Shift Kit: Good or Bad Idea?
jxaxsxoxn you misquoted what I said to humiliate me and to make me look foolish ... don't ever do that again. That was your point in your opening statement about me, was it not?
So **** it, I'm sick of offering advice for free or opinions or nothing, whatever you choose to call what I do here.
Can't joke with someone without putting a million cute little smileys after it I guess. And still it's not taken as a joke. I'm done with this, you all can do without me. I've got better **** to do. .
But I don't really favor
stacking up six washers just to shock the hell out of the
drivetrain
stacking up six washers just to shock the hell out of the
drivetrain
I've been thinking more along the lines of the simple B&M
shift improver kits, though I haven't seen much on these
shift improver kits, though I haven't seen much on these
Transgo gives you washers to select from, three.
B&M gives you little pieces of steel tube to do what the washers do. Block the 1-2 accumulator.
B&M is ****, so you'll never hear otherwise from me.
Robbie, nice shootin' the bull with you on that ride today. You'll love the converter when you get it done. I think you did good with the TCI ... takes a little getting used to.
Rolling hard into the gears without breaking the steady, forward momentum of that 3,680 pound rocket is what you want. Jerking through the gears and disrupting the momentum is not how you want to race ... will cost you that 1/10th which will lose races for you ... just my .02 cents.
I'll let you know on the tires. I have to call and order the Nitto's tomorrow ... should have them on by the weekend and the 255's out front are yours if you still want them.
Rolling hard into the gears without breaking the steady, forward momentum of that 3,680 pound rocket is what you want. Jerking through the gears and disrupting the momentum is not how you want to race ... will cost you that 1/10th which will lose races for you ... just my .02 cents.
I'll let you know on the tires. I have to call and order the Nitto's tomorrow ... should have them on by the weekend and the 255's out front are yours if you still want them.
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 6,216
Likes: 236
From: Wichita KS / Rancho San Diego
Originally Posted by jxaxsxoxn
You can do all you want to the programming and you're not going to get the same fluid volume to where it needs to be, you can raise the pressures and it'll stuff as much it can through a small feed holes. But thats not going to be the most beneficial.
Thread Starter
Launching!
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 214
Likes: 0
From: Lake Mary, Florida
Originally Posted by jxaxsxoxn
No **** I get it......but why do they do this.
Do they have 15 people with 4 1/2 years? 10 with 7 years? or 2 with 35 years?
It's a bogus sales pitch that means nothing to me.
You can do all you want to the programming and you're not going to get the same fluid volume to where it needs to be, you can raise the pressures and it'll stuff as much it can through a small feed holes. But thats not going to be the most beneficial.
Do what you want.
Do they have 15 people with 4 1/2 years? 10 with 7 years? or 2 with 35 years?
It's a bogus sales pitch that means nothing to me.
You can do all you want to the programming and you're not going to get the same fluid volume to where it needs to be, you can raise the pressures and it'll stuff as much it can through a small feed holes. But thats not going to be the most beneficial.
Do what you want.
Originally Posted by JEB99TA
All 4 of these guys have over 70 years experience as transmission specialists
4L60-E's are not strong enough to survive being set up to shift hard. The splines, planet carriers, reaction shell, drum, etc. are ALL to underbuilt to handle the shear jolting forces.
A shift kit set up to shift hard will kill the transmission in short order. In fact, there is a thrust washer against the rear plent that can become overworked with hard shifts or electronically (bad programming) increased line pressure enough to shread it and lodge it into the gears. This will be expensive death too - damaged hard parts.
Set it up to shift firmly but smoothly without any banging or jolting and it actually will last longer. The Transgo fixes problematic things with the valvebody too, it's not just a simple "shift-kit."
A shift kit set up to shift hard will kill the transmission in short order. In fact, there is a thrust washer against the rear plent that can become overworked with hard shifts or electronically (bad programming) increased line pressure enough to shread it and lodge it into the gears. This will be expensive death too - damaged hard parts.
Set it up to shift firmly but smoothly without any banging or jolting and it actually will last longer. The Transgo fixes problematic things with the valvebody too, it's not just a simple "shift-kit."
