ls7 clutch install - pressure plate bolts
temp went up as you accelerated and dropped when you slowed down, right? 
04-18-2014, 12:41 PM
#22
I thought those two sensors that are exactly the same fitting (one is orange and one is purple) were the speedo and the other was the reverse lockout. I can't remember which goes where, but switch those two and you should be good. I remember the first time I did my clutch, I accidentally flipped them and I couldn't get into reverse, and the speedo didn't work.
Sounds like the clutch needs bled some more if your pedal sucks. Hopefully you put in a remote line to make it easy on yourself.
Sounds like the clutch needs bled some more if your pedal sucks. Hopefully you put in a remote line to make it easy on yourself.
04-18-2014, 01:28 PM
#23
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It didn't follow my speed like I thought it would.
I thought those two sensors that are exactly the same fitting (one is orange and one is purple) were the speedo and the other was the reverse lockout. I can't remember which goes where, but switch those two and you should be good. I remember the first time I did my clutch, I accidentally flipped them and I couldn't get into reverse, and the speedo didn't work.
Sounds like the clutch needs bled some more if your pedal sucks. Hopefully you put in a remote line to make it easy on yourself.
Sounds like the clutch needs bled some more if your pedal sucks. Hopefully you put in a remote line to make it easy on yourself.
04-18-2014, 02:07 PM
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Yeah, temp sensor is different size and serves as the drain as well.
What Lolly said applies. There are two connectors the same size (Orange and Purple) on the same side (think it's passenger). I've done it before as well.
What Lolly said applies. There are two connectors the same size (Orange and Purple) on the same side (think it's passenger). I've done it before as well.
04-18-2014, 05:41 PM
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Update: I put another liter of fluid thru the system bleeding it again this afternoon, then got under her and swapped those sensor plugs over... Reverse is now good to go and the pedal came up a bit. I'm sure it'll come up more as I break it in. Anyway, all is well! Now I just can't wait to stomp on it and wind her out through 4th 
To be specific, I tried R a bunch before swapping the sensor plugs but after bleeding the clutch, but there was no difference. Still blocked out. I could 'roll' it into R but at a standstill there's no way it would go. After swapping the sensor plugs, it easily shifted into R. So having those plugs backwards had me blocked out for sure..
To be specific, I tried R a bunch before swapping the sensor plugs but after bleeding the clutch, but there was no difference. Still blocked out. I could 'roll' it into R but at a standstill there's no way it would go. After swapping the sensor plugs, it easily shifted into R. So having those plugs backwards had me blocked out for sure..
Last edited by wes8398; 04-18-2014 at 05:46 PM.
04-18-2014, 07:59 PM
#26
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I would drive it and then bleed it again in about a week. I bled mine about 4 times in the first 2 weeks and has been great sense. I even think my pedal is kinda high, I find myself still on the gas when I push the clutch in sometimes causing a little rev
04-20-2014, 08:42 PM
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Well, happy Easter guys. I'm stuck workin' nights tonight and tomorrow night, so I'll probably be one of very few souls creepin' around the forum, but I had some follow-up to post about. Rather than start a new thread, I figured I'd see if anyone's still watching this one...
So, my last post I said everything was good-a-go with getting in to R, etc after I'd switched the speedo/temp sensor plugs around and a little more bleeding. Unfortunately, that didn't last. I got a day and a half of grocery-getting around town out of it, then it stopped wanting to go into R again. I bled some more - once via the pedal (that check valve in the remote line is handy!), and once with my Motive bleeder (put 15-20 psi on it...is that enough?)...both times I put about 1/4 of a quart through it. This time, it didn't seem to come around after the bleeding though. Here are the symptoms:
- Will only go into R if I really jam it in, roll the car a bit and put it in gear at the same time, or turn the engine off (and then it goes easily).
- 5th and 6th seem to be a little notchier than what they used to be. I have Brian's 1st gen shifter installed, but I've had that for years now and know that's not what I'm feeling.
I know that there's a good period of time that I'll be bleeding a lot and breaking things in, etc but my concerns are when the break-in period is over and I do my first hard shifts...I don't want any expensive surprises. And I'd obviously like to have reverse back without all the extra Fing around to get into it.
Do you think these are normal "growing pains" of the new clutch, or is there something wrong that I should have my mechanic investigate? Any ideas/suggestions/opinions would be greatly appreciated.
