ULTIMATEORANGESS

iTrader: (4)

again, sales are important to this car for many reasons. i dont need to keep going over this do i?


im saying get used to it because of stupid comments of compromising, they got lucky and the car is in need a major redesign which is all BS.


camaros have outsold mustangs for 6 out of the last seven months and last yr. the subject here is sales. performance unlike compared to ls1 fbodies isnt to where 5th gens are embarrassingly slower like mustangs were from 98-02.

It'llrun

No, but for some unknown reason, you seem to insist...

It's all "BS" in your sole opinion.. So what? Are you buying them? If not, what makes your opinion any better than the next... Even if so, for that matter. All you've got is sales and the rest of us already know that and we don't base our "like or don't like" on the number sold. We don't base our thoughts on compromise in sales figures either. You're reaching, as usual.

There you are... When performance benefits F-body in your view(overall the Mustang was the better performer even from 98-02), THAT is all that matters... When sales is the only real benefit you can beg of it, SALES are all that matters... There are many reasons people prefer the Camaro, least of which is "it's better than the other pony cars." You're a NUTS HUGGER...Oh well.

ULTIMATEORANGESS

iTrader: (4)

youre a ******* dick sucking ford loving moron.

camaros are outselling mustangs so enough with your constant horseshit useless rambles.

no matter what you post its not going to change 5th gens are handing it to mustangs in sales so go relive the last with people WGAF.

It'llrun

Oh... Now I'm HURT... Silly kid...

Get back to me when they get the next four million sold and I'll congratulate GM again... Unless Ford sells Mustangs at any point during that time...

Relive the last... Whatever... No matter what any of us post, it's not going to change the fact the Mustang is handing the Camaro its *** in nearly every measurable category aside from sales... so? Will better sales make the Camaro the better handling of the two?

You seem to have a keen ability to fail all comprehension when you don't fully agree. EVERYONE HERE knows the new Camaro is selling better than the Mustang over most of the past 2yrs... Nobody is arguing that's untrue, so what IS your issue??? Would you be happy if we all decided, as you apparently have, the new Camaro is the best pony car available, JUST BECAUSE it's leading the sales race as of late? It's an okay car... We don't need to praise it as you do, just because you like it so much. Speaking of that... Just go drive yours and don't let other people bother you over it.

ULTIMATEORANGESS

iTrader: (4)

all you do is post stupid **** over and over again every time this subject is brought up. its outselling the car you love to ******* to just accept it and move on.


no one gives a **** about what has or what might happen. a 5th gen is kicking *** and theres nothing your stupid 5th gen hating *** can do to change it.

lovescamaros28

I have to disagree with that. The Camaro has better braking,and seems to handle much better through the slalom. A corvette derived LS3 engine(more power than the Mustang),Tremec transmission,standard Brembo brakes,and better styling. I would argue that the Mustang,although slightly quicker...has the dis-advantage.

Irunelevens

More power is useless when the car weighs 200-300lbs more. "Styling" isn't a measurable category, so that is moot. The Camaro comes standard with Brembos, but even so it BARELY out-brakes the Mustang in some tests. And the Mustang has Brembos as an option as well, which levels the playing field. VERY few people would argue that the Mustang is at a disadvantage against the Camaro in any quantifiable way.

It'llrun

I just like the laughter you provide by acting like an angry second grader...

If you were forced to approach these issues like an adult, I'm sure we'd all be even more than bored with your real lack of knowledge about vehicles in general.

Obviously that's not true... Look at what you're doing???? Deeeerrrrr...

If that were the reality, I'd stop making fun of your ignorance... Alas, it isn't. The current Camaro is selling very well... Probably better than any since 1971, or at least since the days of Smokey and the Bandit. Selling well isn't kicking ***... It's selling well and brining in profit. People who buy pony cars purely for performance aren't likely to choose the Camaro at this time. People buying one to make it perform better is a different story. Most Camaro sales are likely directly attributable to looks. Anyone comparing actual performance and cost will probably take a breath and think, "But I like how it looks!" and go ahead with their purchase. Most of these cars won't be bought for racing anyway, so performance, like for most vehicle purchases, isn't the biggest issue.