Will a tranny cooler give me more sufficient shifts? I just got my PCM reprogrammed to a lot harder shifting, is a tranny cooler necessary? I'm also getting a torque converter. I ask about the tranny cooler because I see a lot of people ahve them, is it wise to get one when you get a shift kit/PCM tune?
LS1 Tech Stories
The Best V8 Stories One Small Block at Time
6 Common C5 Corvette Failures and What's Involved In Repairing Them
Pouria Savadkouei
Retro Modern Bandit Pontiac Trans AM Comes With Burt Reynolds' Autograph
Verdad Gallardo
Top 10 Greatest Cadillac V Series Performance Models Ever, Ranked
Pouria Savadkouei
Top 10 Most Powerful Chevy Trucks Ever Made!
Hennessey's New Supercharged Silverado ZR2 Has 700 HP
Verdad Gallardo
Coachbuilt N2A Anteros Is an LS2-Powered C6 Corvette In Italian Clothes
Verdad Gallardo
Awesome K5 Blazer Restomod Comes With C7 Corvette Power
Verdad Gallardo
10 Camaros You Should Never Buy
10 LS Engine Myths That Refuse to Die
Verdad Gallardo
Originally Posted by James B.
4L60-E's are not strong enough to survive being set up to shift hard. The splines, planet carriers, reaction shell, drum, etc. are ALL to underbuilt to handle the shear jolting forces.
A shift kit set up to shift hard will kill the transmission in short order. In fact, there is a thrust washer against the rear plent that can become overworked with hard shifts or electronically (bad programming) increased line pressure enough to shread it and lodge it into the gears. This will be expensive death too - damaged hard parts.
Set it up to shift firmly but smoothly without any banging or jolting and it actually will last longer. The Transgo fixes problematic things with the valvebody too, it's not just a simple "shift-kit."
A shift kit set up to shift hard will kill the transmission in short order. In fact, there is a thrust washer against the rear plent that can become overworked with hard shifts or electronically (bad programming) increased line pressure enough to shread it and lodge it into the gears. This will be expensive death too - damaged hard parts.
Set it up to shift firmly but smoothly without any banging or jolting and it actually will last longer. The Transgo fixes problematic things with the valvebody too, it's not just a simple "shift-kit."
Later after blowing the trans up I find out increasing line pressure that way is a very bad thing, but unlike what he told me that increased my line pressure all accross the board even while shifting from park. I never knew how hard the trans was or wasn't supposed to shift, but my 4300lb car (b-body) would bark the **** out of the tires at less than 1/4 throttle on the 1-2 shift going 20mph.
When the new rebuilder tore the trans apart besides the poor work he found the reverse drum had been sorched, The foward sprag had completely reversed itself, and the input planet literally exploded.
My new trans has a trans-go shift kit and I love it. I only have around 500 miles on the new trans and converter, but the shifts are nice and smooth at part throttle and affirmative at WOT. the trans came installed w/ no washers for the shift kit, but I will be pulling the pan and adding one washer, just to make it a tad firmer. I say for the money they're well worth it. They help address the few problems that arise in the trans such as the slow delay into reverse.
Matt
Restricted User
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 377
Likes: 0
You want the shifts to be smooth at light throttle openings, & with the shifts getting firmer with more throttle, this will give you the best chance at a long life with the minimum of problems. Now you see what I have been saying for years, you do not need firm shifts at light throttle openings, as they can be destructive, along with all the other good side effects.
TECH Senior Member
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 6,157
Likes: 1
From: Texas
Originally Posted by blind527
Will a tranny cooler give me more sufficient shifts? I just got my PCM reprogrammed to a lot harder shifting, is a tranny cooler necessary? I'm also getting a torque converter. I ask about the tranny cooler because I see a lot of people ahve them, is it wise to get one when you get a shift kit/PCM tune?
Youll have to get one when you get a converter.
I was asking the same thing ... wish I had went with a 24,000 GVW, but, my 19,000 one is sufficient with the 160* thermostat, I think. Not sure how a shift kit would effect the tranny temps (FLTransAm02), but, it would be worth looking into. Anyone know for sure?