So, my last post I said everything was good-a-go with getting in to R, etc after I'd switched the speedo/temp sensor plugs around and a little more bleeding. Unfortunately, that didn't last. I got a day and a half of grocery-getting around town out of it, then it stopped wanting to go into R again. I bled some more - once via the pedal (that check valve in the remote line is handy!), and once with my Motive bleeder (put 15-20 psi on it...is that enough?)...both times I put about 1/4 of a quart through it. This time, it didn't seem to come around after the bleeding though. Here are the symptoms:
- Will only go into R if I really jam it in, roll the car a bit and put it in gear at the same time, or turn the engine off (and then it goes easily).
- 5th and 6th seem to be a little notchier than what they used to be. I have Brian's 1st gen shifter installed, but I've had that for years now and know that's not what I'm feeling.
I know that there's a good period of time that I'll be bleeding a lot and breaking things in, etc but my concerns are when the break-in period is over and I do my first hard shifts...I don't want any expensive surprises. And I'd obviously like to have reverse back without all the extra Fing around to get into it.
Do you think these are normal "growing pains" of the new clutch, or is there something wrong that I should have my mechanic investigate? Any ideas/suggestions/opinions would be greatly appreciated.
04-20-2014, 10:37 PM
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Naaw... I'd have to fiddle with it the odd time, but never like this.
I had a good look at the line and all that today and it's kept a good distance from the cat and seems to be nice and safe. I should have mentioned that my pedal's actually been feeling great ever since the 1st re-bleed I did. Engagement is pretty close to stock already, actually. Which makes the reverse issue even more concerning to me...
I had a good look at the line and all that today and it's kept a good distance from the cat and seems to be nice and safe. I should have mentioned that my pedal's actually been feeling great ever since the 1st re-bleed I did. Engagement is pretty close to stock already, actually. Which makes the reverse issue even more concerning to me...
04-20-2014, 10:53 PM
#32
A sporadic reverse issue is likely due to sagging motor mounts or a bum transmission mount. You may find that the car goes into reverse easily on an incline, and stubbornly refuse to go into reverse at all if you're parked the wrong way.
If you have a functioning hydraulic system (key), but dislike the strength of the shifter detent mechanism, you might want to check this out. I just figured it out today, after pouring over the T-56 manual. For those of us that have been around a while, this achieves what the Anti-Venom mod promised to deliver (and failed). Just make sure that you're not confusing a real hydraulic problem with the spring-loaded detent mechanism.
If you have a functioning hydraulic system (key), but dislike the strength of the shifter detent mechanism, you might want to check this out. I just figured it out today, after pouring over the T-56 manual. For those of us that have been around a while, this achieves what the Anti-Venom mod promised to deliver (and failed). Just make sure that you're not confusing a real hydraulic problem with the spring-loaded detent mechanism.
Last edited by FuzzyLog1c; 04-20-2014 at 11:01 PM.
04-21-2014, 12:34 AM
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A sporadic reverse issue is likely due to sagging motor mounts or a bum transmission mount. You may find that the car goes into reverse easily on an incline, and stubbornly refuse to go into reverse at all if you're parked the wrong way.
If you have a functioning hydraulic system (key), but dislike the strength of the shifter detent mechanism, you might want to check this out. I just figured it out today, after pouring over the T-56 manual. For those of us that have been around a while, this achieves what the Anti-Venom mod promised to deliver (and failed). Just make sure that you're not confusing a real hydraulic problem with the spring-loaded detent mechanism.
If you have a functioning hydraulic system (key), but dislike the strength of the shifter detent mechanism, you might want to check this out. I just figured it out today, after pouring over the T-56 manual. For those of us that have been around a while, this achieves what the Anti-Venom mod promised to deliver (and failed). Just make sure that you're not confusing a real hydraulic problem with the spring-loaded detent mechanism.
Interesting info on the detent adjustment! Thanks for the link. I don't imagine that's very accessible when the trans is in the car though, eh? If it is accessible and I can fiddle with it, is there any harm that can be done from too much/too little detent?
04-21-2014, 07:52 AM
#34
I've never messed with that detent. I'll admit, I'm not exactly sure what it's changing and while it's intriguing, I wouldn't remove the trans just to adjust it.
I always shift to 4th before I go to Reverse as habit now since T-56's are allergic to reverse for whatever reason.