You're apparently not intelligent enough to notice, I like the Camaro. It has certain "attributes" which deem it "out" for me, like the lack of review visibility, the super thick A-pillars, the quircky steering wheel(which gets "fixed" directly) and a cheesy interior, but it is a cool car and performs well as compared to most.

Calling names and all only makes you look like a kid. With that, grow up a little.

That depends on the Mustang chosen as well as it's options. In base form, the Mustang GT loses in some areas, but when equipped with front Brembos and 3.73's(not actually required), it wins in nearly any category and still costs about the same as the SS in base form.

Styling is simply subjective. I'd rather the car that doesn't look quite as nice, but allows me to see what's coming up behind me over the "neato" looking one which blocks my view almost entirely. "Corvette derived LS3" means nothing really, unless someone wishing they were buying a Corvette ends up with a Camaro SS M6... Reality is, GM wisely chose the same engine for manual transmissioned Camaro SS'... but let's not forget GM also sells the Camaro in L99 form, with a less than adequate(for performance) automatic and Ford offers a far more liked auto.

The Camaro is notably faster than Mustang GT, but not as quick on the track. The Mustang is available in several upgraded models, all of which perform better than GT and Camaro SS. Tremec is a good idea for M6 cars, and is available in Mustangs, just not the GT or BOSS 302, but why should I or anyone else really care? Most prefer autos and in that arena, Camaro is suffering. Not only is it slower to accelerate, but it also costs more.

All said, Mustang is the better performer of the two. Several tests I've seen talk about this that and the other, barely making note their "tester" was a CS version and that one isn't as quick as the standard GT, and even slower reaching top end and on the race track when equipped with the glass roof.

ULTIMATEORANGESS

iTrader: (4)

why dont you crawl back under your blue oval rock.



5th gens are outselling! stop your constant horseshit over and over. thats what this is about. youre a ******* bore.


theres no need for you to go on and on. youre just going to have to eat **** right now and wait till next month.

lovescamaros28

The Camaro is not suffering. The Camaro and Mustang are a close drivers race down the 1/4. We are talking on average,a mere .2 quicker for the Mustang. In all actuality, we have not seen performance cars like this since the early 70s, so it is good to see American Muscle from any manufacturer on the road! The bottom line, the Camaro is outselling Mustang because most people think it looks better,hype over the Camaro's return,advertising, and the S197 Mustang is aging.

It'llrun

I already told you... I'm having too much fun laughing at your ignorance...

YOU are the one who made it about something else. The rest of us already know it's selling best these days... We just don't believe THAT makes it a better car... Again, you driving yours?

I'm getting a real kick out of you having such an issue over ANYONE not being 100% on the exact same points as you. Everyone has agreed about sales... You're not informing a soul of a thing worthy of note.

It seems you're just mad about the car not getting constant props from the world... The world doesn't care.

All your use of teenager language isn't going to help your cause... You come off as a kid who's upset... over nothing. I once thought you were old enough to make like a man... I was wrong. I choose to laugh at you, just the same.

lovescamaros28

I believe the Camaro is the better car,and according to sales most of the public does also. I have test drove a couple and will be purchasing one soon.

It'llrun

Sales numbers hardly make one better than the other. That's the entire reason for performance data to be collected. If it's just about sales, the Cruze is apparently twice over better than the Camaro and about 3 times better than Corvette... The Volt must totally suck, according to sales. I'm not seein' it...

lovescamaros28

Which car is better is subjective,and based completely off personal opinion. Since the Camaro is selling better...to most car buyers the Camaro is better. Everyone knows the Mustang has a very slight edge in performance. That is because it is lighter,but as everyone knows produces less brake horsepower/torque.

