket "yes."

I'll take over:
From what I know there is no 12mile track with 100+ turns with various elevation changes in the US.

Isle of Man is nice but goes through towns and is not a 24/7 track that can be used as such...

Pikes peak is more of a really long WRC special stage. very little more.

The ring is a track that is a actual race track and is also a highly demanding long course with MANY different types of corners with massive elivation changes. There is no place yet that replicates the dedicated race course type experiance with all of the things the ring offers.

Yes the isle of man is a great track for TT but isnt available 24/7 for racing.

Plus it terms of complexity.

here is the 30 somthing mile ISLE OF MAN course
http://www.etracksonline.co.uk/Europe/IoM/isleofmanTT_map.gif

Here is the shorter(but still VERY long) Nurburgring course... More corners less hilly straightaways.
http://www.etracksonline.co.uk/Europe/Germany/nurburgring-nord_map.gif

Nuf said I am excited to hear about a US copy, even if a cheap rip off of the original.

Man you guys really buy the hype of the ring.

We don't even need to build a replica. Just close off
Tail of the Dragon at Deals Gap, NC and we would instantly have
our very own Nurburgring.

See that would be GREAT. But they wont do it. Too many lawyers and estrogen in this country. Period. One of the few places that isnt as true is vegas.

hardest part is going to be elevation changes.

Take the tail of the dragon or any of the great mountain pass roads in this country and build them into a nice 12-20 mile loop and youll be good. But its about where and who would say ok.

NIMBY will come up pretty much anywhere.

Isle of Man is nice but goes through towns and is not a 24/7 track that can be used as such...

Pikes peak is more of a really long WRC special stage. very little more.

The ring is a track that is a actual race track and is also a highly demanding long course with MANY different types of corners with massive elivation changes. There is no place yet that replicates the dedicated race course type experiance with all of the things the ring offers.

Yes the isle of man is a great track for TT but isnt available 24/7 for racing.

Plus it terms of complexity.

here is the 30 somthing mile ISLE OF MAN course
http://www.etracksonline.co.uk/Europe/IoM/isleofmanTT_map.gif

Here is the shorter(but still VERY long) Nurburgring course... More corners less hilly straightaways.
http://www.etracksonline.co.uk/Europe/Germany/nurburgring-nord_map.gif

Nuf said I am excited to hear about a US copy, even if a cheap rip off of the original.

I feel the same way you do. The ring is on my bucketlist, but doign it here would be fine with me.

However, the amount of money to replicate it would be very challenging. Earth moving, elevation changes, and exact corners would make for a nightmare on cost.

My ideal dream would be a motorsports venue that had ALL of these at one location:
long, technical road course track (13+ turns, a few LONG stretches)
3-4 turn banked oval 1.5-2 miles in length
1/4 mile drag strip
Stand mile drag strip
Autocross, and skidpad course
cart course

Some places I have been have some of the above, but not everything. I would love to test my car in the same day at a round course, 1/4 mile, and standing mile.

CTSVBiggie,

Nurburgring is not even a real race track either
in that you can't race side by side so can anyone even
really say that the Ring is a real race track.

It's a TT track just like the Isle of Man

Also I beg to differ with you about the comlexity.

Look at two videos of people running on them both
and you will see a totally different picture as to which one
is more complex.

Again I didn't say the Ring was a bad track. Just don't see
what all the hype that everyone makes it out to be as the track of all tracks.

Again to the blanket statement guy
just have anyone who is unbiased look at the videos of Travis at Pikes Peak and one of your best of the ring (Ferrari 599, Nissan GT-R, Porsche GT-2, whatever).

When the video is done ask that person what was more impressive the Ring or TP going up Pikes Peak.

Rather yet,
post up the link of your best video you got on the Ring and
I will start a new thread with a poll just to see what people think.

Take the tail of the dragon or any of the great mountain pass roads in this country and build them into a nice 12-20 mile loop and youll be good. But its about where and who would say ok.

NIMBY will come up pretty much anywhere.

4am runs make this a reality! :)

4am runs make this a reality! :)

that's what I am saying.

we have the roads, it's the people and the politics
that will keep it from ever happening.

the Ring is basically not even a two lane road...so of course it's going
to look bad ass...hell if I am ripping thru a one lane road in a cemetary it would look bad ass too.

Lol, don't make me bring up the Indy 500 :usa:

Nurburgring is not even a real race track either


Orly? Tell that to the countless race series that took place there..

Orly? Tell that to the countless race series that took place there..

Settle down there...side by side racing

It is more a Time Trials type of race track.

Racing is a lot different when you run side by side along with
other people anything can happen.

Side by side? Are you a nascar fan or something. Proper race tracks have one proper line. And passes have to be made in proper areas. No you will never see a set of cars going into a turn three abreast. But you will see em go two if someones trying to make a pass.


Pikes peak is a point to point race, kinda hard to LAP it.

There are other places they could replicate. IMO take a little from each and make your OWN ring... DO it original using noteable corners from around the world. Cork screw with a carousel to enter it sounds PERFECT..

I am a fan of racing, any kind of racing, be it even a foot race. :punch:

I like the Ring, but it is kind of boring when you watch it. I mean how long can you watch car after car pulling a time trial racing the clock. The Ring from what I understand back in the 70's used to be more side by side racing. Nowadays it's more of a test track for car manufacturers to boast about who got the fastest lap. And even then that is biased because the Germans have been testing there for ever so they do know that place like the back of their hands. So if you want to measure everything up you have to get the Stig and race all the cars on there on the same day.