I've never been a fan of power bleeders. I would try bleeding the clutch without it. Get a helper to push the pedal down while you bleed the clutch with the remote and a few wrenches. Don't let the reservoir go dry or you are introducing air in the lines.
I always shift to 4th before I go to Reverse as habit now since T-56's are allergic to reverse for whatever reason.
I've never been a fan of power bleeders. I would try bleeding the clutch without it. Get a helper to push the pedal down while you bleed the clutch with the remote and a few wrenches. Don't let the reservoir go dry or you are introducing air in the lines.
04-21-2014, 10:30 AM
#35
Detent only becomes a problem when you take a car and install a shifter that's has 40% less throw than stock. Because your moment arm just became shorter, the detent mechanism can transition from a positive feedback mechanism to an obstacle. Because torque is proportional to the length of your moment arm (T = r x F, where r is the length of the shifter above the pivot point), it doesn't take a whole lot less spring pressure to restore the balance.
It's not accessible with the transmission in the car, unfortunately. It might be possible to get at it with the transmission unsupported and forcing the engine/transmission to tilt back--if you'd like, I can check when I put my transmission back in. The only harm that could come of not having enough detent is that you could accidentally put the car into gear / pull it out of gear if you're a klutz.
By the way, if you're interested, I'm in the process of building a 5-way shifter shootout / review thread on VSeriesForums. Took me three transmission pulls to completely finish. It's going to be a couple of days before it's done and released, due to the amount of writing required, but you can sneak preview a whole bunch of pictures. And I'm adding more right now.
04-21-2014, 08:56 PM
#36
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I've never messed with that detent. I'll admit, I'm not exactly sure what it's changing and while it's intriguing, I wouldn't remove the trans just to adjust it.
I always shift to 4th before I go to Reverse as habit now since T-56's are allergic to reverse for whatever reason.
I've never been a fan of power bleeders. I would try bleeding the clutch without it. Get a helper to push the pedal down while you bleed the clutch with the remote and a few wrenches. Don't let the reservoir go dry or you are introducing air in the lines.
I always shift to 4th before I go to Reverse as habit now since T-56's are allergic to reverse for whatever reason.
I've never been a fan of power bleeders. I would try bleeding the clutch without it. Get a helper to push the pedal down while you bleed the clutch with the remote and a few wrenches. Don't let the reservoir go dry or you are introducing air in the lines.
Of course I'm sure not to empty the reservoir. I find I get 3 full pumps, then have to refill and repeat.Here's the thing: detent is a good thing--it provides positive feedback that is critical under aggressive driving conditions when you don't have time to think about whether the car is in gear or not.
Detent only becomes a problem when you take a car and install a shifter that's has 40% less throw than stock. Because your moment arm just became shorter, the detent mechanism can transition from a positive feedback mechanism to an obstacle. Because torque is proportional to the length of your moment arm (T = r x F, where r is the length of the shifter above the pivot point), it doesn't take a whole lot less spring pressure to restore the balance.
It's not accessible with the transmission in the car, unfortunately. It might be possible to get at it with the transmission unsupported and forcing the engine/transmission to tilt back--if you'd like, I can check when I put my transmission back in. The only harm that could come of not having enough detent is that you could accidentally put the car into gear / pull it out of gear if you're a klutz.
By the way, if you're interested, I'm in the process of building a 5-way shifter shootout / review thread on VSeriesForums. Took me three transmission pulls to completely finish. It's going to be a couple of days before it's done and released, due to the amount of writing required, but you can sneak preview a whole bunch of pictures. And I'm adding more right now.
Detent only becomes a problem when you take a car and install a shifter that's has 40% less throw than stock. Because your moment arm just became shorter, the detent mechanism can transition from a positive feedback mechanism to an obstacle. Because torque is proportional to the length of your moment arm (T = r x F, where r is the length of the shifter above the pivot point), it doesn't take a whole lot less spring pressure to restore the balance.
It's not accessible with the transmission in the car, unfortunately. It might be possible to get at it with the transmission unsupported and forcing the engine/transmission to tilt back--if you'd like, I can check when I put my transmission back in. The only harm that could come of not having enough detent is that you could accidentally put the car into gear / pull it out of gear if you're a klutz.
