2000Hawk#317

iTrader: (3)

Looking at changing my rear LCA's and panhard. Was wondering where the pros and cons are between the poly/poly, poly/rod, and rod/rod? It will be on car adjustable, but are there limitations I should be aware of before I invest? Is there a noise difference? (Not that I care) Is one selection better for the street and the other for strip? Which is just the best all way round? I am driving an M6 but not shure if that matters.

DarkblueTA

What are you doing with the car? Tell us that and we can steer you in the right direction for what you want.

(A little information).
If you are into drag racing or just a street car (no hard cornering), you can go with poly/poly or poly/rod and it would be perfectly fine.

If you're into hard cornering, I would get rod/rod PHB and keep your stock LCA's (if the stock rubber bushing are in good shape, you will be fine. If not, MOOG bushings are 1LE hardness which would be a great replacement bushing). I run this setup on NT05's and it is a whole lot of fun.

2000Hawk#317

iTrader: (3)

I want to keep it on the streets and I like corner carving. But if I ever get a wild hair and decide to change things, I would like for the suspension components to change but without buying parts all over again. I run Nitto 555's. I want to lower it but more for performance and not looks. Is there a happy medium? Wouldnt I want adjustable LCA's to change the angle for wheel hop after it being lowerd?

SparkyJJO

iTrader: (11)

Definitely don't want poly/poly if you're doing corners. That setup would create bind.

I didn't want the NVH that rod ends introduce, and my LCAs were shot, so I went with a happy medium and got the Founders 3 piece poly joint LCAs. Not noisy, still moves around as needed, but less deflection than rubber. I haven't pushed it hard but so far it feels good. We'll see how long-term longevity is.

Adjustable LCAs only help to recenter the wheel within the wheel well if you're trying to cram a really tall drag tire in there, or if you want to be able to adjust the thrust angle. I went with non-adjustable LCAs, but got an adjustable PHB to recenter the axle under the car after lowering it.

2000Hawk#317

iTrader: (3)

So I want something pretty square and rigid. Makes since. Do you do anything specific with your car i.e. drag or road course? The only thing I would get into would be road courses and the street. So stick with either stock LCA's and poly bushings or if I do get LCA's, go with poly/joint.

Daniel Richards

iTrader: (1)

Yup, I LOVE my 3-piece poly Founders
http://www.foundersperformance.com/1...ce-poly-joint/

as for panhard bar I went with Poly-Poly
http://www.foundersperformance.com/p...-Bushings.html

you don't need adjustable lower control arms for a street car unless your running a really big/wide tire.

to fix the angle to prevent wheel hop you want these
http://www.foundersperformance.com/p...-Brackets.html

I have the exact lower control arms and panhard bar linked here (still deciding whether to get the relo brackets or not) and combined with my SLP bilsteins and BMR springs that I put in days later the car launches like a rocket and straight as an arrow and for the record I live in the mountains of North Georgia so I do a good bit of corner carving, I haven't been able to push them to the extreme yet since I still need to rebuild my front suspension and get the Bilstein and BMR's in the front.

2000Hawk#317

iTrader: (3)

Daniel R. we have spoke before. lol. Now I just have to figure out how to get these without the wife knowing. ha. I have a few extra $$ so i think these few and an MGW for the M6 will be my next step.

2000Hawk#317

iTrader: (3)

The relocation kit that you have on there. What position did you place the LCA's in? There's three correct?

2000Hawk#317

iTrader: (3)

Delete previous post!! My bad

Daniel Richards

iTrader: (1)

Still waiting on pictures of how bad that hatch is, I decided to shift focus and step back from the motor swap stuff (I typed up a list of all the pieces I would need and it's a lot more then I first thought) and finish the body mods right now. But if you still have that A4 alum driveshaft, sell it to me cheap and bring it up here one weekend and I'll show you how my setup handles corners.

2000Hawk#317

iTrader: (3)

I have a guy coming from Kennesaw Saturday morning to pick it up. If it falls through, I'll let you know. I will get you pics of the hatch. Just shot you a PM. I want to keep it but I dont think its worth it. Let me know. I may have to send some money your way to fix it.

2000Hawk#317

iTrader: (3)

Im about to buy these 3 piece LCA's but want to know what the "added hardware" consist of?

