6l90e ....... Is Here.......
01-08-2008, 12:59 PM
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6l90e ....... Is Here....... For release: Jan. 14, 2008, 12:01 a.m. EST
ALL-NEW CTS-V TARGETS 550 SUPERCHARGED HORSEPOWER WITH CADILLAC’S SIGNATURE REFINEMENT
DETROIT – The all-new, 2009 Cadillac CTS-V blends exceptional performance with uncompromising refinement and its unique, 6.2L supercharged V-8 engine is, perhaps, the most dramatic example of the performance sedan’s world-class comportment.
Targeting 550 horsepower (410 kW) and 550 lb.-ft. of torque (745 Nm) – final SAE certified power levels will be available in early April 2008 – the CTS-V’s new LSA engine will be the most powerful ever offered in Cadillac’s nearly 106-year history. It is based on GM’s legendary small-block V-8 architecture and features an intercooled supercharger system, premium heat-resistant aluminum-alloy cylinder heads and numerous details designed to ensure the LSA makes its power as quietly and smoothly as possible.
“From the very start, engineers were cognizant of the role a high-performance engine plays in supporting the qualities customers expect in a Cadillac,” said Jim Taylor, Cadillac general manager. “The supercharged LSA engine delivers outstanding performance, but maximum power didn’t come at the expense of refinement or quietness.”
To achieve the desired balance between performance and drivability, the LSA was designed with numerous features and components that attenuate noise, including the supercharger. It has a new, four-lobe rotor design that enhances quietness while also optimizing the performance parameters of the engine.
A pair of six-speed transmissions is offered with the LSA: A new, Tremec TR6060 six-speed manual with a dual-disc clutch; and a Hydra-Matic 6L90 six-speed automatic with paddle-shift control – the first automatic offered in the CTS-V. Each transmission is designed to channel the engine’s tremendous power while simultaneously delivering exceptional refinement and smoothness.
Supercharged power and superior refinement
Delivering more than merely milestone power numbers, the LSA engine’s sixth-generation Eaton supercharger enables a broader range of power through the rpm band. This gives the engine great low-end torque and excellent horsepower at higher rpm – the range of the rpm band where a supercharger generally loses its effectiveness.
“The new design of the supercharger’s rotating internal components extends its effective range, giving the engine a wide, flat power band that is usable at all rpm levels,” said Ron Meegan, assistant chief engineer. “Whether at low speeds or on the highway, the
feeling of power is instant, strong and sustained.”
An intercooler mounted atop the engine sends the supercharger’s pressurized air through a heat exchanger to lower its temperature before entering the engine’s intake system. The cooler air is denser, helping the engine maximize performance.
Complementing the LSA’s tremendous output is a combination of components and design elements designed to ensure a quiet, refined driving experience. Examples include:
Balanced, lightweight reciprocating assembly
Hypereutectic pistons
Lower-lift, low overlap camshaft
Center-feed fuel system
Acoustic engine cover
Piston oil squirters
The new, four-lobe rotor design of the sixth-generation Eaton supercharger also contributes significantly to the LSA’s quiet performance. In fact, the quiet operation of the supercharger system fooled several onlookers during the CTS-V’s development – onlookers who were convinced that a prototype running at wide-open throttle on Germany’s famed Nürburgring racing circuit couldn’t possibly have a supercharger because there was no audible sound from the drive system.
“The characteristic whine of the supercharger is drastically reduced because of the LSA’s four-lobe rotor design,” said Meegan. “And with the other noise-reduction features used throughout, the sound is virtually eliminated.”
Transmission details
The new TR6060 transmission is based on the proven T56 six-speed used in the previous CTS-V, but upgraded to handle the LSA engine’s substantial increase in torque, as well as improve shift quality, via a dual-disc clutch system.
The twin-disc clutch delivers exceptional clamping power and excellent shift effort, achieved with the use of a pair of smaller-diameter clutch discs that have less inertia than a single, larger-diameter disc. Like the previous CTS-V, a dual-mass flywheel is used, which allows for smooth, chatter-free performance.