To me the best part about watching racing is when people can pass each other and how they fight it out thru the twisties and when they hold the pedal down and pray they don't hit someone while going thru a wall of black cloud because his pit crew told him to stay high after a colision. Now that's something to watch.

I still say the Ring doesn't hold a candle to someone racing up the peak where they can go flying over the cliff at any moment and of the Isle of Man TT where there is danger lurking in every turn.

Side by side? Are you a nascar fan or something. Proper race tracks have one proper line. And passes have to be made in proper areas. No you will never see a set of cars going into a turn three abreast. But you will see em go two if someones trying to make a pass.


Pikes peak is a point to point race, kinda hard to LAP it.

There are other places they could replicate. IMO take a little from each and make your OWN ring... DO it original using noteable corners from around the world. Cork screw with a carousel to enter it sounds PERFECT..

This is why there is RALLY racing and CIRCUIT racing.

the Ring is basically the best CIRCUIT there is. Pikes peak and a lot of those others are more RALLY stages than circuit racing.

Is this enogh racing for you?
http://images.thecarconnection.com/lrg/porsche-at-the-2011-nurburgring-24-hours_100354206_l.jpg
http://porschebahn.files.wordpress.com/2011/06/2011-nc3bcrburgring-24-hour-1.jpg
http://www.eurocarnews.com/media/pictorials/1420/6751.jpg

There are two circuits, one is the GP loop and the other is Northern loop which nothing more than a toll road with no speed limit.

Since your arguing the fact that there are many smaller technically demanding tracks this is true, but the ability to sting together several blind turns and high speed is different but certainly not easier.

Now is there several excellent tracks in the USA that are very tough: YES
Is there alot of hype surrounding the Nordschleife: YES
Is it one of a kind: TOTALLY


I DO believe part of the hype is with the manufacturing testing that goes on there now days. But, why is this bad? If it leads to better vehicals being produced I have no problem with it.

I don't think it's the holy grail of all thing automotive, but I don't think that watching a video or playing a video game does it justice. Part of what makes the Nordschleife so special is the fact that you can just drive up, buy a ticket, and rock and roll. No waviers, no tech inspection, no bullshit. You wreck yourself you pay for the tow, you wreck someone else, your paying for it. I think its one of the few places on earth that its just pure automotive bliss.

It's these things that make the ring special, there is a forum just for Ringer's and they tell everyone on there that asking if they should make the trip, that they were all skeptics; and you really do just have to drive it to understand.

There are two circuits, one is the GP loop and the other is Northern loop which nothing more than a toll road with no speed limit.

Since your arguing the fact that there are many smaller technically demanding tracks this is true, but the ability to sting together several blind turns and high speed is different but certainly not easier.

Now is there several excellent tracks in the USA that are very tough: YES
Is there alot of hype surrounding the Nordschleife: YES
Is it one of a kind: TOTALLY


I DO believe part of the hype is with the manufacturing testing that goes on there now days. But, why is this bad? If it leads to better vehicals being produced I have no problem with it.

I don't think it's the holy grail of all thing automotive, but I don't think that watching a video or playing a video game does it justice. Part of what makes the Nordschleife so special is the fact that you can just drive up, buy a ticket, and rock and roll. No waviers, no tech inspection, no bullshit. You wreck yourself you pay for the tow, you wreck someone else, your paying for it. I think its one of the few places on earth that its just pure automotive bliss.

It's these things that make the ring special, there is a forum just for Ringer's and they tell everyone on there that asking if they should make the trip, that they were all skeptics; and you really do just have to drive it to understand.

Need to quote this just to make sure people read it atleast ONCE.

CTSVBiggie,

Nurburgring is not even a real race track either
in that you can't race side by side so can anyone even
really say that the Ring is a real race track.

It's a TT track just like the Isle of Man

Also I beg to differ with you about the comlexity.

Look at two videos of people running on them both
and you will see a totally different picture as to which one
is more complex.

Again I didn't say the Ring was a bad track. Just don't see
what all the hype that everyone makes it out to be as the track of all tracks.

Again to the blanket statement guy
just have anyone who is unbiased look at the videos of Travis at Pikes Peak and one of your best of the ring (Ferrari 599, Nissan GT-R, Porsche GT-2, whatever).

When the video is done ask that person what was more impressive the Ring or TP going up Pikes Peak.

Rather yet,
post up the link of your best video you got on the Ring and
I will start a new thread with a poll just to see what people think.

I do not understand why you keep trying to argue with me. I am stating factual information, not my opinion. There simply are no tracks in America like the Nurburgring. Do we have great tracks? Absolutely. But we don't have any 13+ mile tracks with that many turns and varied surface materials. Elevation changes, blind corners, fast sweepers, LONG straightaways... That's just how it is man.

I do not understand why you keep trying to argue with me. I am stating factual information, not my opinion. There simply are no tracks in America like the Nurburgring. Do we have great tracks? Absolutely. But we don't have any 13+ mile tracks with that many turns and varied surface materials. Elevation changes, blind corners, fast sweepers, LONG straightaways... That's just how it is man.

Can't argue the facts. This list of things IS why the manufactures pick the ring to test their performance models weather the time battle is hype or not. There is no other place on earth (IMO) where a car can be confronted with so many different types or situations, that are testing different characteristics, in a short distance.

While yes slower tighter technical based tracks will test balance and turn in ability that is only one small percent of whats needed to develop a vehicle. Since the Nordschleife is such a higher speed track there is more to gained from testing there as its harder on brakes, the elevation changes are tough on suspension components. Not to mention high speed sweepers and directional changes go much further to demonstrate overall balance and turn in ability as its much harder for 3000+ pounds of rolling metal to change direction at 140 than it is at 60.