It'llrun

Which is better for a specific person simply boils down to personal choices, all based in the predetermined use of any product along with the known features or lack thereof and the price to be paid for said purchase. Which is better in specific testing, however, is not subjective because for those tests, there are specific guidelines set ahead of time. In the case of performance from vehicles, the only thing added in mental notes would be longevity and costs over time, set or not set.

Since the Camaro is selling better, it is the better car to most car buyers? That's simply absurd. As I said before, if that's the case, the Cruze is GM's very best car... NOBODY in their right mind would make that claim with conviction. Instead, they would surely laugh at the mere idea.

Comparing as you have here is useless in terms of deciding which is better. The Mustang has a slight edge in performance... in nearly every performance category. I've read test after test "And the winner is... Mustang" in essentially 100% of them. They even include "subjective" thoughts. Unlike you, however, they consider the cost, the performance, the options, the economy, the usefullness in its category and the overall typical use for these cars. For you, it's about sales... Ridiculous though it sounds, that's how you've determined... By letting OTHERS determine for you. Way to think it through...

For people looking at these cars in terms of performance, they look at (and for) some things you've mentioned, like vehicle weight. That doesn't matter to you, apparently... You know the Mustang weighs less(by 2-3 hundred pounds)... For you though, that's no big deal because the Camaro makes some 14 more hp... I'll clue you in on something... TORQUE is what matters in drag racing, and the Camaro has an even bigger torque advantage... Maybe argue that in the future.

If you can make the Camaro lighter than a Mustang can be made, you're all set... Well, that is if you can also make it connect to the track better. If buying for drag racing purposes, you're just going to be at a terrible disadvantage with the current Camaro SS as compared to any number of Mustang models available. Can you buy a more powerful Camaro overall? No. Can you buy a lighter Camaro? No. Can you buy a Camaro with more torque? No. Can you buy a Camaro with better gearing? No. Can you buy a Camaro with a solid rear axle? No... Are you planning to drag race? I guess not, or you don't mind losing because... The Camaro SELLS better! Mustang buyers(and wannabe buyers alike) offered the very same argument for several years, up to and including the "but I can modify for less" portion. They, too, were laughed at for their argument... true and correct or not. Thanks in part to lighter weight, the car enjoys an advantage today.

Sales numbers are fine... If you base your purchase on just that, however, you'll not likely ever be in the best position when it's time to drag race. Do what you want... I don't care. The point I'm making is simply that determining which car is better based solely on sales won't leave you with much when you're picking up a time slip. You can smile and tell the guy at the booth, "Hey... This car is selling like HOTCAKES!" He'll surely remind you what a winner you are...

ULTIMATEORANGESS

iTrader: (4)

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz



heres an automotive history lesson for you since you like to go back in time for no reason.


camaro 2011 mustang 0. get back to me when its close moron.

Heater

How much power does the new Camero make over the new Mustang?

Wimimc

iTrader: (2)

mmm i cant wait for the Alpha Camaro. lighter, more powerful possibly with the LS5 w/ direct injection??

It'llrun

You're like a dim bulb on a sunny afternoon... Notice anything missing??? As I said... Laughing at your ignorance!

Maybe work on trying to not be so serious... It could help calm you and maybe drop your blood pressure and stuff... Maybe go pet a dog or car...

Yeah, I wrote it as I meant it... because some people need to realize "lighten up" doesn't just mean go on a diet.

LS1LT1

iTrader: (16)

I assume you're asking about V8s only (being that this is a performance oriented board and the V8 being what most of us would likely get)?
In manual trans form, the Camaro SS is rated at 14hp more than the Mustang GT.
In automatic form the SS is actually rated less by 12hp.

In the V6 power race the Camaro was rated at 304, then the Mustang came out at 305 so the Camaro got a new rating of 312 and now for 2012 it gets another bump to 323 I believe.

GT500s, Bosses and ZL1s (and Z28s?) are a whole 'nother discussion.