By the way, if you're interested, I'm in the process of building a 5-way shifter shootout / review thread on VSeriesForums. Took me three transmission pulls to completely finish. It's going to be a couple of days before it's done and released, due to the amount of writing required, but you can sneak preview a whole bunch of pictures. And I'm adding more right now.
And thanks to Brian (07CTSV) for pointing me to this thread, where I'm starting to come to the realization that this is going to cost me a bunch more money to remedy...
Last edited by wes8398; 04-21-2014 at 10:56 PM.
04-22-2014, 08:49 AM
#37
Well, happy Easter guys. I'm stuck workin' nights tonight and tomorrow night, so I'll probably be one of very few souls creepin' around the forum, but I had some follow-up to post about. Rather than start a new thread, I figured I'd see if anyone's still watching this one...
So, my last post I said everything was good-a-go with getting in to R, etc after I'd switched the speedo/temp sensor plugs around and a little more bleeding. Unfortunately, that didn't last. I got a day and a half of grocery-getting around town out of it, then it stopped wanting to go into R again. I bled some more - once via the pedal (that check valve in the remote line is handy!), and once with my Motive bleeder (put 15-20 psi on it...is that enough?)...both times I put about 1/4 of a quart through it. This time, it didn't seem to come around after the bleeding though. Here are the symptoms:
- Will only go into R if I really jam it in, roll the car a bit and put it in gear at the same time, or turn the engine off (and then it goes easily).
- 5th and 6th seem to be a little notchier than what they used to be. I have Brian's 1st gen shifter installed, but I've had that for years now and know that's not what I'm feeling.
I know that there's a good period of time that I'll be bleeding a lot and breaking things in, etc but my concerns are when the break-in period is over and I do my first hard shifts...I don't want any expensive surprises. And I'd obviously like to have reverse back without all the extra Fing around to get into it.
Do you think these are normal "growing pains" of the new clutch, or is there something wrong that I should have my mechanic investigate? Any ideas/suggestions/opinions would be greatly appreciated.
So, my last post I said everything was good-a-go with getting in to R, etc after I'd switched the speedo/temp sensor plugs around and a little more bleeding. Unfortunately, that didn't last. I got a day and a half of grocery-getting around town out of it, then it stopped wanting to go into R again. I bled some more - once via the pedal (that check valve in the remote line is handy!), and once with my Motive bleeder (put 15-20 psi on it...is that enough?)...both times I put about 1/4 of a quart through it. This time, it didn't seem to come around after the bleeding though. Here are the symptoms:
- Will only go into R if I really jam it in, roll the car a bit and put it in gear at the same time, or turn the engine off (and then it goes easily).
- 5th and 6th seem to be a little notchier than what they used to be. I have Brian's 1st gen shifter installed, but I've had that for years now and know that's not what I'm feeling.
I know that there's a good period of time that I'll be bleeding a lot and breaking things in, etc but my concerns are when the break-in period is over and I do my first hard shifts...I don't want any expensive surprises. And I'd obviously like to have reverse back without all the extra Fing around to get into it.
Do you think these are normal "growing pains" of the new clutch, or is there something wrong that I should have my mechanic investigate? Any ideas/suggestions/opinions would be greatly appreciated.
This will sound stupid, but maybe disconnect the battery for a few minutes to reset the computer. Maybe the car still thinks the sensors are backwards? Idk...worth a shot since it's free.
I'm still leaning towards a bleeding issue. I'd keep driving it around and then bleed it again a few more times.
04-23-2014, 12:22 AM
#38
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Copied and pasted from a PM I sent, and redundant from another thread (that isn't mine), but I wanted to post this here too. Hope that's ok with the Mods.
So... here's an update. If anyone's still following this, please post up your thoughts in response.
I got to drive the car a little more today than I have over the past week or so, since once I got up from night shift I had the rest of the day off. I made a few observations that may or may not change your opinion on my specific situation.
