4l80e Jakes Stage 2 kit
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 112
Likes: 7
From: Vancouver, WA
4l80e Jakes Stage 2 kit Hello,
I have been going back and forth but I've decided. Vehicle is 2004 Buick Rainier 5.3. Plan is to set it up for boost: cam, springs, trunnion upgrade and smash it while I save again for boost items.
The transmission I've decided on is a 4l80e. This will be a street car and I will eventually pull the motor/trans and put it in a Fox body/Rx7. I want it to take the abuse. I realize the converters will be different. I'm going to use a truck converter in the heavy SUV for the time being and when I actually pull this combo to put in a car, Ill spec a nice converter.
This brings me to my questions.
Ill get a 99+ core, I plan on buying the Jakes Stage 2 rebuild kit but I want to add a Rollerized Billet Forward Hub for added peace of mind in boosted applications. I dont believe I need the 300m input shaft as my power goals are 650hp tops, more around 500 tire. I plan on having a local builder assemble it all, Ive been quoted $500.
The price of just grabbing a Rollerized Billet Forward Hub, like most things, is all over the place. Here is a few I have seen, but they don't say they are rollerized.
Am I on the right track? These are what I'm looking at
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/s...-02k/overview/
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/ati-405370/overview/
I have been going back and forth but I've decided. Vehicle is 2004 Buick Rainier 5.3. Plan is to set it up for boost: cam, springs, trunnion upgrade and smash it while I save again for boost items.
The transmission I've decided on is a 4l80e. This will be a street car and I will eventually pull the motor/trans and put it in a Fox body/Rx7. I want it to take the abuse. I realize the converters will be different. I'm going to use a truck converter in the heavy SUV for the time being and when I actually pull this combo to put in a car, Ill spec a nice converter.
This brings me to my questions.
Ill get a 99+ core, I plan on buying the Jakes Stage 2 rebuild kit but I want to add a Rollerized Billet Forward Hub for added peace of mind in boosted applications. I dont believe I need the 300m input shaft as my power goals are 650hp tops, more around 500 tire. I plan on having a local builder assemble it all, Ive been quoted $500.
The price of just grabbing a Rollerized Billet Forward Hub, like most things, is all over the place. Here is a few I have seen, but they don't say they are rollerized.
Am I on the right track? These are what I'm looking at
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/s...-02k/overview/
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/ati-405370/overview/
TECH Junkie
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 3,612
Likes: 1,324
From: Iowa
sonnax hub is a nice piece. Go with it if you want to buy one.
4340 input shaft good to 1000 horse
Jakes kit is good...pre 97 core would be easier/better for the swap
rainier 2wd? I hope so...or I hope youre ready for some work
4340 input shaft good to 1000 horse
Jakes kit is good...pre 97 core would be easier/better for the swap
rainier 2wd? I hope so...or I hope youre ready for some work
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 112
Likes: 7
From: Vancouver, WA
I like the idea of the improved cooling on the 99+. I'm prepared to hammer the trans tunnel to clear a few spots. I know I'll have to use HPTuners to segment swap. I know I either have to depin the harness and repin it myself or use a predone section of wiring.
Is there anything that makes the 97+ easier or better in regards to the above? Or am I missing the differences between pre and post 97.
It's a awd. I already removed the front drive shaft and have the encoder motor unplugged. I plan on removing the front axles and the front differential. The front sump I will likely have to leave it. Even the 2wd version of this is front sump, the difference being if it has provisions for the front diff/axles if 4wd/awd. This is the only thing up in the air right now but I could leave the front sump pan on it in the mean time also.
Thank you for taking the time.
TECH Junkie
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 3,612
Likes: 1,324
From: Iowa
A. common misconception that the 97+ (rear cooler port) trans were better at lube/cooling. They're not (at least in my personal opinion)
If you're removing all of the front end parts...might as well go with C6 vette oil pan and pickup
Jakes kit is very good...if you're buying his kit, get his 4340 input shaft.
Shame to see a rainier lose awd. but to each their own.
I assume with the 80e swap you'll be using a 2wd core and eliminating the transfer case entirely?
If you're removing all of the front end parts...might as well go with C6 vette oil pan and pickup
Jakes kit is very good...if you're buying his kit, get his 4340 input shaft.
Shame to see a rainier lose awd. but to each their own.
I assume with the 80e swap you'll be using a 2wd core and eliminating the transfer case entirely?
TECH Junkie
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,202
Likes: 1,390
From: Nitro Alley
I definitely DO NOT prefer the "Late" lube design...
One of the BEST improvements to the rear lube (center support) design units; is to install an early unit HOLLOW intermediate shaft to bring a HUGE increase of Planetary cooling/ lube.
One of the BEST improvements to the rear lube (center support) design units; is to install an early unit HOLLOW intermediate shaft to bring a HUGE increase of Planetary cooling/ lube.
