Dyno tune results from 2.6" pulley and 50/50 meth
08-06-2012, 03:41 PM
#21
dude if you have no controller how does the meth come on? there has to be a boost reference so the meth knows when to turn on. i would deff not tune for meth if you dont have a top notch kit thats adjustable. mine has a starting boost point (say 5lbs) and a full blast (say 8) thats comes on progressively. i have since removed it and will not be using meth.
as far as belts go you can go down to the parts store and find the biggest tensioner pulley u can get.. i used the V2 acc tensioner pulley..it helped tighten things up.also try an inch shorter belt.. but i was reffering to the dynojet sheet since its the only graph that shows boost.. boost should come on full and stay in a semi strait line.maggies tend to fall off a lb or two when in the upper rpms cuz they run out of steam.
the waves in the graph show slippage and or something going on with with the bypass valve. check your hoses running from the bypass to the snout for cracks.. make sure the valve is open at idle and closed fully when stomped on.
as far as belts go you can go down to the parts store and find the biggest tensioner pulley u can get.. i used the V2 acc tensioner pulley..it helped tighten things up.also try an inch shorter belt.. but i was reffering to the dynojet sheet since its the only graph that shows boost.. boost should come on full and stay in a semi strait line.maggies tend to fall off a lb or two when in the upper rpms cuz they run out of steam.
the waves in the graph show slippage and or something going on with with the bypass valve. check your hoses running from the bypass to the snout for cracks.. make sure the valve is open at idle and closed fully when stomped on.
I would not get another dyno....it would pretty much be meaningless since they all read differently.
50/50 is standard, most move on to 100% in a short period of time, but that is when sprayed *after* the air has been charged. I would see what happens when incrementally increasing timing with 100% meth on a Maggie. Also, don't worry about 100% meth causing detonation on a gas motor as it can with a diesel, meth and gasoline both have a much lower flash point than diesel.
The very few documented tests that have done spraying before the throttle body on a roots type supercharger have yielded minimal results, usually not worth the price of the installation. I don't know what IAT sensor they were using, but after witnessing the difference between the Maggie supplied LS1 Camaro IAT sensor and the Omega thermistor, I would argue anyone's data that was not using one. The *potential* degradation of the rotor coating has been called into question frequently, although I do not believe there has been any positive proof of this from the Cobra/Lightning or the supercharged 3800 guys.
Also, you can tune for meth with regard to timing (adding timing), DO NOT adjust the VE, MAF, or PE AFR's to compensate. You cannot accurately gauge at what rate the meth is burning using AFR, you must use the Lambda scale to gauge any alcohol content through the combustion process...which the OE OS cannot do.
50/50 is standard, most move on to 100% in a short period of time, but that is when sprayed *after* the air has been charged. I would see what happens when incrementally increasing timing with 100% meth on a Maggie. Also, don't worry about 100% meth causing detonation on a gas motor as it can with a diesel, meth and gasoline both have a much lower flash point than diesel.
The very few documented tests that have done spraying before the throttle body on a roots type supercharger have yielded minimal results, usually not worth the price of the installation. I don't know what IAT sensor they were using, but after witnessing the difference between the Maggie supplied LS1 Camaro IAT sensor and the Omega thermistor, I would argue anyone's data that was not using one. The *potential* degradation of the rotor coating has been called into question frequently, although I do not believe there has been any positive proof of this from the Cobra/Lightning or the supercharged 3800 guys.
Also, you can tune for meth with regard to timing (adding timing), DO NOT adjust the VE, MAF, or PE AFR's to compensate. You cannot accurately gauge at what rate the meth is burning using AFR, you must use the Lambda scale to gauge any alcohol content through the combustion process...which the OE OS cannot do.
I am running the omega thermistor mod on my mp112 so the temperatures should be accurate.
I did a lot of reading about the rotor coating and degradation. I have never found out if the mp112 even comes with coated rotors. But from my understanding placing the injection nozzle right after the MAF gives it enough time to atomize into the air due to its low flash point. Placing the nozzle to close to or after the throttle body may not allow enough time for the methanol to atomize. My nozzle is injecting right after the MAF.
good read on meth injection on rotors http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=107842
Since my injection is pre-charge, am I getting any benefit from running water? Are the cooling effects negligible enough that moving up to higher meth might give better results?
Last edited by Onefast V; 08-06-2012 at 03:50 PM.
