Toluene
Toluene Is is safe to use Toluene as octane booster or drive on it and n-heptane in daily driving?
Is anyone here using it as an Octane booster?
Dosenīt it damage(dry up) rubber?or other materials
Is anyone here using it as an Octane booster?
Dosenīt it damage(dry up) rubber?or other materials
6600 rpm clutch dump of death Administrator
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 4,983
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From: Texas
Are you getting knock retard? Only use octane boosters if your car is detonanting. Increasing octane needlessly only hurts power production.
But, Toluene is fine just don't go over about 20% concentration as it gets hard to burn, and you have to pre-heat the fuel.
Lots of boosted guys like it.
But, Toluene is fine just don't go over about 20% concentration as it gets hard to burn, and you have to pre-heat the fuel.
Lots of boosted guys like it.
Toulene and Xylene are octane boosters which shouldn't be used in a concentration greater than 30% or you will get cold start driveability issues.
Toulene is 114 octane
Xylene is 117 octane
You can buy a 5 gallon drum from you local paint supply shop for around $30-40.
7 gallons of 92 octane
3 gallons of Xylene
3 ounces (Marvel Mystery Oil) for lubrication
yields 100 octane
Unless you are running higher compression or are boosted you probably are wasting your $$$.
When you buy those 16oz octane boosters they really only boost it from 91 to 91.3 or 91.4 octane as you need a larger concentration to effectively change the ratio.
Toulene is 114 octane
Xylene is 117 octane
You can buy a 5 gallon drum from you local paint supply shop for around $30-40.
7 gallons of 92 octane
3 gallons of Xylene
3 ounces (Marvel Mystery Oil) for lubrication
yields 100 octane
Unless you are running higher compression or are boosted you probably are wasting your $$$.
When you buy those 16oz octane boosters they really only boost it from 91 to 91.3 or 91.4 octane as you need a larger concentration to effectively change the ratio.
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Verdad Gallardo 6600 rpm clutch dump of death Administrator
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 4,983
Likes: 13
From: Texas
Yes, it probably would be. Take $5.00 gallons for Toulune, and divide it by 18 gallons of gas. You're raising the cost of your gas by $.27 gallon. Its cheaper to buy premium. Use Tolune if you need more than 93....
Originally Posted by Steve Gunn
Might be a coincidence, but I had to replace my cats some years ago shortly after running a few tanks of Toluene mix.
If used, don't get it on yourself, its capillary absorbed and goes right to your liver and kidneys(unless you don't have any).
On The Tree
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 121
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From: Cleveland
Marathon premium fuel (one of the few oil companies to publish MSDS) contains 1 to 15 percent toluene and 2 to 10 percent xylene already.
http://www.marathonpetroleum.com/msds/0126MAR019.pdf
http://www.marathonpetroleum.com/msds/0126MAR019.pdf
TECH Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 8,423
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From: Friendswood,TX
Amoco fuels do also. 
PPM It takes a 10,000ppm to be 1 precent.
http://www.ilpi.com/msds/ref/concentration.html
PPM It takes a 10,000ppm to be 1 precent. http://www.ilpi.com/msds/ref/concentration.html
Last edited by Toxic Texan; May 21, 2006 at 06:02 PM.
6600 rpm clutch dump of death Administrator
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 4,983
Likes: 13
From: Texas
Originally Posted by 87gnx
Nope, Toluene will ruin your cats(unless you don't have any).
If used, don't get it on yourself, its capillary absorbed and goes right to your liver and kidneys(unless you don't have any).
If used, don't get it on yourself, its capillary absorbed and goes right to your liver and kidneys(unless you don't have any).
As for its danger, you see the same sort of danger with plenty of other solvents, and of course you see the same sort of danger by geting gas on you. It has Tolune, Xylene, Benzene, etc... in it.
Originally Posted by J-Rod
Toluene would only ruin your cats if you ran the car too rich, and melted the cats. There are no byproducts in Tolune that would affect a catalytic converter otherwise. Its not like TEL, or MMT which compromises the effectiveness of the cat.
As for its danger, you see the same sort of danger with plenty of other solvents, and of course you see the same sort of danger by geting gas on you. It has Tolune, Xylene, Benzene, etc... in it.
As for its danger, you see the same sort of danger with plenty of other solvents, and of course you see the same sort of danger by geting gas on you. It has Tolune, Xylene, Benzene, etc... in it.
As far as the dangers of getting Gas on you vapors are harmless unless inhaled, the miniscule amount of additives in gasoline aren't NEARLY as bad as the straight chemicals you listed above..$.02.