When it comes to the new automatic transmission, GM’s Hydra-Matic 6L90 six-speed automatic transmission features steering-wheel- and console-shifter-activated tap up/tap down gear control, as well as driver-selectable modes that deliver different performance characteristics, i.e. shift points, shift firmness, for different driving conditions. Performance Algorithm Shifting is part of the 6L90’s controller programming and provides a performance-oriented shift pattern during sustained high-performance driving, such as at a racetrack.
A twin-plate torque converter clutch is used with the 6L90 transmission to match the torque output of the LSA engine – the first twin-plate configuration used with GM’s 300-mm torque converter. Like the dual-disc clutch of the six-speed manual transmission, the twin-plate converter clutch provides exceptional clamping power.
New, Performance Traction Management technology works with the CTS-V’s engine and transmissions to optimize traction and maximize the performance driving experience.
ALL-NEW CTS-V TARGETS 550 SUPERCHARGED HORSEPOWER WITH CADILLAC’S SIGNATURE REFINEMENT
DETROIT – The all-new, 2009 Cadillac CTS-V blends exceptional performance with uncompromising refinement and its unique, 6.2L supercharged V-8 engine is, perhaps, the most dramatic example of the performance sedan’s world-class comportment.
Targeting 550 horsepower (410 kW) and 550 lb.-ft. of torque (745 Nm) – final SAE certified power levels will be available in early April 2008 – the CTS-V’s new LSA engine will be the most powerful ever offered in Cadillac’s nearly 106-year history. It is based on GM’s legendary small-block V-8 architecture and features an intercooled supercharger system, premium heat-resistant aluminum-alloy cylinder heads and numerous details designed to ensure the LSA makes its power as quietly and smoothly as possible.
“From the very start, engineers were cognizant of the role a high-performance engine plays in supporting the qualities customers expect in a Cadillac,” said Jim Taylor, Cadillac general manager. “The supercharged LSA engine delivers outstanding performance, but maximum power didn’t come at the expense of refinement or quietness.”
To achieve the desired balance between performance and drivability, the LSA was designed with numerous features and components that attenuate noise, including the supercharger. It has a new, four-lobe rotor design that enhances quietness while also optimizing the performance parameters of the engine.
A pair of six-speed transmissions is offered with the LSA: A new, Tremec TR6060 six-speed manual with a dual-disc clutch; and a Hydra-Matic 6L90 six-speed automatic with paddle-shift control – the first automatic offered in the CTS-V. Each transmission is designed to channel the engine’s tremendous power while simultaneously delivering exceptional refinement and smoothness.
Supercharged power and superior refinement
Delivering more than merely milestone power numbers, the LSA engine’s sixth-generation Eaton supercharger enables a broader range of power through the rpm band. This gives the engine great low-end torque and excellent horsepower at higher rpm – the range of the rpm band where a supercharger generally loses its effectiveness.
“The new design of the supercharger’s rotating internal components extends its effective range, giving the engine a wide, flat power band that is usable at all rpm levels,” said Ron Meegan, assistant chief engineer. “Whether at low speeds or on the highway, the
feeling of power is instant, strong and sustained.”
An intercooler mounted atop the engine sends the supercharger’s pressurized air through a heat exchanger to lower its temperature before entering the engine’s intake system. The cooler air is denser, helping the engine maximize performance.
Complementing the LSA’s tremendous output is a combination of components and design elements designed to ensure a quiet, refined driving experience. Examples include:
Balanced, lightweight reciprocating assembly
Hypereutectic pistons
Lower-lift, low overlap camshaft
Center-feed fuel system
Acoustic engine cover
Piston oil squirters
The new, four-lobe rotor design of the sixth-generation Eaton supercharger also contributes significantly to the LSA’s quiet performance. In fact, the quiet operation of the supercharger system fooled several onlookers during the CTS-V’s development – onlookers who were convinced that a prototype running at wide-open throttle on Germany’s famed Nürburgring racing circuit couldn’t possibly have a supercharger because there was no audible sound from the drive system.
“The characteristic whine of the supercharger is drastically reduced because of the LSA’s four-lobe rotor design,” said Meegan. “And with the other noise-reduction features used throughout, the sound is virtually eliminated.”
Transmission details
The new TR6060 transmission is based on the proven T56 six-speed used in the previous CTS-V, but upgraded to handle the LSA engine’s substantial increase in torque, as well as improve shift quality, via a dual-disc clutch system.
