White98Z

iTrader: (3)

http://www.redrider.us/4l80e_perform...nsmissions.htm This is what i am going to get one of these days. Plus it comes with a LS1 case. So you get all the bolts back.

taqwache

2crzy4u has a great idea but i like this 4L80 one better. although, i just came back from my 60 mile round trip and i am still happy with my daily driver TH400. 4 grand the whole way with out problems, again.

nbm00ws6

iTrader: (4)

I have a Rossler 400 turbo with a gear venders overdrive unit installed. I like it alot and have yet to have a problem with it. I installed it myself along with the help of Mike Brown and under the watchful eyes of Reckless. lol I didn't use all the computer control stuff that shifts to od automatic by itself. I just installed the foot switch(old type dimmer switch) so when I want od I step on it once, and when I want to go back to the regular gear I step on it once more=works great. I have yet to use it at the track to see if my et's or mph pick up. My shipping weight for the box the gear venders came in was like #47. If you need a vender to buy from send me a email and I can hook you up with someone. But if you go with a Rossler tranny, Carl and the boys at Rossler are a gearvenders dealer.
Tom

taqwache

nbm00ws6, did you have to mod the floor board or did it clear fine?

Quickin

Wait a minute, explain this to me some more. What do I need to do to make my rear end stronger. Tell me what I need to buy? Why do I always hear about the little things after I buy a product?

Thanks.

Quickin

OK, the gears are the same from 1-3. But which is truly stronger?

Which would you use in my car, consider the BIG hit of spray though. Also, the spray will ONLY be from a roll, not from a dig.

nbm00ws6

iTrader: (4)

No modding of the floor was needed for the install. I did have to turn my driveshaft loop around due to it hitting the gearvenders unit.
Tom

F1_SS

Same thing has happened to me many times, everybody has a better way of doing things or has a "hookup" after i buy or do something.

NA$TY-TA

iTrader: (21)

[QUOTE=2crzy4u]
US Gear V2OD overdrive unit with a 70% O.D. gear---$1435

QUOTE]


Does that unit mount up to a TH-350 also???????
Thanks
Kyle

Steve who did you race?? Did you drive out to Odem to race Phil??

1QWIKZ

iTrader: (6)

dunno about the th400 with a GV OD being heavier than a 4l80E.. carl rossler told me that they weigh about the same (maybe less on the th400 with the GV od ) but that the th400 will get you better gass mileage.

James B.

iTrader: (1)

I would choose (and did choose) the 4L80-E. The 80 has a bigger input shaft than a TH400, has lockup capabilities, and is fully programmable for EVERYTHING when connected to an appropriate controller.

The range sensor on a 97-up 4L80-E is identical to late-model 4L60-E and the linkage will hook up exactly the same. Even the speed sensor is exactly the same.

We talk about drag cars and street cars, but I swear this transmission can serve double duty. I have mine programmed to shift silky-stock-like-smooth at low throttle positions. It feel 100% stock in every way,at LOW TPS only... I have the line pressure programmed to ramp up quickly after 20% throttle to the point where WOT shifts are very firm and fast. There is so much over head in the line pressure table that I do not use I could have tire-barking shifts if I wanted to, but there's no point to having that. The only true weakness to these trannies is the Overdrive clutches, and that's based on unavailability of performance materials for them. The overdrive planetary itself is MASSIVE. The planet gears on the OD are truly huge. This thing was intentionally overbuilt.

Imagine this:
With a 4L80-E you can program your shifts to be as firm or soft as you want at any throttle position, in each gear, and shift at whatever speed you want in each gear, based on any TPS values. You can lock up the converter any time you want to, manually, automatically, only above a certain speed, only below a certain TPS value, and as firmly as you prefer. If it isn't quite PERFECT and you happen to have a controller as sweet as TCI's, you can have your passenger LOG INTO the thing WHILE you are driving down the road and tweak it in REAL TIME.

Personally, I cannot see why anyone would remove the electronics from a 4L80-E. With TCI's controller you can even paddle-shift it. This trans was born to be automatic and it SHINES doing so. I know I seem a little bit insane about this stuff, it's because I acknowledge this transmission as the marvelously engineered piece of powertrain that it is. In a time where tuneability makes or breaks a motor setup, how could anyone NOT want what a fully-electronic automatic 4L80-E offers?

Granted this is a 6000-pound giant slow truck compared to a small light Camaro, but listen to it shift.
http://james.jaguar.net/pics/0-80.mpg

1QWIKZ

iTrader: (6)

do you think the TH400 with lock up and a GV OD will be better?

James B.

iTrader: (1)

There is only one situtation where that would be better, but better is relative and I'll explain why.

The situation is a full-throttle 3-4 shift. The 4L80-E is weak doing that and should not be shifted under more than 600HP during the 3-4. It's not going to break, but the clutches could overheat and warp or cone.

