V2 headers on V1?
05-19-2017, 10:27 AM
#41
Wow, this is great news! Thanks for being the pioneer on this Fuzzy. I'm not yet in need as my 5 year old, wrapped OBX headers have managed to hold up fine in my climate, but this is definitely good to know that other (bigger) options are now available.
The fact that 2" headers fit better than 1.875" headers shows that Kooks really messed up the first variant. One question, though, is how much closer are these new primaries to the motor mounts?
The fact that 2" headers fit better than 1.875" headers shows that Kooks really messed up the first variant. One question, though, is how much closer are these new primaries to the motor mounts?
05-19-2017, 10:47 AM
#42
Unfortunately, they're 409 stainless regardless of what the eBay seller says. My Magnaflow exhaust and OBX headers have experienced the same environmental conditions. After 5 years, the headers are falling apart (multiple welds have nearly evaporated) but the 304SS exhaust is fine, except for some color changes due to the heat.
05-19-2017, 01:31 PM
#44
Unfortunately, there have been too many changes to do an apples to apples comparison against my old numbers. I'm not going to dyno with the old headers since they have holes in them. However, I'll keep your request in mind and see if there's relevant comparison data available online.
Last edited by FuzzyLog1c; 05-19-2017 at 02:59 PM.
05-19-2017, 02:17 PM
#45
TECH Addict
In my experience, To do any good the coatings have to be a true ceramic, not just a base high temp powder, and the only coatings I've found that do much are a silver ceramic or white, colors are hard to get in a true ceramic. The good ones require a 400+ degree bake to cure and then a continuous run after install to finish the tempering cure..
Had a set on a sprint done and was quite amazing how fast you could touch the pipes bare handed after the car came off track.. We use the silver which turned out to be darker, but looked kinda cool.. <pun>
Had a set on a sprint done and was quite amazing how fast you could touch the pipes bare handed after the car came off track.. We use the silver which turned out to be darker, but looked kinda cool.. <pun>
05-19-2017, 03:40 PM
#46
Fwiw i have black coating on my motorcycle headers and aluminum can mufflers and you can touch the mufflers after a ride where the uncoated ones would melt a passengers boot heels. I wish i knew what it was exactly (I had it done locally and didnt really ask) but its been incredibly durable and keeps heat in really well.
05-19-2017, 10:06 PM
#47
Originally Posted by FuzzyLog1c
Unfortunately, there have been too many changes to do an apples to apples comparison against my old numbers. I'm not going to dyno with the old headers since they have holes in them. However, I'll keep your request in mind and see if there's relevant comparison data available online.
There only way to apple to apple yourself is to score 1 7/8 headers from the v2 as well do a run and compare to your newer 2" setup.
If i were goin to do this, i would get stepped headers for both bottom and top end performance.
05-19-2017, 11:28 PM
#49
Thinner head gaskets, CAI plumbed into space adjacent to driver's side foglamp, 100mm MAF, massive air filter with velocity stack, hand-ported heads, Geforce 9" IRS with 3.50 ratio, and different size wheels. By the time I get back to the tuner, I'll also probably be running Kooks 3" X-pipe with green cats.
I'm going to have small curved 2.5" sections 304SS pipe inserted. Any good exhaust shop can do it in an hour. If I wanted to maintain backwards compatibility, I could have them weld V-band clamps to it so that I could swap it with the original piece at will.
The link you provided is for a 3" outlet version of my Kooks 6760-FC cats, which have a 2.5" outlet and are welded to my 2.5" Magnaflow. The ball and socket is one size across all Kooks products. Therefore you can mix and match all sorts of 2.5" and 3.0" exhaust products. If you're interested in futureproofing the design like I am, the next step is to replace the majority of the Magnaflow with the 3" Kooks X-pipe and "green" catalytic converter kit (P/N 23113300). These cats are much higher quality than Kooks high flow cats and can handle boost without disintegrating. Unfortunately they will disintegrate your wallet.
I'll be getting the Kooks 3" X-pipe coated at Swain Tech. I did a bunch of temperature testing earlier with and found that the transmission tunnel of my car gets hot enough to partially unglue carbon fiber driveshafts. Even with a full DEI wrap, it's close to being a problem.
