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Small Block & Big Block Chevy Specific Mouse & Rat Motor Discussion & Conversions

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Old 08-23-2005, 07:51 AM   #1
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Default Vortec heads Vs. regular heads. What is the difference?

Ok, what is the big difference between the Vortec iron heads, Vortec Aluminum heads, Regular heads, and Regular aluminum heads.

Which one will give me the most HP and Torque?

Also, can vortec heads bolt on to a 1965 327?

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Old 08-23-2005, 02:15 PM   #2
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Are you on the right forum?

I am sure vortec heads are better than regular heads, depending on what "regular" heads you are talking about.
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Old 08-23-2005, 04:09 PM   #3
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theres a sbc section on here where the old school guru's hang out
vortec heads can be used on your 327, but whether they are the best heads to use depends on your goals for the vehicle
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Old 08-23-2005, 11:17 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jsteez
Ok, what is the big difference between the Vortec iron heads, Vortec Aluminum heads, Regular heads, and Regular aluminum heads.

Which one will give me the most HP and Torque?

Also, can vortec heads bolt on to a 1965 327?

OK the biggest difference between them is the smaller heart shaped combustion chambers on the Vortec heads, but the also have a raised intake runner. Which increases port velocity and efficiency, you can more more power w/ a smaller cc runner. The alum version "Fast burn" head is basically the same design, but it has D shaped exhaust ports, and MUCH larger intake runners 210cc I believe, also they have 2.00"int/1.55"exh valves instead of the 1.94"/1.5". Both of these heads will call for a self-aligning set of rocker arms, due to a lack of guide plates. These heads are some serious bang for your buck and will flow big #'s right out of the box! expect 450+hp for the cast iron Vortec, and 550+hp for the Fast Burn both on a 350" inch engine. To answer the last ??? yes they will bolt right on a 327 but you will need a Vortec style intake. Also I would not run the Fast Burn on a 327 its to small for a 210cc runner unless its 12:1 or more compression, and has a huge cam! I hope this helps you out.....
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Old 08-25-2005, 09:58 PM   #5
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Basically the vortec heads are a derivative to the LT1 heads or so I hear but cheaper to make and more refined(have reverse coolant flow). Correct me if I'm wrong, read it in GMHTP.
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Old 09-14-2005, 06:10 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jsteez
Ok, what is the big difference between the Vortec iron heads, Vortec Aluminum heads, Regular heads, and Regular aluminum heads.

Which one will give me the most HP and Torque?

Also, can vortec heads bolt on to a 1965 327?

You cannot go wrong with the Vortec Heads.They are much better all the way around In Hp figures and Torque.You also need to keep in mind that the Vortec heads are only good up to a .0450" lift camshaft.like it was mentioned they do have a 64cc combustion chamber and it will increase your compression some.Yes there is a Fast Burn Alum.head that has the Vortec Features,as well as the Vortec head it too will take a special intake manifold.
For budget reasons you can get into a set of complete Vortec head less rocker arms for around $499.95 a pair.We also offer a upgraded Vortec head that will accomadate a larger lift camshaft.We have seen a 30hp increase with Vortec heads.The Fast Burn heads are also a great choice if you are willing to spend just over $1100.00 for the pair.
PM me if you decide or have Any questions at all.We are the Largest GM Performance Parts Supplier in the country.We move a great deal of Vortec heads.Now you know!
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Old 09-14-2005, 06:13 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by superGMman
Basically the vortec heads are a derivative to the LT1 heads or so I hear but cheaper to make and more refined(have reverse coolant flow). Correct me if I'm wrong, read it in GMHTP.
Your wrong! The port is same if you will,but it is NOT a reverse cooling head by no means!
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Old 09-16-2005, 07:11 AM   #8
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For a budget buildup, the Vortecs are great.

Don't forget they also have a swirl enhancing design in the bowl as well.

On a mild street driven small blk., you will see #s in the 350 - 400 range fairly easily. A 327 will benefit from the good torque building characteristics, and still allow some higher rpm power.

