Look at the Pump Pocket from a Mid to Late Model-Year THM400 Pump (Casting ends in #895).
You will find a very simple difference compared to the 4L80E Pocket.

Do not use any Early THM400 Pump Casting for comparison.

 

yeah that pocket and a cheap wear plate and they seem to go damn near 2 full seasons without much issue. I get more customers coming back for the "just in case" refreshment than i do because there's a problem. (probably fuggin jinxed myself right there dammit)

and yeah i know that idle pressure is low. i was gonna pull the plug for one drilled to .040 but when I had the trans out over last winter, but everything was so mint with over 100 passes that i just buttoned it right back up and minded my own business. deep staging was/is probably the best way to launch that pig anyways. (not my car anymore)

the intermediates getting smoked every 50 passes went away when I made a rear-mount pick up tube.

 

Facing it keeps from welding itself to the pump. At .002-.0025 clearance, I’ve broke several gear sets and they always have signs of too much friction. Never had a problem at .004.

 

There's better ways than wear plates or inefficient pumps to solve these issues. The wear plates work fine to protect the stator side, but they won't protect the pocket from getting beat up.

Hint: WHY does the 80e gear have more thrust and gear housing/stator wear. Think about the WHY first then we can start discussing the remedy

 

Speaking of 80E Pumps...

I am going through my stash of Junk and came across some Prototype Parts in different stages of design completion.
Nothing interesting yet...

But somewhere here I should have a few Prototype Pumps.

They are Aluminum Body Pumps that use Gerotor Gears for Diesel Engines.
They use a Pressure Regulator Valve-Train that looks like slighter larger 4L60E Parts and uses the 60E Pressure-Relief Ball and Spring.


IIRC this Pump was never produced due to the Alison 1000 Transmission being ready...
And we did not want to use a Gerotor Pump for Gasoline Engines (due to higher RPM ranges).

 

When it goes into lockup, the gear gets pushed into pump.

 

Wow! That’s some cool stuff, man. An aluminum pump would shave a bit of weight. 😁

 

Yes I always wondered why the 4l80e didn't get an aluminum pump. I actually like the vane style from the 60e such high flow capabilities.

 

The 4L80E really needs an Iron Pump with the Type of Oil-Pump Gears that are used.

An aluminum Casting would result in accelerated Pump Pocket Wear and Tear (No good)...
Especially without the Cutout for the Pump Pocket that is found in #895 Later THM400 Pump Front-Halves.

Myself, other Builders here, and other Builders that Specialize in High-Performance 4L80Es Add/ Machine this Cutout into the Pump Pocket.
Doing so makes a substantial difference, especially with Fixed Line-Pressure.
I have Pumps with Fixed Line-Pressure as low as 165Psi and up to 210Psi... Maximum is usually 220Psi* (* =Extreme Builds ONLY and is RARE).

The THM400 and 4L80E really do not need much Line-Pressure (even at something like 1,000 HP).
Oil Volume, Apply Piston Design, Clutch Surface Area, all make for great Clutch holding ability and performance.

The Designs for the Components of the THM400 and 4L80E come from the Time of the Muscle Car Era.
Some Productions Engines were Making a good 500 HP and 550 Ft/ Lbs in Reality (I don't care what the Ratings on paper were).
Some Special Order Engine Packages were Making a good 700 HP.

Compare that to the 200 HP Corvette Engine that the THM700-R4 and 4L60E were Designed for.

 

I machine the pump pocket between the pump and outer gear on every build. This doesn’t help the inner gear though.

 

pics?

 

It's not quite that simple
Really it's not quite accurate because there is oil on both sides of the pump gears so they float

If it was just being "pushed" then you adding some gear clearance wouldn't really help much.

 

I have never ran a Pump with 0.0040" Clearance...

I can't believe that idle pressures would be acceptable.

 

Extra clearance keeps the gear from welding itself to pump. This is a common issue in high hp drag applications.

Keeping the pump alive with fixed line pressure is another issue. During lockup, the converter pressure pushes the inner gear towards the pump pocket. What’s your fix for that?

 

If there's a hole in your boat, do you just install a bigger bilge pump to keep it from sinking or do you plug the hole?

The gear welding to the pump is the after effect of prior failures. It isn't the root failure. And its not a common issue on high hp drag applications unless they're just slapped together using stock pump parts and theory.

I'd much rather address the actual CAUSE for the thing wanting to eat pump gears for breakfast.

Need to address the hub and pump gear marriage.
Need to address the lockup pressure and how it can wedge the gear onto the hub.
Then 3rd we can address pump gear lubrication without sacrificing efficiency and making the pump gear clearance crappy so it floats up and down an extra 2-3 thou which also is not good.

 

Wow I missed a ton of posts on my thread jeez.... anyway all is still well here. Haven't used the trans brake yet. The trans was built by Mike Kapavic out of Ohio. Near Columbus.