Thinking out loud.
04-12-2005, 08:44 AM
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Thinking out loud. The other day I was sitting at work, and my mind began to wonder.
Because I'm impressed with Ryan's results, I was thinking about Turbos. And of course since I'm cheap and can't spend that much money how to get one cheaper...and here is what I came up with:
Why not use a turbo from a salvage yard off of a newer deisel pickup. Seems like I see more and more diesel pickups each day, so more and more have to be showing up at the salvage and being ripe for picking.
I haven't looked into the specifics, but I would think a turbo is a turbo regardless if it is on a gas or deisel engine. Also, I don't know what size of turbo they're using on these engines, but I'm guessing it should be in an appropriate size since they're generally used on big v8 diesel (yeah, except the Dodge). Another issue is the BOV and other turbo plumbing/control issues that you may or may not beable to get from the donor vehicle.
Overall though I think it would be interesting to know if people have done this before, if it can be done, and what it takes. I guess maybe I'll have to do a little research to see if it can be done.
What is everyone elses thoughts on this?
Because I'm impressed with Ryan's results, I was thinking about Turbos. And of course since I'm cheap and can't spend that much money how to get one cheaper...and here is what I came up with:
Why not use a turbo from a salvage yard off of a newer deisel pickup. Seems like I see more and more diesel pickups each day, so more and more have to be showing up at the salvage and being ripe for picking.
I haven't looked into the specifics, but I would think a turbo is a turbo regardless if it is on a gas or deisel engine. Also, I don't know what size of turbo they're using on these engines, but I'm guessing it should be in an appropriate size since they're generally used on big v8 diesel (yeah, except the Dodge). Another issue is the BOV and other turbo plumbing/control issues that you may or may not beable to get from the donor vehicle.
Overall though I think it would be interesting to know if people have done this before, if it can be done, and what it takes. I guess maybe I'll have to do a little research to see if it can be done.
What is everyone elses thoughts on this?
04-12-2005, 09:24 AM
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One concern I would have about using a deisel turbo on a gas application would be if it would be able to keep up in the upper RPM ranges. Most deisels that I have seen don't get above 3,500 - 4,000 rpm, so a turbo that can keep a 6 or 7 liter deisel happy at 3,750 rpm may or may not be able to keep up with a similarly sized gas engine running 6,000+ rpm. something to look into before jumping in with both feet.
04-12-2005, 09:49 AM
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IMO I would by one from a person used. I think there is way to many variables to just buy one and make it work. Brackets, fuel pump, injectors, tuning (a\f meter, a real one, don't know if you could get it with a used kit), again the brackets and plumbing will all be one off custom.
The big question is used kit = turbo from another used vehicle + fabrication work and all other things that go with it.
All estimated prices...
Used Turbo=?
Injectors = $350
Fuel pump = $400
Custom Plumbing & Fabricating brackets etc. = $1000
Total $1750
Then will it work correctly, no other real live resources from other to learn from etc..
May get a used one for that price made for the car.
I understand what you are saying, basically 4-5 grand for an expensive compressor.
I just not that adventurous.
The big question is used kit = turbo from another used vehicle + fabrication work and all other things that go with it.
All estimated prices...
Used Turbo=?
Injectors = $350
Fuel pump = $400
Custom Plumbing & Fabricating brackets etc. = $1000
Total $1750
Then will it work correctly, no other real live resources from other to learn from etc..
May get a used one for that price made for the car.
I understand what you are saying, basically 4-5 grand for an expensive compressor.
I just not that adventurous. Last edited by Todd2001SS; 04-12-2005 at 10:01 AM.
04-12-2005, 10:05 AM
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Well, a turbo is not just a turbo. They are tailored to specific engine consumption and hp requirements, rpms etc... If you want to get serious, I'd consider picking up a book called "Maxium Boost" by Corky Bell. It's somewhat biased on some issues, but overall it's pretty good reading from a beginner standpoint.
The diesel turbo's are better suited to 4 cyl. engines because they're designed to spool up quickly up to their maximum efficiency and operating range. Plus, most of the diesel turbo's (unless you're talking about big rig turbos) will only support around 500hp on gasoline powered engines. A good heads/cam LS1 will make that much.
If you're looking into a junkyard turbo system, you'd be better off doing a twin turbo system. Most junkyard turbo's you'll find won't support more than 350hp each, so two of them is required for a V8 airflow requirements.
Recirculation valves and wastegates can both be found on stock vehicles too. If you go with a twin system, the newer turbo's usually use an internal wastegate, so that is another benefit to twins. Lot's of turbo powered factory cars use recirulation valves. I'd recomend a 1st gen DSM recirc valve because they're still readily available in the boneyards and they'll hold up to 17psi in stock form.
Hope that helps some.
Mike
The diesel turbo's are better suited to 4 cyl. engines because they're designed to spool up quickly up to their maximum efficiency and operating range. Plus, most of the diesel turbo's (unless you're talking about big rig turbos) will only support around 500hp on gasoline powered engines. A good heads/cam LS1 will make that much.
If you're looking into a junkyard turbo system, you'd be better off doing a twin turbo system. Most junkyard turbo's you'll find won't support more than 350hp each, so two of them is required for a V8 airflow requirements.
Recirculation valves and wastegates can both be found on stock vehicles too. If you go with a twin system, the newer turbo's usually use an internal wastegate, so that is another benefit to twins. Lot's of turbo powered factory cars use recirulation valves. I'd recomend a 1st gen DSM recirc valve because they're still readily available in the boneyards and they'll hold up to 17psi in stock form.
Hope that helps some.
Mike
04-12-2005, 11:53 AM
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yeah, I need to do a lot more checking. The idea just came to me, and I threw it out there. I'll probably need to do some reading of books, searching on the internet, and more digging. From a design standpoint, the hardest thing is going to be finding the specs for an oem turbo....but I guess we'll see what I can find.
I think the fabrication and trouble shooting will be the fun part of it.
I think the fabrication and trouble shooting will be the fun part of it.
04-12-2005, 02:27 PM
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I used to work at peterbuilt. I asked my self this same question.(with my discount the turbo would have beeen a couple hundred new)After bugging the guys at cummins and varies other turbo manufactors I came up with a dead end. the turbos for a v8 truck will not fit into the limited space a f-body has. if i modified the inlet of the turbo to fit the exhaust/headers of the car the turbo would be ineffective. poor air volume and overheating of said component.Just figured i would throw my 2 cents in.