Also, the Vortec design allows less timimng lead so you can run a bit more compression on pump gas too.
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Old 10-02-2005, 03:49 AM   #9
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vortec heads perform pretty good on sbs strokers
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Old 10-06-2005, 10:04 AM   #10
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some of these peoples hp and tq figures are high, ive built 2 sbc motors w/ vortec heads. one 305 in my 88 bird and a 350 tpi motor in my 91 z28. only honestly expect about 20 - 30 hp gain from the heads alone.( people are saying hp numbers that are jsut rediculous im telling you from experience ) depending on what intake you use and you will need a new one, expect another 10 - 15. companies say bolt on 45 hp gain but its like anything else one motor inder 10000 conditions might have made 45 more hp yours wont.
the heads will have to be worked to take a cam over .470 lift.
on the 305 motor all i did was a small cam comp 268* cast vortecs and edel. performer intake and was basicall happy w/ the setup.made a noticeavle power increse and i dint have too much in the setup ( cam heads intake and holley 670 tbi i think i had nearly 1k in it all ). the tpi motor was a different story i had to dish out way to much for an intake ( over 400 $ )and ended up havin so much in the heads ( port work bigger valves milled springs shims ect..... ) i would have been better off getting some brodix ,edelbrock, or world heads. really just depends on you goals for the motor and how deep your pockets are.
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Old 10-10-2005, 09:48 PM   #11
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My set-up:
Stock 350 with LT1 flat tops, 230 duration / .512 lift W/1.6 rockers, stock vortec heads (milled .025", 3 angle valve job, "Z28" springs, raised hight keepers & retainers) .015" steel shim head gaskets, Hurricane intake, 780 DP, 100 shot, 1 5/8" shorties, 3" pro chamber. Car weight - 3080 with driver, ran best of 11.01 @ 125.71 with a slipping clutch. should be about 475 to the wheels on the spray, 373 to the wheels all motor.
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Old 11-07-2005, 12:39 AM   #12
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hey my dad has a 383 with cast vortec heads the motor has a good bit of parts and work in it. It has a scat crank (light weight) with eagle h beams and JE pistons (9.5 to 1 compression). the vortec heads are ported and polished with stainless steel valves. It was build for nitrous it made 450hp and 500lbs of tq on motor. With a 150 shot it made 600 hp and 650 lbs of tq. thats at the crank, so the vortec heads are a good head if you have them done right.
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Old 11-07-2005, 08:21 AM   #13
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I want to add that most of the articles you read about SBCs build ups using the vortecs, usually have a pocket port done to the head.
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Old 11-07-2005, 09:17 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ncd1966
hey my dad has a 383 with cast vortec heads the motor has a good bit of parts and work in it. It has a scat crank (light weight) with eagle h beams and JE pistons (9.5 to 1 compression). the vortec heads are ported and polished with stainless steel valves. It was build for nitrous it made 450hp and 500lbs of tq on motor. With a 150 shot it made 600 hp and 650 lbs of tq. thats at the crank, so the vortec heads are a good head if you have them done right.
I am going to have to call B.S. on the dyno results.....maybe not as much the N/A, but DEFINITELY the spray! First off, a motor that is "Built for nitrous" usually doesn't produce great all motor numbers which is why I sorta doubt your N/A numbers. This is due to the camshaft desinged for a whole lot more oxygen (From the N20) then is present, not too mention the loose ring gaps to cut down on cylinder pressure. 500 ft.lbs is a bunch from a 383 even with a killer set of heads, let alone a ported stocker....and the fact that spray motors typically kill allot of low-end torque...

On to the real B.S., It is EXTREMELY rare to see a so-called 150 shot actually add exactly 150HP....I have done this more then once and I can honestly say that I have never seen that. But considering you could have been using general numbers like the motor actually made 447 and on N20 made 653, or something to that effect. As for the torque...uhm, WTF? torque gets so multiplied it isn't even funny to watch. if a motor made 500 ft. lbs N/A then the correct jetting for a 150hp increase would net closer to a 225-240ft.lb gain, not 150.....especially on a N20 motor.





