Thoughts/opinions on Roadrunner LS1 Emulator?
09-23-2006, 05:29 PM
#1
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Thoughts/opinions on Roadrunner LS1 Emulator? This looks like the only way to go and if HPT doesn't get on board then EFIlive has trumped, BIG TIME. Nov. GM High-Tech Mag. Thoughts/opinions??
09-23-2006, 07:32 PM
#3
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The Road Runner makes tuning a real breeze being able to operate on ALL tables in real time and not a subset is what sets this product ahead of the rest
Often Imitated But Never Duplicated!!!!!!
Often Imitated But Never Duplicated!!!!!!
09-23-2006, 08:02 PM
#5
HPT can't and won't, you'll be waiting for a long time. There is an agreement between EFILive/Tuner Cat and it WILL not include HPT. End of story. HPT offers a semi-quasi "real time" tuning option that is very limited but works for some (limited tables, not a true RT solution) It is a apples to oranges comparison between the two. Everyone that has had the opportunity to use the Moates Road Runner and then try HPT's stresses the advantages of the Road Runner are invaluable. If you are interested in a genuine "real time" tuning solution, the moates is the only way to go. Even the owners of HPT will tell you that they don't compare but they honestly had no other options. Just like most everything when dealing in this hobby, you get what you pay for.
09-23-2006, 08:34 PM
#6
I use the Roadrunner with EFI Live on my car all the time and the other night I got to use HPT's real time tuning. The Roadrunner works in the tuner where HPT's real time tuning works in the scanner which makes it a PITA to have to copy back to the tuner. I have full access to anything in the PCM with the Roadrunner where you are vary limited on what you can change with HPT. Also with EFILive there is a feature that allows you to copy and fill for the hard to get cells where HPT doesn't seem to offer this. While it is a nice feature for some, it really is apples to oranges between the two.
09-23-2006, 08:40 PM
#7
I have several of the Roadrunners and they are a life saver on time. Now that im spoiled i would never go back. There are just so many tables that you need to tweak to get 100% drivability, I like the fact that i can change any table in the pcm at any time instantly when i enter that perameter, or i can press one button and make it only put into the roadrunner when i press the program button. It is also nice when i can flash a whole computer in less than 18 seconds for a full write and a partial right is less than 5. 
Ive definatly gotten my moneys worth out of them for sure. It was the best $599 i ever spent for my tuning stuff.
Ive definatly gotten my moneys worth out of them for sure. It was the best $599 i ever spent for my tuning stuff. Trending Topics
09-23-2006, 08:56 PM
#8
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To give you an idea of how much time can be saved with this, I had a fairly noticable buck in one of the M6 cars i was tuning.
I put it in first gear (worst noticable) and drove off leaving it in gear and at idle, then started changing afr's and spark till it stopped bucking.
Took all of 5 mins or less with probably 20+ variables changed all up.
Without it it would off taken over 1/2 hour or more due to having to stop car, reflash, start, drive off, verify it improved or not, then repeat.
Absolute time saver.
Top peice of kit.
I put it in first gear (worst noticable) and drove off leaving it in gear and at idle, then started changing afr's and spark till it stopped bucking.
Took all of 5 mins or less with probably 20+ variables changed all up.
Without it it would off taken over 1/2 hour or more due to having to stop car, reflash, start, drive off, verify it improved or not, then repeat.
Absolute time saver.
Top peice of kit.
09-23-2006, 09:47 PM
#11
I see that you have an aluminum flywheel so what I'm going to tell you will be especially valuable. My tune used to be spot-on until I made one change to my car...I added a 16 lb lighter clutch and flywheel. Instantly, my car went from having a great tune to a crappy tune. My car would die when I'd clutch in, the idle was unstable and the street manners became awful...all from reduced weight from the clutch and flywheel...go figure.
I spent over 4 weeks trying to get the car back to where it was before. I must have spent 40 hours in the car logging and flashed the program over 100 times. Still not working right.
Then I got my roadrunner. Instantly I could make airflow changes to my idle tables, throttle cracker, throttle follower, spark tables, you name it. Within hours (not days) my car was well behaved again. Having real-time tuning allowed me to try out things I'd never consider. Interestingly, many of the odd-ball things I tried worked wonders. Without real-time feedback, I could have never gotten my street manners back to where they needed to be.
Some of the coolest features of the Roadrunner are the bubbles that pop up in your tuning software that show you which cell you're currently in. When you see the cell highlighted, you can change that one cell and instantly get the feedback on whether it helped or not. I found this especially useful when setting up the throttle follower tables and throttle cracker tables.