The twin-disc clutch delivers exceptional clamping power and excellent shift effort, achieved with the use of a pair of smaller-diameter clutch discs that have less inertia than a single, larger-diameter disc. Like the previous CTS-V, a dual-mass flywheel is used, which allows for smooth, chatter-free performance.
When it comes to the new automatic transmission, GM’s Hydra-Matic 6L90 six-speed automatic transmission features steering-wheel- and console-shifter-activated tap up/tap down gear control, as well as driver-selectable modes that deliver different performance characteristics, i.e. shift points, shift firmness, for different driving conditions. Performance Algorithm Shifting is part of the 6L90’s controller programming and provides a performance-oriented shift pattern during sustained high-performance driving, such as at a racetrack.
A twin-plate torque converter clutch is used with the 6L90 transmission to match the torque output of the LSA engine – the first twin-plate configuration used with GM’s 300-mm torque converter. Like the dual-disc clutch of the six-speed manual transmission, the twin-plate converter clutch provides exceptional clamping power.
New, Performance Traction Management technology works with the CTS-V’s engine and transmissions to optimize traction and maximize the performance driving experience.
01-08-2008, 01:45 PM
#2
Tech Resident
Man, I thought the 6L90 was only good for low 4xx horsepower levels. 550 horsepower and torque?! It can handle that? 
Damn. I need to get me this car
Can't wait to see it!
Damn. I need to get me this car
Can't wait to see it!
01-08-2008, 05:18 PM
#3
I thought they were out and in use already. Anyways the gear ratios of
1-4.027
2-2.364
3-1.532
4-1.152
5-0.852
6-0.667
R-3.064
Don't look very performance oriented to me, not for a strip car anyway unless maybe you start out in second, in fact first looks about useless IMO.
25 pounds lighter than a 4L80E and a stand alone TCU make it sound appealing.
1-4.027
2-2.364
3-1.532
4-1.152
5-0.852
6-0.667
R-3.064
Don't look very performance oriented to me, not for a strip car anyway unless maybe you start out in second, in fact first looks about useless IMO.
25 pounds lighter than a 4L80E and a stand alone TCU make it sound appealing.
01-08-2008, 07:41 PM
#4
I agree the stand alone TCU does sound appealing. But, correct me f I am wrong, but I am confident it will need several PCM inputs. Not saying it won;t run standalone, but I think it is a ways out from going into a non specific vehicle.
We won't be going into R&D on it until next Winter.
g
We won't be going into R&D on it until next Winter.
g
01-08-2008, 08:27 PM
#5
I forgot where I got that pic but I had to go to another forum to get it to post here, I posted it there at least a few months ago. What ever company it was was well underway with retrofit kits, etc. I thought it was Speartech.
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01-09-2008, 11:06 AM
#8
Tech Resident
They can be made to fit easily. Remember, a 4L80E fits into an F-body and the 6L80E/6L90E is both smaller and lighter than a 4L80E. The 6L80E is about the same weight as a 4L60E, actually.
The problem is the transmission has an integrated PCM. The tranny is not controlled by the car's PCM like a 4L60E/4L80E, so a 6L80E/6L90E would not work with the F-body PCM. Some type of standalone controller has to be created in order for these transmissions to be used in 4th gen cars. From what I've heard, Speartech has been working on a prototype controller for quite some time and have made good progress with it. The 6L80E/6L90E may not be an option for us F-body guys at the time, but the future looks bright.
The problem is the transmission has an integrated PCM. The tranny is not controlled by the car's PCM like a 4L60E/4L80E, so a 6L80E/6L90E would not work with the F-body PCM. Some type of standalone controller has to be created in order for these transmissions to be used in 4th gen cars. From what I've heard, Speartech has been working on a prototype controller for quite some time and have made good progress with it. The 6L80E/6L90E may not be an option for us F-body guys at the time, but the future looks bright.