Ok, on to the Vortecs, they are a well designed head from the factory, a light bowl blend, back-cutting the valves and a crisp valve job usually net an extra 20cfm. But they do well out of the box with a realistic HP ceiling of about 425-440 HP using a decent motor on pump gas. The Fast burns in my eyes are a waste of time and effort, they are huge cavernous holes (210cc was correct) that don't actually move a whole lot of air, money would be better spent elsewhere.
Basically, if you have a motor and stock heads, Vortec's are a great upgrade, especially if you look at the pocket book before and after...as Barry pointed out.

Good luck.
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Old 11-08-2005, 12:19 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uberLS-1
First off, a motor that is "Built for nitrous" usually doesn't produce great all motor numbers which is why I sorta doubt your N/A numbers. This is due to the camshaft desinged for a whole lot more oxygen (From the N20) then is present, not too mention the loose ring gaps to cut down on cylinder pressure. ....and the fact that spray motors typically kill allot of low-end torque...
The biggest difference in a nitrous cam is "usually" two things
1. A wider lobe seperation
2. more exhaust duration
I agree that loose ring gaps will hurt n/a power, but not as much as you think. I've built a bunch of nitrous cars (my 78 had a fogger and a 500HP plate)(my 98 has a big shot plate)(and over 50 customer's cars over the years)and all of them still made great power on motor as well as nitrous.

Quote:
Originally Posted by uberLS-1
Ok, on to the Vortecs, they are a well designed head from the factory, a light bowl blend, back-cutting the valves and a crisp valve job usually net an extra 20cfm. But they do well out of the box with a realistic HP ceiling of about 425-440 HP using a decent motor on pump gas. The Fast burns in my eyes are a waste of time and effort, they are huge cavernous holes (210cc was correct) that don't actually move a whole lot of air, money would be better spent elsewhere.
Basically, if you have a motor and stock heads, Vortec's are a great upgrade, especially if you look at the pocket book before and after...as Barry pointed out.

Good luck.
While I agree with you on the Vortec heads here, I completely disagree with you about the Fast Burn heads. On a stock motor they'd be overkill, but when matched with the right cam and engine combo they work VERY well. Mine flowed 268CFM@.600 out of the box on a Superflow bench at 28 in.
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Old 11-08-2005, 06:35 PM   #16
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For the money the fast burns are the way to go, the cast is good to a point, but the fast burn will pick up where the cast starts to loose flow in mid lift numbers, i use a procharger f-2 to blow thru a set of these heads and closing in on the 1000hp area. N/A makes close to 550 with not that big of a cam, damn good set of heads
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Old 11-08-2005, 08:52 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ProStreetZ28
The biggest difference in a nitrous cam is "usually" two things
1. A wider lobe seperation
2. more exhaust duration
I agree that loose ring gaps will hurt n/a power, but not as much as you think. I've built a bunch of nitrous cars (my 78 had a fogger and a 500HP plate)(my 98 has a big shot plate)(and over 50 customer's cars over the years)and all of them still made great power on motor as well as nitrous..
Fully agree, his results just seemed a little.....optimistic.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ProStreetZ28
While I agree with you on the Vortec heads here, I completely disagree with you about the Fast Burn heads. On a stock motor they'd be overkill, but when matched with the right cam and engine combo they work VERY well. Mine flowed 268CFM@.600 out of the box on a Superflow bench at 28 in.
Although I have seen some desparity "On the bench" they are none-the-less better then stock heads....but as far as the aftermarket goes, you have to agree that there are better choices. I will however fully agree with the "Bang for the buck" thoughts.

I think we are on the same page, just different font. LOL
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Old 11-10-2005, 12:19 PM   #18
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well think what you want. we are pleased with the numbers it made.
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