TriShield

It's a vastly nicer car in every respect over the 4th gen. while delivering exceptional performance. I always loved the styling of the LS1 Firebird but it was a really really bad car other than that. Certainly not something I could sit in and drive to work each day like I could my GTO or quality/engineering that I would have been happy with.

If you love used cars by all means, keep buying used cars. Some of us don't want our muscle pre-beat by someone else and like warranties. The new Camaro combines everything that was awesome about the GTO with the knockout, timeless styling of the original Camaro reimaged for our time. That's how GM should have done the GTO in the first place and maybe people would have actually bought them.

RevGTO

iTrader: (12)

In reading all the reports, it seems like the deal-killer would be the poor visibility - worse than a 4th gen. I know if I tried to convince my wife on one, she'd be thumbs down before we even started the motor because of that. When we drove a GTO recently, she really liked it, but complained about visibility. And its not bad on those cars.

As for LS1 Firebirds being "really really bad cars," they actually have a lot going for them. Great performance, very dependable, good handling, light weight, easy to mod, great at the track, good driver cockpit, fantastic with T-tops off in good weather. Sure they need some upgrades like shocks out of the box, build quality isn't the highest, and the hatchback design makes for noise. And lest it be mentioned, the reviewers complained about the hard plasticky interior in the new Camaro.

Aceldama

Exceptional performance is a stretch. Every review I've read says the handling is vague and piggish. The acceleration compares with the GTO and the 10 year old 4th gen which could be had for tens of thousands less. Where's the exceptional performance? Is it in the aftermarket? Then you can kiss the precious warranty you speak of goodbye.

You might call the 4th gen a bad car but it's still a good value for what you're getting. Which in both cases is a straight line toy with little practical use.

This is kind of what I'm getting at. If an enthusiast had/have the opportunity to get a 2005/6 GTO for $20,000, in some cases off a dealer lot, why is the new Camaro a better choice? It isn't acceleration, it isn't weight, it isn't handling, practicality, interior or cost. I guess you could say it was styling...

If I buy a new car it's a daily driver that I need to be very reliable and affordable. I have a Honda Fit for that. Cars like that are cheap to begin with and hold their value decently because they appeal to the masses and they are practical. I think sports cars are the perfect car to buy used as they have very little purpose other than a toy and they lose value very quickly. Which means when Joe **** can't afford the payment on his 2010 Camaro someone will pick it up used for $20,000 2 years down the road.

I'm not saying that the Camaro won't be a hit. I just think that from the enthusiast's perspective who just wants a fast toy it's a bit overpriced, and a bit underwhelming. I'm just dissappointed because I wanted it to be better than it turned out.

TriShield

Of course it's styling. The new Camaro kept everything good about the GTO and added th epic, unmistakable style that is so important in cars bearing these names.

Cole Train

iTrader: (30)

aceldama~ you do realise that the 4th Gen, with the similar options was priced near what the 5th Gen is with a 5th Gen just slightly higher but with better fit and finish and a better potential engine. Also look at the value of the dollar. i back when 4th Gens came out i'm sure the 3rd Gen guys were bitching about the price of 4th Gens. Now look, you can have NICE 4th Gens for under $10k. somebody always bitches about the price but when they compare it to the previous generation and realise they have a similar pricing range then you start to notice where the new one fits. i think the new Camaro is an incredible bang for your buck. I've considered trading in my Vette on a Z28 if it ever comes out. I agree the new Camaro is too heavy but safety standards now days is what hinders it's ability to shed weight. If you want a nice build quality and all the safety stuff it's gonna be heavier. Even the new Mustang, while lighter, has a worse build quality then the Camaro(as specified in the Car & Driver article) and also has a live rear axle instead of IRS. That has alot to do with the weight difference. I'm excited to see the 5th Gen's coming out and can't wait to see them on the road

Aceldama

I agree entirely with you on this. That's kinda my point, though. Back in 1998 (not that I could have anyway) I wouldn't have spent $33,000 on a Camaro and I wouldn't do it now. But when I did get my car I got it for $10,500 with 39,000 on the clock. I tried it as a daily driver but in upstate NY it just didn't work for me and it's been the 'toy car' ever since.

I'm just in a position now where I find it hard to see the value in such an expensive singular purpose car. And the reason why I find it worth bitching about is because I really thought I'd want the new Camaro despite all this but I feel let down by the reviews.

This is just another reason why I prefer older cars. But you're right. I just don't like the upward trend in weight. Some manufacturers have had success lowering the weight of their vehicles though, like the Nissan 370z vs the 350z.

Maybe if I see one or get the chance to drive one I'll change my mind.