1) Getting into reverse is still an issue. Rolling into it is easy breezy, and getting into it with the engine off is equally easy. (this isn't new info, just somewhere to start)
2) The clutch doesn't seem to be dragging in any forward gears, but I only tested with the wheels down (didn't have a 2nd person to watch for me if I jacked the rear up). For all forward gears I put the trans into gear, pressed the clutch pedal all the way down, and revved and goosed the engine to 4,000 or so RPM. No movement (besides the engine torquing a bit...love that feeling!). I did the same in reverse and the car moved a bit, BUT that might've been a fluke. My garage floor apparently isn't perfectly level and I wonder if the engine torquing around caused the car to roll a bit. It was getting late and I dind't want to keep trying it because it's a bit of a loud experiment for the neighbours. lol
3) I've mentioned that some of my other shifts have felt....off. I've had a couple (but not consistent) grind-y 2-3 shifts that I thought were maybe caused by clutch issues. But the more I drive it, the more I wonder if they've been driver error. I'm still getting used to the new pedal engagement height and I wonder if my muscle memory is making me start the shift before my leg has the clutch pedal depressed far enough.
4) I experienced out-of-the-norm notchy-ness shifting to 5th and 6th the other day. Again, I was thinking it had to do with the new clutch. I don't have any other explanation for it, but today shifting to 5th and 6th was as smooth as it's always been...wtf? It was significantly cooler outside today than it was the other day, but does the ambient temperature have anything to do with how my car is shifting?! lol
In summary, today's driving was problem-free aside from the dicking around it would take to get it into reverse. This is different from my very brief drives to work over the last couple days. So, reverse issue aside, I've had a few days of problem-free driving and a few days of "something's not right" driving since this clutch has been installed. Oh, and a random day where getting into reverse was cake... too bad that didn't last. Again, wtf? lol
Last, I'm not sure if I've mentioned this or not but to be clear, I do have the (gray) Creative Steel motor mounts (with heat shields) installed, as well as Creative Steel's "soft, black" transmission mount. So sagging, etc shouldn't be an issue.... but maybe this could still be an alignment issue...?
Thoughts, guys?
So... here's an update. If anyone's still following this, please post up your thoughts in response.
I got to drive the car a little more today than I have over the past week or so, since once I got up from night shift I had the rest of the day off. I made a few observations that may or may not change your opinion on my specific situation.
1) Getting into reverse is still an issue. Rolling into it is easy breezy, and getting into it with the engine off is equally easy. (this isn't new info, just somewhere to start)
2) The clutch doesn't seem to be dragging in any forward gears, but I only tested with the wheels down (didn't have a 2nd person to watch for me if I jacked the rear up). For all forward gears I put the trans into gear, pressed the clutch pedal all the way down, and revved and goosed the engine to 4,000 or so RPM. No movement (besides the engine torquing a bit...love that feeling!). I did the same in reverse and the car moved a bit, BUT that might've been a fluke. My garage floor apparently isn't perfectly level and I wonder if the engine torquing around caused the car to roll a bit. It was getting late and I dind't want to keep trying it because it's a bit of a loud experiment for the neighbours. lol
3) I've mentioned that some of my other shifts have felt....off. I've had a couple (but not consistent) grind-y 2-3 shifts that I thought were maybe caused by clutch issues. But the more I drive it, the more I wonder if they've been driver error. I'm still getting used to the new pedal engagement height and I wonder if my muscle memory is making me start the shift before my leg has the clutch pedal depressed far enough.
4) I experienced out-of-the-norm notchy-ness shifting to 5th and 6th the other day. Again, I was thinking it had to do with the new clutch. I don't have any other explanation for it, but today shifting to 5th and 6th was as smooth as it's always been...wtf? It was significantly cooler outside today than it was the other day, but does the ambient temperature have anything to do with how my car is shifting?! lol
In summary, today's driving was problem-free aside from the dicking around it would take to get it into reverse. This is different from my very brief drives to work over the last couple days. So, reverse issue aside, I've had a few days of problem-free driving and a few days of "something's not right" driving since this clutch has been installed. Oh, and a random day where getting into reverse was cake... too bad that didn't last. Again, wtf? lol
Last, I'm not sure if I've mentioned this or not but to be clear, I do have the (gray) Creative Steel motor mounts (with heat shields) installed, as well as Creative Steel's "soft, black" transmission mount. So sagging, etc shouldn't be an issue.... but maybe this could still be an alignment issue...?
Thoughts, guys?
04-23-2014, 05:04 PM
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Wes, I just read your update hmmmmmm interesting.
I had the trans, shifter, trans/motor mounts/ and clutch done at once. It was notchy as hell in the beginning but loosened up after a while. I never noticed reverse issues BUT...