6600 rpm clutch dump of death Administrator
Joined: Dec 2001
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From: Texas
Miniscule ammounts of what?
Gasoline is a blend of these "miniscule" additives. I haven't looked at a recent blend sheet, Toxic could obviously comment on what the specific makeup is these days.
The older stuff I have lists Fuel A - Unleaded EPA Reference Fuel
Fuel A contained 30.1% aromatics, 8.2% olefins, and 61.7% saturates.
Fuel A was further described as containing
0.2% benzene,
16.7% toluene,
1.0% n-butane,
5.4% isopentane,
and 4.8% n-pentane.
Typically, gasoline contains more than 150 chemicals including varying amounts of benzene,toluene, xylene, ethylbenzene, 1,2-dibromoethane, 1,3-butadiene, etc...
How the gasoline is made determines which chemicals are present in the gasoline mixture and how much of each is present. The actual composition varies with the source of the crude petroleum, the manufacturer, and the time of year.
Even if you were to add 15% Toluene to most grades of fuel, it would still conform to ASTM D4814 which specifies which specify an aromatic content of between 20% and 45%.
Now, if current specs (and I don't have a current blend sheet) were to have content more than the old reference fuel then you'd be out of ASTM spec, but that still is in conformance with many of the fuel standards outside the United States, and IMHO would be more than safe to run.
Keep in mind Toluene is simply an aromatic hydrocarbon.
Gasoline is a blend of these "miniscule" additives. I haven't looked at a recent blend sheet, Toxic could obviously comment on what the specific makeup is these days.
The older stuff I have lists Fuel A - Unleaded EPA Reference Fuel
Fuel A contained 30.1% aromatics, 8.2% olefins, and 61.7% saturates.
Fuel A was further described as containing
0.2% benzene,
16.7% toluene,
1.0% n-butane,
5.4% isopentane,
and 4.8% n-pentane.
Typically, gasoline contains more than 150 chemicals including varying amounts of benzene,toluene, xylene, ethylbenzene, 1,2-dibromoethane, 1,3-butadiene, etc...
How the gasoline is made determines which chemicals are present in the gasoline mixture and how much of each is present. The actual composition varies with the source of the crude petroleum, the manufacturer, and the time of year.
Even if you were to add 15% Toluene to most grades of fuel, it would still conform to ASTM D4814 which specifies which specify an aromatic content of between 20% and 45%.
Now, if current specs (and I don't have a current blend sheet) were to have content more than the old reference fuel then you'd be out of ASTM spec, but that still is in conformance with many of the fuel standards outside the United States, and IMHO would be more than safe to run.
Keep in mind Toluene is simply an aromatic hydrocarbon.
Miniscule amounts(10000 ppm to equal 1 percent). The original post asks about Toluene as an OCTANE BOOSTER.Who cares HOW MUCH is in gasoline already??. Toluene is also used as a cleaner, in its straight form.
Sorry; I didn't know I was posting after a Petroleum Engineer(Chemical Engineer).
Complete your research next time before you post.
Sorry; I didn't know I was posting after a Petroleum Engineer(Chemical Engineer).
Complete your research next time before you post.
6600 rpm clutch dump of death Administrator
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 4,983
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From: Texas
You made several incorrect statements which I attempted to clear up.
The toxicity issues of Toluene are normally grossly overstated by many folks. I.E. "Don't get it on you or it will kill you !!!". They read the warnings, and fail to notice the same warning apply for many cleaners and solvents, along with gasoline itself.
Toluene is treated like the boogeyman, when in fact its already a major component in fuel to begin with. So, my point is, if its already 15-20% of your fuel content getting it on your skin is very similar to geting gas on yourself.
As for destroying a cat, the only way it would do so is to go rich, and melt it. The ingredients in Toluene themselves won't hurt a cat.
As for boosting octane I see no issue with it, so long as its done in the prescibed manner as has been outlined for some time now, and not exceeding a 20% concentration.
The toxicity issues of Toluene are normally grossly overstated by many folks. I.E. "Don't get it on you or it will kill you !!!". They read the warnings, and fail to notice the same warning apply for many cleaners and solvents, along with gasoline itself.
Toluene is treated like the boogeyman, when in fact its already a major component in fuel to begin with. So, my point is, if its already 15-20% of your fuel content getting it on your skin is very similar to geting gas on yourself.
As for destroying a cat, the only way it would do so is to go rich, and melt it. The ingredients in Toluene themselves won't hurt a cat.
As for boosting octane I see no issue with it, so long as its done in the prescibed manner as has been outlined for some time now, and not exceeding a 20% concentration.