Now when I clutch in, regardless of speed, my rpm sticks to idle speed. My idle is rock solid. I even was able to trim my cruise A/F ratio on the fly to get better gas mileage while monitoring my wide-band. Yes, the real-time tuning capabilities are time savers for sure, but in my case, they were also life savers...I didn't have to kill my car, LOL!
I give the Roadrunner a 10 on a scale of 1 to 10!
I spent over 4 weeks trying to get the car back to where it was before. I must have spent 40 hours in the car logging and flashed the program over 100 times. Still not working right.
Then I got my roadrunner. Instantly I could make airflow changes to my idle tables, throttle cracker, throttle follower, spark tables, you name it. Within hours (not days) my car was well behaved again. Having real-time tuning allowed me to try out things I'd never consider. Interestingly, many of the odd-ball things I tried worked wonders. Without real-time feedback, I could have never gotten my street manners back to where they needed to be.
Some of the coolest features of the Roadrunner are the bubbles that pop up in your tuning software that show you which cell you're currently in. When you see the cell highlighted, you can change that one cell and instantly get the feedback on whether it helped or not. I found this especially useful when setting up the throttle follower tables and throttle cracker tables.
Now when I clutch in, regardless of speed, my rpm sticks to idle speed. My idle is rock solid. I even was able to trim my cruise A/F ratio on the fly to get better gas mileage while monitoring my wide-band. Yes, the real-time tuning capabilities are time savers for sure, but in my case, they were also life savers...I didn't have to kill my car, LOL!
I give the Roadrunner a 10 on a scale of 1 to 10!
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2013 Corvette Grand Sport A6 LME forged 416, Greg Good ported TFS 255 LS3 heads, 222/242 .629"/.604" 121LSA Pat G blower cam, ARH 1 7/8" headers, ESC Novi 1500 Supercharger w/8 rib direct drive conversion, 747rwhp/709rwtq on 93 octane, 801rwhp/735rwtq on race fuel, 10.1 @ 147.25mph 1/4 mile, 174.7mph Half Mile.
2016 Corvette Z51 M7 Magnuson Heartbeat 2300 supercharger, TSP LT headers, Pat G tuned, 667rwhp, 662rwtq, 191mph TX Mile.
2009.5 Pontiac G8 GT 6.0L, A6, AFR 230v2 heads. 506rwhp/442rwtq. 11.413 @ 121.29mph 1/4 mile, 168.7mph TX Mile
2000 Pewter Ram Air Trans Am M6 heads/cam 508 rwhp/445 rwtq SAE, 183.092 TX Mile
2018 Cadillac Escalade 6.2L A10 Pat G tuned.
LS1,LS2,LS3,LS7,LT1 Custom Camshaft Specialist For custom camshaft help press here.
Custom LSX tuning in person or via email press here.
09-23-2006, 10:26 PM
#13
GMW if you already havent heard hptuners has their own version called RTT which can be found here http://www.hptuners.com/articles/070206/ for most vehicles it can tune
VE, VE vs TPS multiplyer, PE, MAF, Spark, Idle spark, Target idle speed, Base running airflow, iac steps vs effective area, throttle cracker, throttle follower, o2 switch points, etc.
The roadrunner may be able to tune all 500 or so available parameters, but do you really need to tune your rev limiter in real time? Or fan settings? or speed limiter? The bottom line is RTT is a cost effective(1 credit@$49 for 1 bar SD or 1 bar MAF) and effective way to real time tune a vehicle. I use it on EVERY vehicle I tune now because it really does make tuning a breeze.
Oh did I mention theres no need to swap pcm's? Its just a simple write entire process which takes less then 2 minutes in most cases
VE, VE vs TPS multiplyer, PE, MAF, Spark, Idle spark, Target idle speed, Base running airflow, iac steps vs effective area, throttle cracker, throttle follower, o2 switch points, etc.
The roadrunner may be able to tune all 500 or so available parameters, but do you really need to tune your rev limiter in real time? Or fan settings? or speed limiter? The bottom line is RTT is a cost effective(1 credit@$49 for 1 bar SD or 1 bar MAF) and effective way to real time tune a vehicle. I use it on EVERY vehicle I tune now because it really does make tuning a breeze.
Oh did I mention theres no need to swap pcm's? Its just a simple write entire process which takes less then 2 minutes in most cases
09-24-2006, 12:01 AM
#14
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Thanks, foff I don't feel so badly about my recent purchase of HPT now. I'm a major newbie tuner so all of this is very interesting to me. I'm also feeling major lucky that I've had absolutely no problems during a year and 4000 miles of daily driving on my Ed Wright tune for my LS1/6 hotrod, aluminum flywheel and all. My first big challenge in tuning will come when I begin on my 24X wet-sump, LS7 controlled by my LS1/6 PCM. I really don't even know where to start. I'll give considerable thought to giving all of my specs to Ed Wright, again, and assume that he can get it real close and then I can use my HPT to tweek it if necessary.