Like you I noticed a faint synchro grind that I thought was me shifting too fast with the new shifter. This grind was apparent on 3-4 shifts near redline. So I slowed down, the grind was intermittent for a while so I didn't know what the hell was going on. Then I noticed it a little more, with granny shifts but still high on the tach. I started playing with it and found that 2-4 shifts and 6-4 shifts brought it out quite a bit. Wasn't sure if it was the shifter since some people seem to think the shorter throws overwork the synchros. Problem was I couldn't duplicate it everytime UNTIL....
I realized it was only happening when the trans temp got up to 130 plus degrees. Then it was happening constant. SO a rebuilt trans with new mounts, new shifter, and new ls7 clutch and I suddenly had synchro issues. I called tick and several other trans shops and no one could figure out why it would do it with warm trans fluid, it should be the other way around. My shop says the rebuilt was probably bad and warranty company is sending another transmission. I don't want to go through it all again so I have been trying to determine what else it could be. Shop also said there shouldn't be any issues with my clutch setup since it was oem, and the mounts are all supposed to be spec so wouldn't make sense either. They say the shifters can degrade synchros but its so slight that it would be like a 100k mile issue, not a 2 month degradation. Your problem is making me scratch my head as well since there are some similarities. The new trans goes in this May and I will see if the issue returns and keep you posted.
I had the trans, shifter, trans/motor mounts/ and clutch done at once. It was notchy as hell in the beginning but loosened up after a while. I never noticed reverse issues BUT...
Like you I noticed a faint synchro grind that I thought was me shifting too fast with the new shifter. This grind was apparent on 3-4 shifts near redline. So I slowed down, the grind was intermittent for a while so I didn't know what the hell was going on. Then I noticed it a little more, with granny shifts but still high on the tach. I started playing with it and found that 2-4 shifts and 6-4 shifts brought it out quite a bit. Wasn't sure if it was the shifter since some people seem to think the shorter throws overwork the synchros. Problem was I couldn't duplicate it everytime UNTIL....
I realized it was only happening when the trans temp got up to 130 plus degrees. Then it was happening constant. SO a rebuilt trans with new mounts, new shifter, and new ls7 clutch and I suddenly had synchro issues. I called tick and several other trans shops and no one could figure out why it would do it with warm trans fluid, it should be the other way around. My shop says the rebuilt was probably bad and warranty company is sending another transmission. I don't want to go through it all again so I have been trying to determine what else it could be. Shop also said there shouldn't be any issues with my clutch setup since it was oem, and the mounts are all supposed to be spec so wouldn't make sense either. They say the shifters can degrade synchros but its so slight that it would be like a 100k mile issue, not a 2 month degradation. Your problem is making me scratch my head as well since there are some similarities. The new trans goes in this May and I will see if the issue returns and keep you posted.
04-23-2014, 10:14 PM
#40
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Another day of bootin' around town and I'm now more confident that the slight grind I was experiencing was driver error and not trans/clutch related. Hopefully that remains the case when I'm able to make some WOT/high RPM shifts (after break-in).
Only issue I'm still having regularly is getting into reverse. I've been experimenting a bit and it does kind of seem that if the car's on an incline (nose higher), it REALLY doesn't want to go. If it's flat, it takes some effin' around and some force, but it'll usually go. If it's on a decent decline (*** end higher), it seems to go easier. I dunno man...
I've also been noticing that 5th and 6th are only intermittently more notchy than they used to be. Sometimes they're no different that they used to be; sometimes they're notchier.
Does anyone think that the aforementioned observations might point away from slave/clutch issues, and more toward trans alignment (mount) issues? It's even been suggested to me that the bell housing could fairly easily have not been snugged ALL the way up when the bolts were torqued. Anyone have any thoughts?
Only issue I'm still having regularly is getting into reverse. I've been experimenting a bit and it does kind of seem that if the car's on an incline (nose higher), it REALLY doesn't want to go. If it's flat, it takes some effin' around and some force, but it'll usually go. If it's on a decent decline (*** end higher), it seems to go easier. I dunno man...
I've also been noticing that 5th and 6th are only intermittently more notchy than they used to be. Sometimes they're no different that they used to be; sometimes they're notchier.
Does anyone think that the aforementioned observations might point away from slave/clutch issues, and more toward trans alignment (mount) issues? It's even been suggested to me that the bell housing could fairly easily have not been snugged ALL the way up when the bolts were torqued. Anyone have any thoughts?