01-09-2008, 11:20 AM
#9
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just wait till speartech comes out with a harness, im sure they will and im sure this new tranny will eventually elbow out the 4l80e as people's tranny of choice, especially when they become more common in cars and truck and you can pick them up used from a junkyard
01-09-2008, 11:57 AM
#10
Tech Resident
I just find it very exiciting that we may be able to buy a BRAND NEW STOCK UNIT that could take 550 horsepower, unmodified. The fact that it's a brand new OEM unit means virtually no more builder errors at "Joe's Random Transmission Shop", plus probably a good, long warranty. It would be available to the mass public and you could get it fixed/replaced under some kind of warranty at virtually any dealer across the country. Best of all, it probably wouldn't be a whole lot more expensive than the strongest available 4L60E unit, plus you'll get 2 more gears and the luxury to run 2.73's with the feel of 3.73's thanks to the super low gearing.
I especially can't wait to see what built units offered by sponsors will be like. I wonder how hard this baby can be made to shift? Imagine chirping the 1-2, 2-3 and 3-4 in an automatic
I especially can't wait to see what built units offered by sponsors will be like. I wonder how hard this baby can be made to shift? Imagine chirping the 1-2, 2-3 and 3-4 in an automatic
01-09-2008, 12:17 PM
#11
What about the gear ratios?
It's about like a th350 with a granny gear and two overdrives.
1-2 is going to drop more than a 4L60E.
When would you ever use first in an f-body?
In fact my friends dad has one of these in a truck and iirc he says it only uses first in tow mode, also said it skips gears to keep it in a good power range. But even in a 2007 truck with a 6 liter he gets the same mileage as my old TBI 454 and 4L80E.
Anyone want to make a list of pro's and con's to putting these transmissions in f-bodies?
It's about like a th350 with a granny gear and two overdrives.
1-2 is going to drop more than a 4L60E.
When would you ever use first in an f-body?
In fact my friends dad has one of these in a truck and iirc he says it only uses first in tow mode, also said it skips gears to keep it in a good power range. But even in a 2007 truck with a 6 liter he gets the same mileage as my old TBI 454 and 4L80E.
Anyone want to make a list of pro's and con's to putting these transmissions in f-bodies?
01-09-2008, 12:20 PM
#12
01-09-2008, 02:50 PM
#14
Tech Resident
What about the gear ratios?
It's about like a th350 with a granny gear and two overdrives.
1-2 is going to drop more than a 4L60E.
When would you ever use first in an f-body?
In fact my friends dad has one of these in a truck and iirc he says it only uses first in tow mode, also said it skips gears to keep it in a good power range. But even in a 2007 truck with a 6 liter he gets the same mileage as my old TBI 454 and 4L80E.
Anyone want to make a list of pro's and con's to putting these transmissions in f-bodies?
It's about like a th350 with a granny gear and two overdrives.
1-2 is going to drop more than a 4L60E.
When would you ever use first in an f-body?
In fact my friends dad has one of these in a truck and iirc he says it only uses first in tow mode, also said it skips gears to keep it in a good power range. But even in a 2007 truck with a 6 liter he gets the same mileage as my old TBI 454 and 4L80E.
Anyone want to make a list of pro's and con's to putting these transmissions in f-bodies?
That's the point of the first gear. You can put 2.73's in the car and get acceleration comparable to 3.73's in an F-body, plus get the highway RPM's of 2.73's during overdrive. It's the best of both worlds - good acceleration and low highway rpm's.
Even better yet is 2.73's are a stronger gear since they're thicker and they also dyno higher. The benefits keep stacking up for this tranny. You just can't run 3.73's with it. That would be...silly...
01-09-2008, 03:56 PM
#15
Yea it's good for an engine with a "wide flat powerband", what it was designed to run behind. It's a great transmission for the applications it was designed for, not for most f-bodies that typically produce power up high and can't cruise at 1700 rpm.
It would just be better with different gear ratios, think about it if it were close ratio 1,2,3,4 then wide 5,6. Then it would be the perfect f-body trans.
It would just be better with different gear ratios, think about it if it were close ratio 1,2,3,4 then wide 5,6. Then it would be the perfect f-body trans.
01-09-2008, 06:41 PM
#16
I would have liked to see a closer ratio for the 1-2 and a lower 6th. It is still a big improvement for performance and economy over the 4L60e.
It would work great with an F-body. Anything from 2.73 - 3.42s will work.
How massive a cam do you have that it can't cruise at 1700? If someone has +10 overlap at .05 cam, which is as big or bigger than 75% of the LS1Techers use, and can't make it cruise at 1600 rpm, they need a class on tuning.