How are you going to line up the headers to the cats? Something like this work easily? http://www.ebay.com/itm/KOOKS-2004-2...xYa82g&vxp=mtr
The link you provided is for a 3" outlet version of my Kooks 6760-FC cats, which have a 2.5" outlet and are welded to my 2.5" Magnaflow. The ball and socket is one size across all Kooks products. Therefore you can mix and match all sorts of 2.5" and 3.0" exhaust products. If you're interested in futureproofing the design like I am, the next step is to replace the majority of the Magnaflow with the 3" Kooks X-pipe and "green" catalytic converter kit (P/N 23113300). These cats are much higher quality than Kooks high flow cats and can handle boost without disintegrating. Unfortunately they will disintegrate your wallet.
I'll be getting the Kooks 3" X-pipe coated at Swain Tech. I did a bunch of temperature testing earlier with and found that the transmission tunnel of my car gets hot enough to partially unglue carbon fiber driveshafts. Even with a full DEI wrap, it's close to being a problem.
Last edited by FuzzyLog1c; 05-19-2017 at 11:51 PM.
05-20-2017, 08:49 PM
#51
That's an excellent question with an unfortunate answer. The 2" V2 headers are within 0.85" of my Revshift motor mounts. The nearest primary on the 1-7/8" V1 headers is about 2" away. In short, coating is highly advisable.
Last edited by FuzzyLog1c; 05-21-2017 at 08:25 PM.
05-21-2017, 09:56 AM
#53
Just the included silicone shields.
There is no perceptible heat damage to them, despite the nearly-always dilapidated state of the wrap on my OBX headers (it's a constant battle for a DD car). If I see heat damage after running the ceramic-coated 2" Kooks, I'll buy another set of motor mounts and put a reflective shield around them.
There is no perceptible heat damage to them, despite the nearly-always dilapidated state of the wrap on my OBX headers (it's a constant battle for a DD car). If I see heat damage after running the ceramic-coated 2" Kooks, I'll buy another set of motor mounts and put a reflective shield around them.
05-21-2017, 05:45 PM
#54
Fuzzy, you could always go with the CS mounts as they already have the metal heat shields...wonder how tight a squeeze those would be?
05-21-2017, 06:17 PM
#55
I guess the original Kooks were designed to give the V1 motor mounts a chance to breathe a little which wasn't so messed up considering people were melting earlier design motor mounts down.
Fuzzy, you could always go with the CS mounts as they already have the metal heat shields...wonder how tight a squeeze those would be?
Fuzzy, you could always go with the CS mounts as they already have the metal heat shields...wonder how tight a squeeze those would be?
Let's wait and see how the silicone heat shields handle the heat before taking additional action.
05-21-2017, 07:05 PM
#56
I'd sling some of this stuff in there, cheap insurance and works pretty well.
https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/...erm=heat+wrap#
https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/...erm=heat+wrap#
05-21-2017, 08:34 PM
#58
I installed the passenger side header, looked everything over, and didn't notice any differences. I didn't think measurements were necessary there.
However, I did another measurement on the driver side header and found that I was off on V1 the header clearance measurement. It's hard to measure accurately. The #5 primary gets to within 2" of the motor mounts, not 2.5". I edited my previous post with this correction.
However, I did another measurement on the driver side header and found that I was off on V1 the header clearance measurement. It's hard to measure accurately. The #5 primary gets to within 2" of the motor mounts, not 2.5". I edited my previous post with this correction.
05-22-2017, 11:14 AM
#60
I appreciate the suggestions. However I think the heat issue has been blown out of proportion.
A lot of the people that complained about melted motor mounts either had uncoated headers or did not identify whether their headers had protection. Before I buy into the idea that heat is a problem, I'd like to go back through the annals of internet history and tally up who had what.
Also, I don't agree that Kooks designed their headers in response to the Creative Steel motor mount fiasco. The timelines don't line up. IIRC, the Kooks headers became available in 2006-2007, long before motor mount issues became apparent.
A lot of the people that complained about melted motor mounts either had uncoated headers or did not identify whether their headers had protection. Before I buy into the idea that heat is a problem, I'd like to go back through the annals of internet history and tally up who had what.
Also, I don't agree that Kooks designed their headers in response to the Creative Steel motor mount fiasco. The timelines don't line up. IIRC, the Kooks headers became available in 2006-2007, long before motor mount issues became apparent.
Last edited by FuzzyLog1c; 05-22-2017 at 12:41 PM.