Lutz says they need to sell 150-160,000 Camaro's a Year to be profitable
01-09-2006, 11:10 PM
#41
Originally Posted by Dan
Think they can sell that many per year? I don't
DETROIT (Reuters) - General Motors Corp. on Monday showed off a Chevrolet Camaro prototype inspired by the 1969 version of the legendary muscle car to try to rev up demand for its return.
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Chevrolet had been widely expected to unveil the Camaro concept car at the North American International Auto Show in Detroit, a day after DaimlerChrysler's U.S. division rolled out a version of the rival Dodge Challenger.
Many expect Chrysler and Chevrolet to put the Challenger and Camaro into production, given Ford Motor Co.'s success with its redesigned version of the original 1960s muscle car, the Mustang.
Executives at GM, the world's largest automaker, cited fans' intense interest surrounding the seven-month development effort behind the 400-horsepower concept car as an indication of potential demand from buyers.
But they said the company, which has been losing money and market share to rivals, had not yet decided whether to begin making the new Camaro. That production decision would hinge in part on the excitement generated by the new design, Bob Lutz, vice chairman of products, told reporters.
GM estimated 100,000 fans watched the Detroit unveiling via Webcast. It invited another 250 enthusiasts to watch in person. "It's like a cult out there," Lutz said of the Camaro fan base.
Restored, first-generation Camaros can fetch between $35,000 and $200,000, said Ed Welburn, vice president of global design for GM, whose own 1969 Camaro provided the launch pad for the rear-wheel drive concept design.
Lutz said GM could make the new Camaro profitably if it could sell between 150,000 and 160,000 of the cars each year.
A former Ford and Chrysler executive who came to GM four years ago, Lutz said U.S. automakers needed to roll out models with better fuel-efficiency and hybrid engines while still offering performance cars like the Camaro.
"It's two markets," Lutz said. "The whole country is schizophrenic."
As an example of the split in consumer thinking, Lutz said some Hollywood celebrities own both a Lamborghini Gallardo luxury sports car and a Toyota Prius hybrid.
DETROIT (Reuters) - General Motors Corp. on Monday showed off a Chevrolet Camaro prototype inspired by the 1969 version of the legendary muscle car to try to rev up demand for its return.
ADVERTISEMENT
Chevrolet had been widely expected to unveil the Camaro concept car at the North American International Auto Show in Detroit, a day after DaimlerChrysler's U.S. division rolled out a version of the rival Dodge Challenger.
Many expect Chrysler and Chevrolet to put the Challenger and Camaro into production, given Ford Motor Co.'s success with its redesigned version of the original 1960s muscle car, the Mustang.
Executives at GM, the world's largest automaker, cited fans' intense interest surrounding the seven-month development effort behind the 400-horsepower concept car as an indication of potential demand from buyers.
But they said the company, which has been losing money and market share to rivals, had not yet decided whether to begin making the new Camaro. That production decision would hinge in part on the excitement generated by the new design, Bob Lutz, vice chairman of products, told reporters.
GM estimated 100,000 fans watched the Detroit unveiling via Webcast. It invited another 250 enthusiasts to watch in person. "It's like a cult out there," Lutz said of the Camaro fan base.
Restored, first-generation Camaros can fetch between $35,000 and $200,000, said Ed Welburn, vice president of global design for GM, whose own 1969 Camaro provided the launch pad for the rear-wheel drive concept design.
Lutz said GM could make the new Camaro profitably if it could sell between 150,000 and 160,000 of the cars each year.
A former Ford and Chrysler executive who came to GM four years ago, Lutz said U.S. automakers needed to roll out models with better fuel-efficiency and hybrid engines while still offering performance cars like the Camaro.
"It's two markets," Lutz said. "The whole country is schizophrenic."
As an example of the split in consumer thinking, Lutz said some Hollywood celebrities own both a Lamborghini Gallardo luxury sports car and a Toyota Prius hybrid.
Ok you stupid spoiled bastard ...then why not improve on what the LS1 has already done...Around 20mpg in the city and in some cases over 30 on the highway with a freeflowing exhaust. Shave off 300lbs of stupid ****, hell give some models DoD or a form of VVT so the car can make 400hp and get 35mpg on the highway...that would shut all these import ****** up real quick.
God I hate Bob Lutz.
01-09-2006, 11:20 PM
#42
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From 1998 - 2002 Camaro averaged 43,000 - 53,000 units per year total, I wonder how GM plans on tripleing those numbers and sustaining them year after year?
01-10-2006, 02:16 AM
#43
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Someone said the third gens sold a ton, I believe it and you all know it too. They are fuggin everywhere. That would turn me off if I was holding off until they "upped the ante" so to speak. I expect GM will give the car a HP jump after two years. My reason being, if the car is doing well DC for sure, and probably ford, will throw some horsepower at their cars to try and draw sales. I said DC for sure because that 6.1 hemi has potential.
On a down point, the Camaro will never appeal to women buyers more than the mustang does. They have a deep rooted subconscious desire for the car. Women like horses/horse back riding, every little girl wants a pony, etc. Horses arent practical, so they want/get the automotive equivalent. This is a fact. My proof is the GM product line from 2003 to date.