TT632

iTrader: (3)

Agreed. I don't believe the new Camaro would sell as well if it had the Same 1982 based rear suspension of the 3rd and 4th gens. While the torque arm rear suspension (with after market parts) has proven itself as a good suspension for drag racing or racing on a flat road course. IRS is the only way to go to follow irregular road surfaces . The Zeta rear suspension is a generation past the previous platform, and the Mustang would do well to follow suit to compete. Only problem I see for the rear suspension on a 5th gen is the compromise on a max effort drag or street strip car.
Not like we really care what the Import nay sayers spew, but the 6 cylinder version of the camaro answers all of the deficiencies they say our cars have had over the years; IRS, Over head cams and direct injection to boot!

99Hawk262

iTrader: (19)

Solid axle conversions are probably in work as we speak for the hard core drag racers.

SS02G

well ya FI is in mustang blood look M.U.S.T.A.N.G = Must Use Supercharger or Turbo Against Natural aspirated GM.

RevGTO

iTrader: (12)

Not only that, but what they're doing with selling the bare body shell is an awesome deal for racers.

ZTwentyAteU

iTrader: (12)

I think its hellarious how the mags always bitch about "hard plastic interior." What new car don't have plastic all over the place?

I'd bet most of us F body guys could care less about the interior anyways.

I'm just mad I cant buy a stripper SS car. ala 1le

Wolfsblut

Has anyone tested the top speed of the Camaro (V6/V8)?

unit213

Right, it's called a Ford 9".

Shackleford

iTrader: (12)

I've had an LT1 Z28 or LS1 Trans AM (current) as a daily driver for years, going to work, school, grocery shopping, hauling random stuff, etc.

TriShield

2010 Chevy Camaro SS: First Drive, New York





By Ray Wert, 5:45 PM on Mon Apr 6 2009

Yes, I know we've already reviewed the new Chevy Camaro. I don't care, because after driving one around New York City for an hour last week, I'm comfortable saying I love it. America? **** yeah.

My boss, and reigning champion for receipt of the prestigious Dark Lord of Public Media mantle award, Nick Denton, just called me an "unabashed American apologist." I don't even pretend to know what that means, but if it has to do with believing that American automakers still have it in them to bring "teh awesome" to market, then hell yeah I am.

Wes had some minor concerns in his review of the new Chevy Camaro that he felt kept it from being a world-beater, feeling Chevy was trying to push the new Camaro up against the sports car world. Whether interior plastics or minor numbness of steering, I'm not going to discount those deficiencies — they're all valid. But you know what? I don't care.

Forget for a moment this car's performance (a mid-four-second 0-to-60 time) and fuel economy (16/24 for the V8-engined SS, 17/29 for the V6) — because this muscle car's got some serious style. I'd seen looks in cars before. Whether it's a Ferrari F430 or a Bentley GTC Speed, you can get 'em. What I was astonished by was how easily the Camaro gets them.

One block into my drive in lower Manhattan saw guys grabbing camera phones to take photos. Never saw that with one o' them fancy-pants'ed Euro cars. Nope, this big ol' 'merican muscle car was something different. It carries itself differently — with kind of a swagger.

So I'm willing to ignore those deficiencies Wes found. Mostly, because I'm not trying to rate this car as a sports car. Instead, I'm rating it for what it is — a big hairy 'merican muscle car. From the moment you sit inside and fire up the big 426 HP V8 engine, you're transported to a world where all you want to do is fire off down the road, stoplight-to-breathtakingly-exhilarating-stoplight. In that world, you couldn't care less about plastics on the dash. No, all you care about is goin' fast and knowing you're able to beat the guy next to you. The new Camaro SS? Yeah, it'll do that — in spades, and better than the competition at the price point. And frankly, that's all I want.

TriShield

One Night Stand: Taking home the 2010 Chevy Camaro SS









by Alex Nunez on Apr 9th 2009 at 8:00PM

You know you're off to a good evening when it starts with the delivery of a Victory Red pre-production 2010 Chevrolet Camaro SS. I hadn't even pulled away from the parking garage where it was waiting for me, and it was already causing a ruckus. A young boy, waiting with his extended family for their car to be retrieved, saw the ponycar roll up. His eyes turned into saucers. "Dad, it's the car from Transformers!" he sputtered, tugging on his father's sleeve. Dad immediately chimed in with, "Whoa. Niiiice car." Grandpa looked at the car, locked eyes with me, broke into a grin and just gave a thumbs up. The Camaro elicits those sort of responses a lot. You know, because it's awesome.

