Advanced Engineering Tech For the more hardcore LS1TECH residents

Engineering student tinkering. (Long post)

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old Nov 22, 2015 | 11:31 PM
  #1  
MIKE1444's Avatar
Thread Starter
Teching In
 
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 40
Likes: 0
From: Socorro, New Mexico
Default Engineering student tinkering. (Long post)

I'll cut to the chase. Has anybody managed to make an excel sheet that can be used to estimate the results of a given head/cam/bore/rod/stroke combination? I think I got something going here, so I don't have to shell out for software that gives me black-box information.

Here's what I did.

I made an excel sheet for my Machine Design class last semester to find the load of a rod bolt, but I've since modified it to give me piston speed, instantaneous potential CFM demand, and a few other bits and bobs that I can integrate.

Check this out.
4.125" bore, 4" stroke, 6.077" rod 1.163" piston, 9.24" deck.
I assume that I lose 50 degrees of camshaft duration before I get to meaningful valve lift for the upper RPM limit.
For a camshaft, I assumed that if I close 41abdc and open 7btdc. 228, .551" lift. On a 330 CFM cathedral head, that build is supposed to run out of swept air at about 5500 rpm, and then the 10% of chamber volume to scavenge becomes a variable, but the motor should drop torque from that point, and the power peak should be near 6000, definitely flat at 6600. For my 7 degree overlap, I need like 800 CFM at 1 psi to scavenge it. So basically, it's hard to really wing the power out of this thing. We actually want lots of overlap.

As for power figures, the 41abdc says I get 91% of my 427 plus whatever I can scavenge from the combustion chamber, so I should make upper 400's for torque at 1200RPM, and then up a ways at say 3K, 500 Ft Lbs, up to potentially 553 foot pounds at 5500 rpm, 579 hp. If I can't get the big V.E. and don't make it past 100%, 502 foot pounds is a good goal. If I can scavenge that motor, but just not at that speed, then the torque peak lands wherever the hell my headers and intake make it land, with whatever pressure differential I can get. Probably like 4.5K

On a bigger engine, (put this port and valve on a different chamber so it aims into the bore properly.), say 4.5" stroke, 4.5" bore, 6.7" rod, if combustion works, she's out of V.E. at 4100. Out of scavenge at 4500, out of air at 5000. Conversely if I use a 254 cam, I run out of valve closing event. So, I open it at 14btdc and close at 67 abdc. I get 76% volume loss, and keep 10% in the chamber (86% v.e.), so she should make under 580 foot pounds down near 3K. I'll be nice and give it 6% points more as benefit of the doubt for low-lift flow tricks. 92% v.e. 616 foot pounds. Since my 572 thinks it's a 491, it should rev up like a 491 does, so I multiply my 4800 by 572/491 and she should actually spin to 5600 to make that power, but with the crappy torque of 580. 618hp. But with the 228 cam and the right intake/exhaust, it should make 750 foot pounds. I think that would be more fun than the 620hp build.

On a small engine, like a 360 cube 4.125" bore. 3.375" stroke, 6" rod, 8.85 deck, Excel says 7500 RPM out of air, but my (572/491) scalar says I need to spin it more to get there, and the number is 8800, and then whatever % i'm nutty enough to wing on those valve springs. (the 428 looked like a turkey, but this thing is even more odd.)
Reply
Old Nov 23, 2015 | 02:11 AM
  #2  
Blown06's Avatar
8 Second Truck Club
iTrader: (32)
 
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,181
Likes: 8
Default

Seems like a lot of assumptions. You probably won't learn this in engineering school, but I can provide a lesson from the school of hard knocks (I have a phd).

Assume = Makes an "***" out of "u" and "me".
Reply
Old Nov 23, 2015 | 01:34 PM
  #3  
MIKE1444's Avatar
Thread Starter
Teching In
 
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 40
Likes: 0
From: Socorro, New Mexico
Default

Very true.
Have you built any engines and modeled your dyno chart (using DCR data from another known build) before you pull the dollar trigger on it?
Here, I'm missing the pressure differential and the valve closing curve. So i only get idle behavior and peak hp rpm.
It's a crap shoot because we need valve events to make headers. They really need to be matched.
Reply
Old Jan 2, 2016 | 01:13 PM
  #4  
panic's Avatar
Staging Lane
 
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 97
Likes: 2
From: Lynbrook, NY
Default

I assume that I lose 50 degrees of camshaft duration before I get to meaningful valve lift for the upper RPM limit.

I think the effective duration is closer to nominal - 30 degrees or so for a fast ramp.
Instantaneous CFM (I assume based on piston position and velocity) is a bit too sensitive to plenum buffering (volume, X-section area, and distance to the throttle) to be really useful.
Reply




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:19 AM.

story-0
Amazing '71 Camaro Restomod Is Modern Muscle Car Under the Skin

Slideshow: This heavily modified 1971 Camaro mixes classic muscle car styling with a fifth-generation Camaro interior and modern LS3 power.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-05-12 18:06:42


VIEW MORE
story-1
6 Common C5 Corvette Failures and What's Involved In Repairing Them

Slideshow: From wobbling harmonic balancers to failed EBCMs, these are the issues that define long-term C5 ownership and what repairs typically involve.

By Pouria Savadkouei | 2026-05-07 18:44:57


VIEW MORE
story-2
Retro Modern Bandit Pontiac Trans AM Comes With Burt Reynolds' Autograph

Slideshow: A modern Camaro transformed into a retro icon, this limited-run "Bandit" build blends nostalgia with brute force in a way few revivals manage.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-04-21 13:57:02


VIEW MORE
story-3
Top 10 Greatest Cadillac V Series Performance Models Ever, Ranked

Slideshow: Cadillac didn't just crash the high-performance luxury vehicle party, it showed up loud, supercharged, and occasionally a little unhinged...

By Pouria Savadkouei | 2026-04-16 10:05:15


VIEW MORE
story-4
Top 10 Most Powerful Chevy Trucks Ever Made!

Slideshow: Top ten most powerful Chevy trucks ever made

By | 2026-03-25 09:22:26


VIEW MORE
story-5
Hennessey's New Supercharged Silverado ZR2 Has 700 HP

Slideshow: Hennessey has turned the Silverado ZR2 into a 700-hp off-road monster with supercharged V8 power and a limited production run.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-03-24 18:57:52


VIEW MORE
story-6
Coachbuilt N2A Anteros Is an LS2-Powered C6 Corvette In Italian Clothes

Slideshow: A one-off sports car that looks like a vintage Italian exotic-but hides a C6 Corvette underneath-just sold for the price of a new mid-engine Corvette.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-03-23 18:53:41


VIEW MORE
story-7
Awesome K5 Blazer Restomod Comes With C7 Corvette Power

Slideshow: A heavily reworked 1972 K5 Blazer swaps its off-road roots for a low-slung street-focused build with modern V8 power.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-03-09 18:08:45


VIEW MORE
story-8
10 Camaros You Should Never Buy

Slideshow: There are thousands of used Camaros on the market but we think you should avoid these 10

By | 2026-02-17 17:09:30


VIEW MORE
story-9
10 LS Engine Myths That Refuse to Die

Slideshows: Which one of these myths do you believe?

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-01-28 18:10:11


VIEW MORE