On a down point, the Camaro will never appeal to women buyers more than the mustang does. They have a deep rooted subconscious desire for the car. Women like horses/horse back riding, every little girl wants a pony, etc. Horses arent practical, so they want/get the automotive equivalent. This is a fact. My proof is the GM product line from 2003 to date.
01-10-2006, 08:16 AM
#45
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150,000 is very doable.
Ford built about 190,000 Mustangs in '05.
GM just has to make it a usable passenger car with decent room in the backseat and good accesssibility.
That way people who need to carry 4 people from time to time can rationalize buying a camaro over a sporty 4 door sedan.
Remember the Mustang has NO back seat legroom.
And the 4th Gen was the most space inefficient car ever built. 193 inches long and good driver space, a hump for the passenger and vestigal rear seats,
plus a windshield header so low overhead stoplights were not even visible for tall drivers.
Ford built about 190,000 Mustangs in '05.
GM just has to make it a usable passenger car with decent room in the backseat and good accesssibility.
That way people who need to carry 4 people from time to time can rationalize buying a camaro over a sporty 4 door sedan.
Remember the Mustang has NO back seat legroom.
And the 4th Gen was the most space inefficient car ever built. 193 inches long and good driver space, a hump for the passenger and vestigal rear seats,
plus a windshield header so low overhead stoplights were not even visible for tall drivers.
01-10-2006, 08:28 AM
#46
Originally Posted by JD_AMG
This concept is based on a streatched Zeta platform(solstice), the (current) GTO is not on the same platform.
Solstice is the Kappa platform. The new GTO is off of the Zeta and a production Camaro would also be off the Zeta. That is their V8, RWD architecture.
01-10-2006, 09:42 AM
#47
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I, for one, would like to know where, exactly, this quote comes from? The Reuters article doesn't mention that number. I'm not saying that it's fabricated, but Lutz's blog doesn't list that and I can't find it at Detnews.com either. 
If you're going to post something that inflammatory, I'd suggest also posting the link where you found it. HTH.
If you're going to post something that inflammatory, I'd suggest also posting the link where you found it. HTH.
01-10-2006, 11:08 AM
#48
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GM doesnt have a chance in hell of selling that many unless they are priced at $25k to compete with the ricers and mustang. Using the existing 6.0L, trannies and rear axle is the only way they can get there...and thats what we want anyhow.
Bang for the buck is where the volume is.
Bang for the buck is where the volume is.
01-10-2006, 11:37 AM
#49
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Volume is why people should worry less about the LS7 and more about an affordable V6/LS2 package. If you want to be King of the Road, either put money down on a C6 Z06 or take your LS2-powered Zeta to MTI, Speed, Inc., TByrne, etc. Don't expect it from the factory, at least not yet. 
01-10-2006, 12:01 PM
#50
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When i listen to him i hear 100,000 to 150,000 units comparable to the mustang. Which is completely feasible.
http://starter.feedroom.com/main.jsp...6011.928259989
http://starter.feedroom.com/main.jsp...6011.928259989
01-10-2006, 07:21 PM
#51
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The point isn't really that they can or can't sell 150K. It's that they need to sell 150K to break even. Unless they're making only a few dollars profit per car, that basically implies they need to fund/build a new plant to make these things. That's a huge volume just to break even.
If they were smart, they'd tool up a small flexible plant to make these and some other niche cars at the same time--like the Japanese do. But that's not the GM way and they don't seem to be figuring it out. I wish they would. They need a few homeruns like the Camaro to bring them back.
If they were smart, they'd tool up a small flexible plant to make these and some other niche cars at the same time--like the Japanese do. But that's not the GM way and they don't seem to be figuring it out. I wish they would. They need a few homeruns like the Camaro to bring them back.
01-13-2006, 04:21 PM
#52
Originally Posted by novicius
I, for one, would like to know where, exactly, this quote comes from? The Reuters article doesn't mention that number. I'm not saying that it's fabricated, but Lutz's blog doesn't list that and I can't find it at Detnews.com either.
If you're going to post something that inflammatory, I'd suggest also posting the link where you found it. HTH.
If you're going to post something that inflammatory, I'd suggest also posting the link where you found it. HTH.
01-13-2006, 06:04 PM
#54
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Err... did anyone else realize that, yes the 05 stang sold 190k... BUT IT WAS THE ONLY RWD V8 RETRO CAR ON THE MARKET!
There is no way GM will be able to sell 150k a year, the new challenger and a new-and or restyled mustang will cut the market into 3 parts... The stang will always take the largest part of the market, leaveing GM and DC to fight for scraps... and "HEMI" is now a household name.
Who do you think will be the biggest lossser?
There is no way GM will be able to sell 150k a year, the new challenger and a new-and or restyled mustang will cut the market into 3 parts... The stang will always take the largest part of the market, leaveing GM and DC to fight for scraps... and "HEMI" is now a household name.
Who do you think will be the biggest lossser?
01-13-2006, 06:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Warbird
From 1998 - 2002 Camaro averaged 43,000 - 53,000 units per year total, I wonder how GM plans on tripleing those numbers and sustaining them year after year?