I can't recall the last time I've seen such a purely visceral, positive reaction to a car. People don't simply like the Camaro – they adore it... and they let you know. The best reactions of all came from a pair of NYPD officers I happened upon when pulled over to use the phone and snap some photos. "Whoa! Look at this!" I heard, as the two unis approached. Turns out, one was a Corvette driver, and he was floored by the Camaro. He and his partner circled the car, commenting on everything. F-bombs dropped repeatedly, but only in the most complimentary of fashions. They checked out the interior. They walked around some more. "I may have to put up my 'Vette and get one of these," the first officer said with a look of resignation on his face. He was totally serious. Eventually, they thanked me for letting them poke around and retreated back to their Crown Vic parked across the street.

I was done too, so I clambered back into the Chevy and fired up the LS3, ready to head to a pre-show shindig with some of the Autoblog crew. As I was about to pull away, the first officer called out, "Hey, do me a favor."

"Sure thing," I replied.

"When you leave, give it a little extra. I wanna see it."

Pause. Think. "You got it," I said, confident in the knowledge that this was the best possible encounter involving a 426-horsepower muscle coupe and the Boys in Blue.

The first officer's partner, riding shotgun in the Vic, looked at his rear-view mirror, then turned his head to double-check for oncoming traffic. "You're clear," he said. He was smiling. At this point, I was, too. So I put the shifter into first, turned away from the curb and punched it. This is a language the Camaro speaks fluently. Down the street I went, wheels spinning. No red-and-blue lights. No nightmarishly-expensive ticket. Hell, if there had been room, I think the cops would have had me do donuts.

The happy encounters continued throughout the evening, with drivers hanging out of their windows, giggling like kids, quizzing me about the car. At stoplights, people did double-takes as they realized what was in front of them. Phone cams were whipped out like switchblades. And yes, more than a few Transformers references were made by random bystanders. That particular product placement deal seems to have worked rather well for The General. Throughout all this, the happiest guy in the picture was me. Nevermind the attention it draws, the Camaro is just a ball to drive (Full Disclosure: This, coming from a Ford Mustang GT owner).

Power is simply monstrous and on-demand. The Camaro SS is so testosterone-infused, the FDA ought to regulate it as a male-enhancement product. Shifts with the manual gearbox are reasonably short and crisp. The subdued, muscular burble at idle turns into a full-throated bellow when you mash the loud pedal. And mark my words: with an aftermarket exhaust, this thing's going to sound utterly malevolent. Children will cry.

And though the Camaro will drag knuckles at stoplight showdowns with the best of 'em, it's very drivable. Yes, it's a big car, but it feels smaller than Dodge's Challenger. The SS suspension is admittedly punishing on pothole-strewn pavement, and trundling along on lower Manhattan's cobblestone streets, I felt like a bobblehead doll in an earthquake. But the minute you get onto a better surface, all that stiffness translates into solid road road feel, and on the highway, the Camaro's a perfect partner. It just tracks and goes. You look forward to sweepers as if they're presents. Long straightaways are as good as Christmas morning. Speed limits? The Grinch. The Camaro just gobbles this stuff up, and the Brembos tucked behind the factory 20-inchers rein it all back in.

Inside, you get a straightforward, simple cabin. No, it's not as well-detailed as the new Mustang's -- so let's get that piece of business out of the way. I liked it anyway. My red 1SS-trim tester was fitted with grippy and comfortable cloth-covered sport seats. Instead of the four-gauge rally cluster on the center console, there was just a small storage tray in its place. The instrument panel is all hard plastic, but it looks fine, and the unique-to-Camaro stereo and HVAC controls manage to look cool while being intuitive to use. The retro-style cluster ties everything in, with blue-lit numerals housed within conical surrounds and red needles angling towards the driver, the whole package is both deep and legible. One of the things we all gripe about here is when stuff like the gauges or stereo are obviously parts-bin materials. In this case, GM gave the Camaro unique instruments and accessories that are both attractive and functional. It's easier to live with the other less impressive plastic bits when the automaker goes out of its way to give you model-specific elements for the things you look at the most. Sure, you can find vehicles with a nicer interiors, sharper handling, and more power. And yes, the trunk opening is surprisingly tiny and the low roofline that makes the Camaro look wicked while standing still doesn't exactly help outward visibility. But fair is fair: GM nailed the important stuff with the Camaro. This is a car that grabs you on an emotional level. It is relentlessly, unapologetically, unequivocally badass.

At the end of the night, I drove the Chevy home -- a nice, light-traffic drive on the Merritt Parkway. I made one last pit-stop at a gobsmacked buddy's house before easing the big red beast into my own empty garage bay, where it spent the rest of the night. Come the next morning, it was time to drive back into the city. The auto show was beginning, and I needed to return the Camaro on my way to Javits. It was snowing when I rolled back up to the parking garage. With regret, I handed the key fob to the parking attendant, flagged down a cab, and joined the rest of the gang for the show. I thought about the Camaro all day. I need another shot at it. Less than 24 hours with it was just a tease. This was a one-night stand that I could see turning into a full-blown affair.