AAIIIC

iTrader: (19)

Why is it exactly the opposite of what he wants to do? Didn't your first response say the combination of springs and compression damping is insufficient? And wouldn't adding spring rubbers change that? It's not the way I would choose to do it, but it will have an effect, the spring rubbers can be obtained cheaply and installed in a matter of moments, and he may find that they are good enough for his situation.

So he can spend $20 or so on some spring rubbers, or he can spend $1750 on KW coil-overs + extra money for completely unnecessary Swift springs? Even if they wear out quickly, you can buy an awful lot of spring rubbers for $1750!

FuzzyLog1c

iTrader: (4)

AAIIIC, they won't help enough. First and foremost, spring rubbers were designed for SMALL tweaks. This is not a "small tweak" situation. Additionally, the type of spring that he's using is not conducive to the application of spring rubbers. You probably already know this, but progressive rate springs (such as those included with the H&R lowering kit) are made by varying the spacing between the spring's coils. As the spring compresses, each coil locks out in sequence, increasing the rate of the spring. This makes it very difficult to use spring rubbers because the variable gaps between the coils are not conducive to installing spring rubbers, and because the spring rubbers will not be loaded until much of the compression has already taken place.

Steele X-hard (80A) 2.5" spring rubbers are about the hardest spring rubbers that you can get. They're equivalent to about 60 in-lbs apiece (when they're brand new). You can probably get two of them in each progressive spring. And they'll last eight months, tops. At that point, they'll be squashed and brittle. They were meant to last for several track events, not daily driver use.

Let's consider the effect of the spring rubbers using a hypothetical scenario. I could calculate weight transfer due to peak acceleration (example here), but let's just say that his car is squatting by 2", and he wants to reduce that to one inch.

Two inches of compression on a 400 in-lb spring means that each spring is seeing an additional 800 lbs of force during acceleration. Add two 60 in-lb spring rubbers to each spring, and now you have an effective spring rate of 520 in-lbs. Assuming the spring is linear (which it's not, so this number will not be conservative) 800/520 = 1.53". A significant improvement, but not enough (based on my experience) to justify the time that'll be required to install and maintain this weak, bandaided suspension system.

But hey, don't learn a lesson from the $1100 I spent trying to bandaid the Ground Control + MM kit. So yeah--$1750 is a lot of spring rubbers. But I'd rather have him spend the money now and avoid wasting 3/4 of the cost and hundreds of hours researching and tweaking, only to give up in the end. You can spend a lot of money trying to save a buck.


Steel X-Hard Spring Rubbers (center row, to the rear)

liqidvenom

iTrader: (2)

To the OP how much power are you making.... if you are making some silly amount of hp that might explain some of the squat you are seeing.

rbsurfer

400 wheel off bottle and 500 wheel on but I'm squatting off the bottle and it is making me loose all traction

ravenls6v

400hp at the wheels with exhaust and a ported intake?

FuzzyLog1c

iTrader: (4)

400 RWHP is reasonable. The ported intake and throttle body make an impact, especially on the LS2, which has a terrible intake manifold.

ravenls6v

Seems a little generous, but tis the season!

FuzzyLog1c

iTrader: (4)

I made 381 RWHP (Dynojet @ Jannetty Racing) on a Volant tube, Lingenfelter airbox, 1-7/8" OBX headers, and catted Magnaflow. That increased to 422 RWHP (Mustang @ Slowhawk Performance) on a moderate cam, ported intake manifold, and ported throttle body. Stock, unported 243 heads. Excessively strong Comp Cams 26926 (470 in-lbs open seat pressure) valve springs. Heavier 15W-40 Redline diesel oil in the motor and 80W-140 Redline GL-5 gear oil in the differential. It's in the ballpark.

ravenls6v

Fuzzy, so do you think your ported intake/tb added as much hp as the cam did? Seems like that's what it would have to do for the 400rwhp to add up. Interesting if so.

Edit:Not trying to jack the op, sorry man.

FuzzyLog1c

iTrader: (4)

The LS2 intake flows worse than the LS1 and LS6 intakes (5 RWHP on stock motors).

For this manifold, GM switched to a new process that sonic-welded the three pieces together. Where the pieces are joined together, they rarely butt together properly and there are ridges and bumps that disrupt airflow. Porting the intake manifold smooths these transitions, allowing the intake to flow 5-10 RWHP better than the LS6 intake (10-15 RWHP total).

The LS2 intake is one of the major reasons why FAST has such a large mind share amongst the community right now. People think that they have something really special, when in reality, it's more of a case of GM making a bad product. GM improved their process for the LS3 intake manifold, and as a result, the FAST 102 LS3 intake is only worth 3-5 RWHP over the stock LS3 manifold. A lot of people coming from LS6/LS2 motors have been freaking out on LS1Tech about spending $1200 on a LS3 FAST 102 intake and not seeing the expected 15-20 RWHP (which were LS2 gains).

To answer your question: a ported LS2 intake manifold and throttle body will almost equal a moderately-sized cam, if you don't install new heads. That was my mistake--I should have had my heads ported when I did my cam. The higher lift provided by the cam doesn't do you a whole lot of good if the heads can't flow way up there. You still have the additional duration, though, so all is not lost. If I wasn't going to replace the motor with something much larger, I would install my ported LSA heads and ported LS3 intake manifold, and gain another 20-25 RWHP.

itsslow98

iTrader: (18)

No LS2 cts-v is making 400rwhp with just a ported intake and long tubes. It just isnt happening.

I made 500/510 on the bottle and even with 4 people in the car it would never squat bad enough to hit the bump stops. I have also sprayed with that many people in the car before.

MN_V

iTrader: (5)

^this

rbsurfer

I have k&n ported tb and im long tubes no cats and corsa to be exact it made 395 wheel at sea level. Not tuned with out the ported goodies it made 370 and without a tune and slapped the ported stuff on while it was strapped to the dyno and it made 384 wheel

serik21

When my shocks were going out and with the hr springs it would squat more than usual. Then as a expiriment I ordered the cts-v shocks off rockauto and it squated like no ones business. So I just bought kws still didnt put them on yet but I know it will ne better.

bombog

Any of you guys have any experience with the ksports coilovers for the v ...or any info on them ..thx

AAIIIC

iTrader: (19)

I wouldn't be surprised if this is as much a perception issue as anything else, in which case even gaining a little bit of squat reduction may be enough for rbsurfer. Nobody says he has to try it over and over and over again (to the point of spending $1100) before deciding that it's not the fix he's looking for.

I bet the search function could tell you about them. I'll give you a hint - search for "ksport".