02WS6FREEBIRD

iTrader: (4)

I have my VE and MAF done with a WB and have moved to doing spark and finish up idle, I had about 27* of spark at idle at 800 RPM and about 47 kpa, playing with the spark I added a degree at a time and up about + 12* it started idleing a little better and I kept adding till I was commanding around 40* and because of the fluxing idle the spark was between like mid 30's to mid 40's but the idle WAS SMOOTHER, the RPM's sounded a little higher and map went down to about 44 kpa.

Apparently the engine likes around ~40* at idle, so I added to the main and idle spark tables to where I have around 34* as I dont want to hurt the engine.

Should I keep them mid 30's so when it fluxes its only around low 40's or set it on up near 40....I want the best for my setup with out harm to the engine.

jay_lt4

iTrader: (4)

thats a lot of timing for idle??

my 6.0 with L92 heads likes around 18-19* at idle with this cam:

Comp Cams XR281HR intake 228 0.571 112
PN 54-428-11 exhaust 230 0.573

my brothers 6.0L with this cam idles great at 18* also

Duration at 0.006" Lift: Intake: 314° Exhaust: 322°
Duration at 0.050" Lift: Intake: 230° Exhaust: 237°
Lift at Cam: Intake: 0.318" Exhaust: 0.318"
Lift at Valve: Intake: 0.540" Exhaust: 0.540"

diablotoona

Thats tons of timing, most cammed cars like anywhere from 20-25 degrees.
Did you setup the rest of your idle parameters accordingly?

02WS6FREEBIRD

iTrader: (4)

I have read and read and I have tried different settings for alot of the idle tables trying to see what it likes, including spark...RAF I believe is correct though.

Eagle02

iTrader: (20)

Thats WAY more timing than I have in mine... seems WAY to high to me.

Have you driven at all on that timing? You seeing any KR? I don't see how timing that high can even work, highest mine gets up to is ~30* +/- 2*.

-Eagle

macca_779

What I do is play around with timing and fuel in real time using EFI LIVE. I usually start with an AFR and move the timing around till I get the most amount of vacuum then back it off till its just about to drop again. Fuel is a bit harder and its experimentation for individual cams. My 220/220 113LSA cam I command 14.2AFR and 29 degrees of timing. This gives me around 43kpa of MAP. Going richer does smooth it out a bit.. But I like a little bit of chop in my idle at 800rpm.

02WS6FREEBIRD

iTrader: (4)

I have no KR low, still chasing some here and there, but none low.

And yes I have HPT and I had my idle spark about 26*-28* with my map about 47 kpa and with real time you can advance or retard spark, etc. and as I moved up the idle got smoother and the map went down a little, I went to commanding about 45* and quit there not wanting top hurt the motor but the idle was smoothes there and my map went down to about 44 kpa.

I have sence re-adjusted my idle areas to command about 34*,...not wanting to do any damage to the motor.

shoemike

iTrader: (25)

that is just right for idle.
if your problem is a rough idle, try RAFIG to smooth it out.

02WS6FREEBIRD

iTrader: (4)

What if RAFIG?

If you are talking about running airflow or as I know it as Base Running Airflow, it is dead on, no LTIT movement and STIT is near 0.

SSMIKE319

my comp 224 228 534 537 loves 13 degrees

John_D.

iTrader: (2)

My comp 224 228 .581 .588 115 likes 22 degrees.

It will idle with more advance (28-30), and take less air to do it, but it "flutters" more.

At 22 the idle is more stable, and you can still hear it's got a little bit of cam in it too,
where higher advance hides that.

02WS6FREEBIRD

iTrader: (4)

Thanks, I guess I will play with the timing more and see, up high it is smoother, mabee just seems that way cause its hiding the lope more?

dkbykesdk

iTrader: (13)

how do you guys adjust timing on these cars?

02 BLK WS6

iTrader: (11)

Loosen the distributor and turn.





J/K

HPTuners with a laptop.

jay_lt4

iTrader: (4)

MSD 6010 and a laptop

gametech

iTrader: (1)

When real evidence (your motor operates better) flies in the face of accepted practice, always err on the side of what actually works. I have seen a few motors that for whatever reason just don't agree with commonly accepted tuning practices. BTW, I am referring to fuel as well as spark. Then you throw in the possibility of sensor error, and anything is possible. The bottom line is to do what the motor wants. This is why real tuning (as opposed to mailorder) can be so important.

SSpdDmon

iTrader: (10)

Ok, so you've tried to get it to idle better with spark. What have you done 'air' & 'fuel' wise? I ask because timing is only one aspect of what's going on here. You've got three ***** to turn and based on your post, it looks like you're trying to find the best solution by turning only one of them.

If the AFR is dialed in appropriately and the engine is getting enough air (via the IAC valve) as needed, that cam shouldn't require any more than 30~32* timing TOPS at idle. At least, that's my opinion.

02WS6FREEBIRD

iTrader: (4)

I thought that the VE and MAF were the air/fuel part of timing and they are on with the WB when in gear and driving.

After scaning more and trying to find what the motor likes, here are some results...

Timing at 37* is rather smooth, kpa is at ~48, commanded idle RPM 750, and it fluxes between 710-780, you hear less cam.

Timing at 25* not smooth, kpa ~52, idle RPM fluxes 690-790, begin to hear some cam and exhaust tone a little deeper.

Timing at 7*, is rather smooth again, kpa is ~62, idle RPM fluxes 710-780 and hear more cam and exhaust tone deeper still.

Is the lower spark where I should be?, for this motor after the cam install I added 2* of spark to the main spark table because I heard the bigger cam likes more spark and in some areas it does and in other areas I am less than stock and I would say for a average I have more spark in about 30-40% and the rest about the same as stock or less, so for a average it seems to like a little less than stock, so should I for the idle be down under 10* or is this to low?

John_D.

iTrader: (2)

It will heat up the coolant more with the low timing. Just something to think about.

What timing does it like in gear? (a little load on it from the converter)

2002_Z28_Six_Speed

iTrader: (19)

You want the most vacumn possible when idling. From what I have heard it means the engine is running stronger and it kind of makes sense to me.

If you have two identical engines running at the same speed but have diff timing and one pulls more vac sounds like one is making more power.