Robbie, the more I see here, the more a shift kit sounds good. Just not convinced that drilling the tranny is a good idea and the big thing that has me concerned is that there are several shops I called over the past few days that simply will not install the shift kit you're inquiring about. Ask Mike Norris or Jake Lamotta. I haven't called them and they are very respected PERFORMANCE shops in our local area. I'd say just go with their rceommendation if you have the financial option of having the kit done while at the same time you're doing the TC install.
My point is that I don't think one is needed for your level of converter with your 3.23 gears. for the goals you are seeking. I also don't want you to regret not doing it later. I'll take you over to both places and talk to them if you want, on Saturday. Stop by if you want to discuss.
My point is that I don't think one is needed for your level of converter with your 3.23 gears. for the goals you are seeking. I also don't want you to regret not doing it later. I'll take you over to both places and talk to them if you want, on Saturday. Stop by if you want to discuss.
Thread Starter
Launching!
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 214
Likes: 0
From: Lake Mary, Florida
Yea, I talked to Norris, he said a shift kit couldnt hurt, but that it wasnt really too neccisary.....Im not sure yet, im still saving up..
Its frustrating having a 3500 stall converter under your bed, and not having the funds to have it installed yet :-/..
Soon though...!Any news on those tires Jack?
Its frustrating having a 3500 stall converter under your bed, and not having the funds to have it installed yet :-/..
Soon though...!Any news on those tires Jack?
12 Second Club
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 527
Likes: 0
From: Chicago, IL
Just be willing to buy a new transmission if your breaks. I put a shift kit in mine and the pressure built up so much that the piston housing blew out and cracked the case. No Case No Tranny. You have to buy another one, and you can't even use yours as a core trade.
Thank god mine was still under warranty and the tranny guy at the dealership was cool. He aslo told me that if I want hard clean shifts just raise the line pressure. That keeps it under the safe limit, as soon as you start changing things inside you risk damaging the Tranny. That is what I was told. This is from a guy that used to work on race cars.
Thank god mine was still under warranty and the tranny guy at the dealership was cool. He aslo told me that if I want hard clean shifts just raise the line pressure. That keeps it under the safe limit, as soon as you start changing things inside you risk damaging the Tranny. That is what I was told. This is from a guy that used to work on race cars.
12 Second Club
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 527
Likes: 0
From: Chicago, IL
Originally Posted by FLTransAm02
Wouldn't raising the line pressure enhance the risk of hurting something? more pressure = more stress?
My experience with a custom shift kit. I like it!
About 2,500 miles ago I had a PI vig 2800 converter installed at a respected transmission shop. I also had the owner put in a enhanced valved body and pump. Bascially, he machined me a custom shift kit to enhance the shifting, increase transmission fluid circulation in certain gears were in the stock form it typically doesn't have enough, blah blah.
I can't tell you if it will increase the life of the transmission because I haven't driven it 10s of thousands of miles.
Driving the car, it shifts immediate and without harshness. Normal driving, I can barely feel the transmission shift from 1st to 2nd and 2nd to 3rd. With the converter, the enigine revs between 2k and 3k and the 1 to 2 shift it shifts without the rpms dropping.
I think its a pretty sweet set-up and compliments the stall converter. Also shifting in park and reverse is exactly like stock.
About 2,500 miles ago I had a PI vig 2800 converter installed at a respected transmission shop. I also had the owner put in a enhanced valved body and pump. Bascially, he machined me a custom shift kit to enhance the shifting, increase transmission fluid circulation in certain gears were in the stock form it typically doesn't have enough, blah blah.
I can't tell you if it will increase the life of the transmission because I haven't driven it 10s of thousands of miles.
Driving the car, it shifts immediate and without harshness. Normal driving, I can barely feel the transmission shift from 1st to 2nd and 2nd to 3rd. With the converter, the enigine revs between 2k and 3k and the 1 to 2 shift it shifts without the rpms dropping.
I think its a pretty sweet set-up and compliments the stall converter. Also shifting in park and reverse is exactly like stock.