Daniel Richards

iTrader: (1)

I don't know, I didn't get it, I think it's just replacement bolts and nuts.

BMR Sales2

iTrader: (40)

It really sounds like our BMR poly/rod lower control arms (TCA004) and panhard bar (PHR010) would work very well for you. These parts have the rod end on one side which attaches to the rear end and allows the suspension to move freely with no binding but also has the polyurethane bushings on the chassis side to make sure any extra NVH is limited. These parts really give you the best of both worlds because they are good for both handling and drag racing situation.

BMR Lower Control Arms, DOM, On-car Adjustable, Poly/Rod End Combo (TCA004)


BMR Panhard Rod, DOM, On-car Adjustable, Poly/Rod End Combo


If there is anything we can help you out with let us know.

TA_Freak

Don't do the poly/poly bushings in the stock LCAs as SparkyJJO said. Too much bind and you'll hate it when you want to take corners fast. Press some 1LE Moogs in the stock LCAs and you'll love it.

z28bryan

iTrader: (7)

Just my .02 cents

With panhard bars, going even up to a rod/rod end doesn't really increase much noise or harshness to the ride, due to the nature of how it works.

With LCAs, you are more apt to hear a noise difference or harshness compared to the PHB.

A PHB is a good start. Many people run on stock LCAs even in performance applications. It all depends on what you do with the car. For something people use mostly for daily driving, I don't know why anyone needs to upgrade their LCAs. There's PLENTY of other things you can do that can improve the car. For most people the stock LCAs and their bushings hold up just fine and are not flexing as much as they think they are.

Daniel Richards

iTrader: (1)

Got to disagree with you there, at 205k miles my stock LCA bushings where shot, changing out to the 3-piece poly ones from Founders significantly reduced wheel hop and helped noticeably in keeping the car pointed straight when launching and they only cost like 30-40 bucks more then a set of Moog bushings and save you the hassle of pressing out/in (or paying to have it done) and they just look nicer, well worth the extra cash over rebuilding the stock arms.

JimMueller

iTrader: (9)

When I switched to 315/35/17 50mm backspace rear tires my OEM LCA's rubbed against the tire, it may have only been during hard cornering on Hoosiers, I don't recall. I switched to round tubular double heim-jointed using 3-piece teflon joints and just replace as needed. The slightly additional NVH on my daily driver doesn't bother me.

My $0.02:
- For rear LCA's, if you like a quiet car and want the least expensive short term cost stick with the OEM stamped LCA's and just use the Moog replacement bushings (which are the same as the 1LE design) so long as you don't have any physical interference. For theh least expensive long term solution consider the Founders design referenced above or possibly one of the RotoJoint designs from UMI. If you plan to regularly autocross or take it to a real track (i.e., Sebring, Road Atlanta, Roebling Road, etc.) then consider a round tubular double-ended heim if the class rules allow it.
- For the PHB, even a double-ended heim design isn't noisy, pick one with either 1 or 2 heim joints, and a design where the joint/s is/are at the end/s of the bar, not in the center.

Here's an old thread from the FRRAX forum on desirable LCA design for handling:
http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/index.php?showtopic=6781

z28bryan

iTrader: (7)

Ok I'll take back what I said. Just because my star shaped bushings were ok, doesn't mean everyones was. It looks like others have had problems.

In any case, I'm sure he'd be fine with stock LCAs with the solid rubber moog bushings in there. Probably the best option that will hold up in performance applications and be the most daily driveably friendly.

FWIW, I was lazy and just bought rod/rod arms and didn't feel like changing the bushings out. Those absorb a lot of clunks/noise. But I didn't care.. to me it's a race car.

2000Hawk#317

iTrader: (3)

I ended up buying all the rear components last night from Founders. I ended up going with the on car adjustable both poly ends, the relo's, and the LCA's were the 3 piece poly joints. I will go with the pan hard relo once I can afford the true dual set up by kooks. Now I just need to get the torque arm. My only concerns where that if it would bolt up to say a UMI tranny cross member to get the torque arm off the tail housing. I just need some reassurance that it will work. I like their torque arm but don't want to put the money into it if it will not work with an off the tail shaft cross member.