08-06-2012, 06:16 PM
#22
TECH Fanatic
The rotor pack is not exclusive to Magnuson...they are manufactured by Eaton (who coats the rotors during assembly). The Maggie rotors are the same style as used in the Cobra and Lightning. Eaton still supplies the rotor packs to GM and Ford for the CTS-V, ZR-1, GT500, etc.
08-06-2012, 09:30 PM
#24
A lot of cobra guys spray pre TB but the majority spray after for the best results. Im not sure what it would entail on the V but it may be worth calling a reputable Meth injection company to find out the right way to do it.
As for tuning for meth there are ways to control timing according to IATs, thats the safest way to do it. But like anything performance related there is ALWAYS gonna be a risk of something letting go. If your that scared to run meth and tune for it then dont run it or get out of the performance game. Risk vs Reward and ill tune for meth anyday for the gains ive seen.
As for tuning for meth there are ways to control timing according to IATs, thats the safest way to do it. But like anything performance related there is ALWAYS gonna be a risk of something letting go. If your that scared to run meth and tune for it then dont run it or get out of the performance game. Risk vs Reward and ill tune for meth anyday for the gains ive seen.
08-06-2012, 10:39 PM
#25
A lot of cobra guys spray pre TB but the majority spray after for the best results. Im not sure what it would entail on the V but it may be worth calling a reputable Meth injection company to find out the right way to do it.
As for tuning for meth there are ways to control timing according to IATs, thats the safest way to do it. But like anything performance related there is ALWAYS gonna be a risk of something letting go. If your that scared to run meth and tune for it then dont run it or get out of the performance game. Risk vs Reward and ill tune for meth anyday for the gains ive seen.
As for tuning for meth there are ways to control timing according to IATs, thats the safest way to do it. But like anything performance related there is ALWAYS gonna be a risk of something letting go. If your that scared to run meth and tune for it then dont run it or get out of the performance game. Risk vs Reward and ill tune for meth anyday for the gains ive seen.
08-08-2012, 01:21 PM
#28
i made 485/480 yesterday when i put the 2.6 back on with the currant setup in the sig..numbers before with the 2.8 was 476/460. NO METH on either numbers.
i picked up all the power under the curve and left a nice flat hp line between 5300-6500 which puts the power right in between shifts. woke the car right up. im seeing 10lbs
i picked up all the power under the curve and left a nice flat hp line between 5300-6500 which puts the power right in between shifts. woke the car right up. im seeing 10lbs
08-08-2012, 02:38 PM
#31
http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums...up-your-6.html
08-08-2012, 03:25 PM
#32
Here ya go. Get an Omega thermistor and get it installed like this.
http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums...up-your-6.html
http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums...up-your-6.html
09-14-2012, 07:05 PM
#33
So I took my car back to the original dyno where i put down 452/425 max (2.8 pulley and volant intake) and was only able to best 423/436 (2.6 pulley and 50/50 meth) despite the boost going up a little over 1 pound (A/F can be ignored as the o2 sensor was not hooked up to my car but i have a wideband and i know it runs around 12:1). So I am really at a loss.. it doesn't look like belt slip to me. The car feel like it pulls harder. The only one thing i can think is that I'm running 275/45/18 in the rear now and that's about 1" taller than stock, does the dyno need to be told this because it is essentially like changing my gearing? The guy at the shop insisted it did not.
09-14-2012, 07:16 PM
#35
FYI I did have to go back to the stock airbox to fit the alradco radiator but I do not believe the airflow is vastly improved with volant's airbox and filter (to the tune of 25 + rwhp).
09-14-2012, 07:44 PM
#36
Think you can fit a Lingenfelter airbox in there? From what I've heard, the Volant airbox was a IAT deathtrap.
09-14-2012, 08:25 PM
#38
My point was that the Volant airbox was adding actual heat, which would be picked up anywhere. Never having had one, I wouldn't know. Ever touch your airbox near the radiator side after a drive? I can do that on my Lingenfelter--the inside (filter side) is massively cooler. And I've been working with a guy on the Cadillac Forums to look into adding a huge layer of insulation to the airbox to further bring temperature down.
09-15-2012, 11:41 AM
#40
When I ran meth on my srt-4 I ran it 15% ish meth. I didnt need the octane as much as the cooling. I found the more meth i ran the more knock i had as I started adding more distilled water to the mix the knock subsided.