09-24-2006, 12:43 AM
#15
not a problem, RTT has a very simple application procedure as seen here http://mysite.verizon.net/whenn1/HPT...eedDensity.swf some say the application time is similar to the roadrunner, I strongly disagree. Because everything is done right within the program there is no need to swap PCM's. My flash demo which basically shows the application of a starter tune which normally could be done in less then 4 minutes by anyone...add in 2 minutes to flash the tune & your up and running.
09-24-2006, 05:13 AM
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Just to get this thread back on topic.
Ive had the RoadRunner installed for a few months now as primary PCM. absolutely no issues. In the holden its a 5min swap. As mentioned changes are immediate and any table or value can be changed.
Once you use it you wont want to go back. Who wants to stop the car and sit for a few minutes flashing? You can do a full calibration update while the car is running. Awsome for dyno work, idle etc. And its not limited to certain OS's it supports anything that the 99+ VPW PCM supports.
Ive had the RoadRunner installed for a few months now as primary PCM. absolutely no issues. In the holden its a 5min swap. As mentioned changes are immediate and any table or value can be changed.
Once you use it you wont want to go back. Who wants to stop the car and sit for a few minutes flashing? You can do a full calibration update while the car is running. Awsome for dyno work, idle etc. And its not limited to certain OS's it supports anything that the 99+ VPW PCM supports.
09-24-2006, 08:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Bink
How long does it take to swap the Road Runner pcm into a 2001 Vette? TIA. 
09-24-2006, 06:36 PM
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Originally Posted by foff667
Oh did I mention theres no need to swap pcm's? Its just a simple write entire process which takes less then 2 minutes in most cases
09-24-2006, 06:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Patrick G
I see that you have an aluminum flywheel so what I'm going to tell you will be especially valuable. My tune used to be spot-on until I made one change to my car...I added a 16 lb lighter clutch and flywheel. Instantly, my car went from having a great tune to a crappy tune. My car would die when I'd clutch in, the idle was unstable and the street manners became awful...all from reduced weight from the clutch and flywheel...go figure.
I spent over 4 weeks trying to get the car back to where it was before. I must have spent 40 hours in the car logging and flashed the program over 100 times. Still not working right.
Then I got my roadrunner. Instantly I could make airflow changes to my idle tables, throttle cracker, throttle follower, spark tables, you name it. Within hours (not days) my car was well behaved again. Having real-time tuning allowed me to try out things I'd never consider. Interestingly, many of the odd-ball things I tried worked wonders. Without real-time feedback, I could have never gotten my street manners back to where they needed to be.
Some of the coolest features of the Roadrunner are the bubbles that pop up in your tuning software that show you which cell you're currently in. When you see the cell highlighted, you can change that one cell and instantly get the feedback on whether it helped or not. I found this especially useful when setting up the throttle follower tables and throttle cracker tables.
Now when I clutch in, regardless of speed, my rpm sticks to idle speed. My idle is rock solid. I even was able to trim my cruise A/F ratio on the fly to get better gas mileage while monitoring my wide-band. Yes, the real-time tuning capabilities are time savers for sure, but in my case, they were also life savers...I didn't have to kill my car, LOL!
I give the Roadrunner a 10 on a scale of 1 to 10!
I spent over 4 weeks trying to get the car back to where it was before. I must have spent 40 hours in the car logging and flashed the program over 100 times. Still not working right.
Then I got my roadrunner. Instantly I could make airflow changes to my idle tables, throttle cracker, throttle follower, spark tables, you name it. Within hours (not days) my car was well behaved again. Having real-time tuning allowed me to try out things I'd never consider. Interestingly, many of the odd-ball things I tried worked wonders. Without real-time feedback, I could have never gotten my street manners back to where they needed to be.
Some of the coolest features of the Roadrunner are the bubbles that pop up in your tuning software that show you which cell you're currently in. When you see the cell highlighted, you can change that one cell and instantly get the feedback on whether it helped or not. I found this especially useful when setting up the throttle follower tables and throttle cracker tables.
Now when I clutch in, regardless of speed, my rpm sticks to idle speed. My idle is rock solid. I even was able to trim my cruise A/F ratio on the fly to get better gas mileage while monitoring my wide-band. Yes, the real-time tuning capabilities are time savers for sure, but in my case, they were also life savers...I didn't have to kill my car, LOL!
I give the Roadrunner a 10 on a scale of 1 to 10!
Since I already own EFIlive I have several questions about their version. Do I PM a sponsor or can I post here?