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 112
Likes: 7
From: Vancouver, WA
A. common misconception that the 97+ (rear cooler port) trans were better at lube/cooling. They're not (at least in my personal opinion)
If you're removing all of the front end parts...might as well go with C6 vette oil pan and pickup
Jakes kit is very good...if you're buying his kit, get his 4340 input shaft.
Shame to see a rainier lose awd. but to each their own.
I assume with the 80e swap you'll be using a 2wd core and eliminating the transfer case entirely?
If you're removing all of the front end parts...might as well go with C6 vette oil pan and pickup
Jakes kit is very good...if you're buying his kit, get his 4340 input shaft.
Shame to see a rainier lose awd. but to each their own.
I assume with the 80e swap you'll be using a 2wd core and eliminating the transfer case entirely?
It might just be worth it getting the lvl 3 kit from Jakes if I'm going to get the rollerized hub anyways. Seems like getting the rollerized hub but not the harder input shaft is pointless.
TECH Junkie
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,202
Likes: 1,390
From: Nitro Alley
What is all the fuss over the forward clutch hub having a torrington bearing???
Don't get me wrong... I do prefer to build these with a torrington bearing between the forward and direct drums.
BUT IN NO WAY is this a modification for increased power handling.
With the way this unit is originally designed to pass thrust force to the back of the unit... the bearing here is not much of anything beneficial.
It is a nice small way to reduce friction and heat when not in direct drive.
Now if you ground the thrust forces at the center support buy machining the center support for a torrington bearing that supports the direct drum...
The forward clutch hub having a torrington bearing is a more significant factor..
Bottom line... do not stress having the bearing in this location.
The metallurgy of the hub is a tremendously bigger factor!
Don't get me wrong... I do prefer to build these with a torrington bearing between the forward and direct drums.
BUT IN NO WAY is this a modification for increased power handling.
With the way this unit is originally designed to pass thrust force to the back of the unit... the bearing here is not much of anything beneficial.
It is a nice small way to reduce friction and heat when not in direct drive.
Now if you ground the thrust forces at the center support buy machining the center support for a torrington bearing that supports the direct drum...
The forward clutch hub having a torrington bearing is a more significant factor..
Bottom line... do not stress having the bearing in this location.
The metallurgy of the hub is a tremendously bigger factor!
Last edited by vorteciroc; Sep 30, 2019 at 11:03 PM.
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TECH Junkie
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 3,612
Likes: 1,324
From: Iowa
Agreed 100%
rollerizing is a "nice to do while you're at it" type of deal...but it's not going to increase how much power the trans can take. The selected metal will affect the power.
The 80e used a cast steel fwd hub. Conservatively rated 700 horse. I have some out there with more than that...but anything that gets a t brake from me gets a billet input and since I'm doing that it gets a forged fwd hub.
I then save the steel hubs for lower powered th400's because they got a cast iron (pretty brittle and not great for performance use) hub.
-jakes stg. 2
-jakes budget 4340 input
-get enough fluid in it
-race in d3 shifter position
you'll have a 1000 horse trans all day long
rollerizing is a "nice to do while you're at it" type of deal...but it's not going to increase how much power the trans can take. The selected metal will affect the power.
The 80e used a cast steel fwd hub. Conservatively rated 700 horse. I have some out there with more than that...but anything that gets a t brake from me gets a billet input and since I'm doing that it gets a forged fwd hub.
I then save the steel hubs for lower powered th400's because they got a cast iron (pretty brittle and not great for performance use) hub.
-jakes stg. 2
-jakes budget 4340 input
-get enough fluid in it
-race in d3 shifter position
you'll have a 1000 horse trans all day long
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Brett Foote Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 112
Likes: 7
From: Vancouver, WA
It seems the stage 2 already has an aftermarket front hub. It uses the term "Machined forward hub with torrington bearing."
I don't see where Jakes will just include the input shaft but not the rollerized front hub, I may have to call them and see if they could include it.
I really appreciate you guys. Most of what Im asking/discussing is just my take away from a lot of reading and likely isn't right, that's why Im here. Thanks again.
I don't see where Jakes will just include the input shaft but not the rollerized front hub, I may have to call them and see if they could include it.
I really appreciate you guys. Most of what Im asking/discussing is just my take away from a lot of reading and likely isn't right, that's why Im here. Thanks again.
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 112
Likes: 7
From: Vancouver, WA
I apparently didn't dig enough on the their site, I see it now.
Thanks again!
https://shop.jakesperformance.com/sh...-shaft-1000-hp
Thanks again!
https://shop.jakesperformance.com/sh...-shaft-1000-hp
TECH Junkie
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,202
Likes: 1,390
From: Nitro Alley
Damn that's cheap!
Well that is one shaft I am not going to produce in-house anymore... The 4340 Chromoly is too expensive compared to that price!
I wonder if it is possibly 4130... nah still too expensive.
Well that is one shaft I am not going to produce in-house anymore... The 4340 Chromoly is too expensive compared to that price!
I wonder if it is possibly 4130... nah still too expensive.