02Hawk502

Perhaps no more potential, but the bay to bay breathing that results in fewer pumping losses in the LS6 block is definitely an advantage over the LS1.

Paul F

iTrader: (2)

That has never been proven to offer a performance advantage. Also the LS6 block was the blocks that were used in most '02 LS1s and almost all 03-04 LS1s. It was only LS6 specific in the '01 model year for the Z06s.


.

02Hawk502

If it wasn't an advantage, they would have just drilled holes in the mains when they made the LS6 blocks like they did on the LS1 blocks.

Whatever you want to think though....given a choice, I'd take an LS6 block over an LS1.

Gloveperson

iTrader: (9)

Bingo. While it has basically been proven that the gain is slim to none, on my next rebuild I would rather use an LS6 than an LS1 if I get the chance. Although the LS7 looks pretty nice

silergoat

04 GTO HAS LS6 BLOCK/JUST DIFFERENT HEADS/CAM THAN CTS-V

ram-it

With the revision for better internal breating and oil flow wouldn't you want to have those advantages when building a motor versus one that doesn't? Better is better. If GM did not like the block better they would not have phased out the LS1 block is my thinking. I have an article from GMHTP a couple of years ago that I will try to dig up that discusses the LS6 block. How about you prove that your right?

ram-it

Here is a very informative article presented by GM engineers.

http://www.c5registry.com/Documents/ls6/page3.htm

Paul F

iTrader: (2)

LOL... Sorry I didn't mean to offend you. It really wouldn't matter to me what block I had in my car and for the most strengh I rather have the LS1 block myself. The webbing is a little more solid in the LS1 blocks. My LS1 blocked 375cid makes 500rwhp NA so I think it's okay.


Paul

ram-it

According to GM the LS6 has more overall strength than the LS1 in the link I posted above. Either way they are both great engines.

99Z51R

iTrader: (18)

Actually most engine builders will use an LS1 block over an LS6 block because they are stronger due to more material in the block. When I was shopping my shortblock at various vendors they all said to use the LS1 block even though it was minimal differance.

Eric

fastkars.com

Dave's V

CTS V vs any GTO is really no competition. There is a reason why the two cars vary in price so much. The GTO is fast but its standard features are very limited when you compare it to the V. One is 2 doors with a small trunk, the other has 4 doors, a regular trunk and a GTO size trunk where the spare tire is suppose to go.

The LS2 is an amazing engine but the LS6 IMO is better. It seems to pull away in higher RPMs while still producing tons of torque down low.

I have heard some 04 GTO owners say they can hit low 13s stock. Whatever!! The 05 GTO is faster but it also has a different chassis. IMO, the V transmits the power to the ground better with the exception of the dreaded wheel hop. I bet the GTO has some problems also. 05 GTO is nice, espeically with the sports appearance package, but that also adds weight. The V doesn't need any help.

They are both nice cars but a V owner probably wouldn't buy a GTO. I think most V owners would be starving for all of the features of a V if they bought a GTO.

In the future, I believe the GTO will fade away. Ponitac might even be like Olds soon. The V and the Cadillac name will remain.

cvp33

'04 and '05 GTO's have the same chassis. '05's are much better cars with upgraded brakes, body add-on's, split dual exhaust and of course the 6.0 liter LS2. It's a bargain at just over $30K. I'd still take the V over it but if money was an issue the GTO would be on my short list. Great car and one hell of a handler.

Dave's V

I agree it is a great car. I didn't like the 04 version because of the looks and it was sort of underpowered for a sporty coupe. I like the 05 with the SAP and of coarse the LS2.

I was comparing the GTO chassis to the V's chassis. Both are great, but I believe the V's has been engineered better. I think it is the Sigma chassis which was extensively used by Opel in Germany.

If cost was a concern, I would probably buy the GTO or wait a little bit for the V. Luckily, I didn't have to make that decision.

GMCtrk

iTrader: (23)

Wait till LS2edit comes out, it will be a different story then

70GTO

And ls2 might show up in 2006 v

Dave's V

The current LS2 makes 400 hp so if they keep it the same I don't see a big improvement when it does come out.

This isn't like comparing an 04 to and 05 GTO. Their 5.7 was very different from ours.

GM won't let the CTS V beat the Vette also. It would be hard anyway due to a 700 lb or so weight disadvantage.

30thWS6

You can't compare the handling of the GTO to the V. You can't compare the authenticity of the GTO to the V. You can't compare the braking of the GTO to the V and you can't compare the over rated interior of the GTO to the V. But one thing that can be compared, is the LS2 and LS6. IMO the LS2 is a better engine than the LS6. More cubes, more compression, along with similar heads and cam found in the LS6. The LS2 also fixed most, if not all, of the problems with the LS1, while the LS6 fixed some of the bigger issues only. The LS6 makes equivalent power but at a higher RPM than the LS2. In my estimation the GTO LS2 should be a faster car than the V. I admire the GTO for making 400HP for a bit over $30K, but absolutely despise the fact that it is called a GTO.

Dave's V

The LS2 is nice because if its extra .3 liters of displacement but I like the LS6's ability to rev at higher speeds more effectively than the LS2. I think the LS2 starts to put out around 250 ft/lbs of torque at idle. This engine doesn't need to be driven hard to get power from it but it loves to rev to its redline.

The GTO is slower because of gearing. It has 3.42 gears compared to 3.73 in the V. Pontiac would have a real hard time selling the car if it had a $1300 gas tax added on to the price.

Even if it had the same gears, the GTO wouldn't necessarily be faster than the V. Chassis development is a big reason why. The GTO is slightly lighter as long as it doesn't have the SAP package bolted on, but not really enough to make a difference. All of the extra weight of the V is probably due to its more standard features.

I don't like using the GTO name either. Someone on a different board actually called the real GOAT a "glorified Granny's car".

Closer_2001

iTrader: (6)

GTO uses M12 (Z06 Tranny) same as CTS-V. Rear gear is 3.46 in GTO. Caddy with 3.73s is definitely shorter feeling.

I own a GTO. I paid less than 25k and put Z06 heads and G5X3 cam in her. I love the performance and feel. Hate the exterior look. Love the interior. The brakes are bad, but the ride and drive is excellent. My 24 month Smart Buy w/ 18k miles/year is $350/month w/ 0 Down. It was tough to beat for the $$.

If I was comparing 05 GTO to slightly used 04 CTS-V. The V wins hands down.