The Gear Vendors OD can shift at full thottle at any speed. The PROBLEM with that is the Gear Vendor's line pressure does not change with input torque the way the transmission does. That means that it will always be firm. I have shifted the thing at 100mph WOT before and it is extremely violent. The Gear Vendors OD engages very firmly under power to the point where driveline stresses created could be a factor. There is no way to regulate this. You cannot program it.

Because the 4L80-E can be programmed and the rear can be geared to never need a WOT 3-4 shift, I still vote for a fully-automatic 4L80-E along with a great controller like TCI's.

Quickin

Alrighty then.

Before I buy a new tranny I need to know everything about the two set ups we're talking about here, which you pretty much outlined, but what about how they pertain to MY set up?

I'm certain to have well over 500 RWHP N/A after I install the FAST 90mm stuff and the new AFR 225 heads, and my small cam upgrade (248/252 114 lsa), and redo my exhaust. No question about it.

I'm also having the FAST plumbed for a 250 or 300 hp DP nitrous system, it will be progressively controlled, but its still gonna be one hell of a hard hit of torque. It will only be used FROM A ROLL, this is not a track car.

You say that the 4L80E is only good for 3-4 shifts to 600 hp, thats not gonna cut it.

You also say the GV OD shifts into OD very hard, but is that when I'm driving casually on the HWY too, or just at WOT?

James B.

iTrader: (1)

It shifts hard always, but at lower throttle positions the toque converter takes up the jolt easily. The more throttle and/or engine RPM there is during the engagement the harder the jolt. In fact, the GV controller cuts signal to the converter clutch while it engages - by design.

The power the OD clutch on the 4L80-E can shift is only a limiting factor if you run out of gear in third with the pedal to the floor. You'd have to be hauling some serious ***. It does, of course, depend on how the car is geared. The 4L80-E doesn't have the same range as a 60, so getting an equivent launch takes gearing down the rear end. Unfortunately the more you do that the closer you get to needing WOT 3-4 shift capabilities.

How big are the tires on an F-Body? About 26" I am guessing? What do you want to shift at and where's the redline? How about 6300/6500? Given those factors how fast do you want to be able to run to at full throttle? 140 maybe?

Given those guesstimations you could run 3.42 gears and get to 147mph in third gear with the converter locked before you hit a redline of 6500. You would only need a 3-4 shift if you wanted to go faster than that. lol

If you gear it exactly like you would for a TH400 it will do everything the same on the track and give you the OD for the street.

Quickin

My rev limiter is set at 6950. I will usually do a run from 40-50 to about 150 mph. I currently have 3.73's.

James B.

iTrader: (1)

With 26" tires and 3.73 gears you could go 144mph in third gear before hitting the 6950RPM rev limit.

Quickin

Hmmmm. But if I always made that 3-4 shift at 144mph and WOT, the tranny wouldn't last long?

Would the repairs be in-depth repairs or could I refresh the tranny every 6-8 months pretty easily and inexpensive?

It (4L80E) seems like the better choice I guess. Will it shift just like stock as far as just having to put it in "3" or "D", and it will automatically shift up and down, right?

If the two trannies are basically the same, then why does the 4L80E fit better?

Thanks for the info so far, I'll follow up with ya tomorrow

James B.

iTrader: (1)

It depends entirely on how much power you've got at that speed. The faster the engine RPM is the great the difference in RPM the clutches have to overcome for a shift. It compounds quickly. It only take one overheating to ruin a clutch pack.
The overdrive clutches are easily accessible by removing the front pump and overdrive planetary/overrun assembly. After that those clutches are the very next thing. Here's a picture:

It will upshift and downshift exactly as you program it to, perfectly every time. These transmissions are very consistent, not flakey like the 60.
I'm not really following what you're asking here. As far as physical fitment the TH400 would be a little bit easier than a 4L80-E, but a TH400 AND a Gear Vendors OD is a long piece of drivetrain. Here's a picture of my 4L80-E and Gear Vendors OD:

It's L-O-N-G! TH400+GV would be similar, and pretty dang heavy. The setup in that picture with the converter weighs over 300 pounds! The 80 by with a little converter without the GV should weigh in at about 240lbs.

NA$TY-TA

iTrader: (21)

I thought we were still having problems getting the PCM in our F-Bodys to control the 4L80E?????? Are you saying you have double OD???? Because 4th in the 4L80E is OD and you have a GV there also for a even lower 4th gear????? How does that work? wjat all does the piece from TCi you were talking about do and how much is it??? Are we going to need a truck PCM???? I all ready have a truck motor..6.0L...... Anyone know if we CAN control a 4L80E in a F-Body????? Since you know the math think on MPH...... What is thr max MPH for a TH-350 in with a 3.50 rear gear and a 28" tall tire? I spin to 6600rpm.... rev lim is at 7000.
Thanks
Kyle