FH212

iTrader: (4)

I am a t/a owner for life but what the hell is GM doing?I just got my new issue of Hot Rod with the 07 mustang shelby cobra on the cover.when it comes out next year it will be close to 500 HP!And still sell for under $40,000.If GM dosent do something quick (AND I DONT MEAN LS2 IN THE GRAND AM OOPS I MEAN GTO)we are all going to be on one knee kissing FORDS big diamond pinkie ring.UGGGGGGGHhhh.

technical

You might be kissing someone else's ring...Ford isn't doing so hot either from what I hear.

mongse

iTrader: (2)

What's funny is that I'm sure GM is bewildered why a "retro" car is not selling. Probably has something to do w/ it being designed for a younger generation with a pricetag that the older crowd can afford. Same problem they had w/ the F-Body. There are a lot more 30-50 year olds (who grew up with Camaros) that can afford a $30K car than 18-30 year olds. Just because you throw a retro badge on a overgrown Grand Am doesn't mean it'll sell.

I cringe at the thought of the new F-Body (if it ever comes out). I'm sure GM will find a way to screw it up (FWD, IRS, 4-dr, etc). They're bound by so many factors too.
1.)The plant MUST be built in Canada, per their agreement w/ the CAW union.
2.)You know it won't come close to competing w/ the Vette (one reason I think GM didn't have a problem axing the LS1 F-Bodies)
3.)Everything is being designed to be more compact and economical. If the new version doesn't come w/ a V8, I will buy a Mustang...seriously.
4.)If the GTO fails (like it seems to be doing), then GM will be more gunshy about bringing back old models.

Let's see how the supposed "Chevelle" works out. I bet it'll be an overweight pig w/ some cool stickers on it. I miss the days when I could buy a car from the factory w/ forged internals, a rear end that doesn't break when you hit a dead animal and didn't weigh a ton *cough* '93 Mustang *cough*

demonspeed

iTrader: (7)

Nope. The stipulation was that anything with the name Camaro/Firebird had to be built at the St. Therese plant as per CAW. It's kinda hard to do that since that building doesn't exsist anymore.

The Camaro is from the country that brought you Rock N Roll... well, that's certainly not Canada. Bring it back to the states and do it soon and don't mess it up. Simple.

technical

I'm not on board with an IRS being a bad thing. I would love to have an IRS in my SS.

qwikz28

iTrader: (12)

i think gm will mess up the next muscle car they bring out. that is why i am investing more money in my Z and a daily driver cause i know i will have to keep it for a long time now. i am not going over to ford, chrysler maybe. ford no.

sb427f-car

Two words...3 Link.

Why? Because...NASCAR cars use the trailing/truck arm suspensions and they turn really good. Live axle as far as the ability to get it to hook is the best and with the right tuning you can get them to turn left and right VERY well. Strength is unmatched by halfshafts, and that's a FACT! Granted...IRS has come a long way, but I'll take mine in a solid axle thanks.

But...IF/WHEN it happens, it'll probably be an IRS becaust that's what it'll take to compete with the "perceived" euro competition.

technical

The last thing I think about when someone says NASCAR is road handling.
Show me a competitve live axle car in IMSA, SCCA, F!, IRL, etc.
Live axles work well for stock cars/trucks but those cars only make right turns two or three times a year.

technical

The last thing I think about when someone says NASCAR is road handling.
Show me a competitve live axle car in IMSA, SCCA, F!, IRL, etc.
Live axles work well for stock cars/trucks but those cars only make right turns two or three times a year.

Let's not forget the unsprung weight of an IRS. Less bang over the bumps.

sb427f-car

Cheaper + strength + a little more added weight + hook in straight line > weak+ comparible handling + expensive.

Fact is, a well engineered three, four, or triangulated 4 link will perform and corner just as well as any IRS in about 90% of the needs for a consumer car. Yes, you may sacrifice ride quality but in an affordible perf. car, take cues from the new stang chassis and it's 3 link. Production cars are about comprimise. Also, it was well touted that the enthusiast wanted that live axle.

technical

Strength and traction? An IRS can be as strong or stronger and provide better traction...straight line and in a turn regardless of uneven road surface.

If you want to drag race, sure a live axle is better. Since most F-body guy want to drag race it would make sense to sell the car with a live axle. I personally wouldn't mind the IRS in a new Camaro especially since the F-body is such a rattle box already.

30th droptop

iTrader: (-1)

Speak for yourself. I'm still holding out hope, and in the meantime, I'll just keep driving my old cars. I like the way the new Mustangs look, but the 4.6's just aren't makin' it for me. Yeah, I know you can supercharge them and make some good power, but that's just that mythical "replacement" for displacement!

30th droptop

iTrader: (-1)

A litle more "bump" over the speedbumps is a small price to pay for a live axle. I'm know I'm going out on a limb here, but I think a live axle is a superior setup, even on a track where you've got to turn both ways. The only real advantage an IRS has is on rough road surfaces, where live axles tend to be more "bouncy," and camber change is transfered across the axle. That's a pretty small envelope to worry about, when most of my racing is about straight-line traction. IRS just can't compete for straightline traction!

BBQLS1

Just give me a live axle that's worth a ****.

qwikz28

iTrader: (12)

i thought irs isnt good for high horsepower cars? but i am very ignorant in this field and am just making a assumption.