It's a great transmission for the applications it was designed for, not for most f-bodies that typically produce power up high and can't cruise at 1700 rpm.
How massive a cam do you have that it can't cruise at 1700? If someone has +10 overlap at .05 cam, which is as big or bigger than 75% of the LS1Techers use, and can't make it cruise at 1600 rpm, they need a class on tuning.
01-09-2008, 07:00 PM
#17
Ok I'll jump on the bandwagon, put no thought into anything and say it's a perfect transmission and I can't wait to waste my money on it.
Someone else can look at the con's or better yet find out later.
Someone else can look at the con's or better yet find out later.
01-09-2008, 07:19 PM
#18
I thought they were out and in use already. Anyways the gear ratios of
1-4.027
2-2.364
3-1.532
4-1.152
5-0.852
6-0.667
R-3.064
Don't look very performance oriented to me, not for a strip car anyway unless maybe you start out in second, in fact first looks about useless IMO.
25 pounds lighter than a 4L80E and a stand alone TCU make it sound appealing.
1-4.027
2-2.364
3-1.532
4-1.152
5-0.852
6-0.667
R-3.064
Don't look very performance oriented to me, not for a strip car anyway unless maybe you start out in second, in fact first looks about useless IMO.
25 pounds lighter than a 4L80E and a stand alone TCU make it sound appealing.
As for a big cam car not cruising at 1700 rpm, that is usually a problem with 6 spd cars and can be tuned out in most cars. With a stalled auto, it is much easier to tune out the surging completely due to the converter absorbing most of it.
01-09-2008, 07:39 PM
#19
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I have one of these in my new truck. 
It really feels like a solid transmission and the close ratios make for a nice top end acceleration. The first gear is kinda useless in my truck with the stock programming. There is NEGATIVE timing until 4000rpm if you go WOT from a stop so you can't take advantage of the low ratio. At part throttle it shifts outta first so fast that you don't really notice it. This can all be taken care of with some tweaks to the programming though. Again, this is in my truck and it sounds like the CTS will have the performance mode programming active.
The 6L90E is in all the 2500HD and 3500HD trucks so I would think it is just as good or better than the 4L80E that it replaced(at least I hope it is) It will also be going behind the new 4.5L diesel that will be in the 1500 series trucks in a year or two so it should be pretty stout because I doubt GM wants a bunch of warranty claims for busted transmissions on these new trucks.
It really feels like a solid transmission and the close ratios make for a nice top end acceleration. The first gear is kinda useless in my truck with the stock programming. There is NEGATIVE timing until 4000rpm if you go WOT from a stop so you can't take advantage of the low ratio. At part throttle it shifts outta first so fast that you don't really notice it. This can all be taken care of with some tweaks to the programming though. Again, this is in my truck and it sounds like the CTS will have the performance mode programming active.
The 6L90E is in all the 2500HD and 3500HD trucks so I would think it is just as good or better than the 4L80E that it replaced(at least I hope it is) It will also be going behind the new 4.5L diesel that will be in the 1500 series trucks in a year or two so it should be pretty stout because I doubt GM wants a bunch of warranty claims for busted transmissions on these new trucks.
01-09-2008, 09:22 PM
#20
So the people who run 3.90s or 4.10s in their A4 cars have a useless first gear? Sorry, I don't mean to pick on you specifically, but what is the fear of the gear?
2.73s are the standard gear on a Z51 equiped vette with this transmission. I've driven the vette and I'd consider sticking 3.15s in it, as many have. I'll acknowledge that some of the guys going to 3.15s could be just as well served by a 3000 stall converter and stock gears. But the 3.15s wake the car up and avoid some of the downside of a converter.
A 12 bolt with 3.15s plus some ET streets would have a bolt-on F-body cutting 1.5x 60'.
2.73s are the standard gear on a Z51 equiped vette with this transmission. I've driven the vette and I'd consider sticking 3.15s in it, as many have. I'll acknowledge that some of the guys going to 3.15s could be just as well served by a 3000 stall converter and stock gears. But the 3.15s wake the car up and avoid some of the downside of a converter.
A 12 bolt with 3.15s plus some ET streets would have a bolt-on F-body cutting 1.5x 60'.