Why did they stop making the F-Body?
07-05-2006, 05:32 PM
#22
Originally Posted by Sartobuilt
The camaro was produced in a Canadaian plant. When sales were down Chevrolet wanted to move production to another location, but chevrolet had a contract. That they could only produce the camaro in Canada. The cotract was untill 2010.
This is what I heard.
I think this is why the GTO and new camaro is built down under. They have these type of powertrains in regular production.
This is what I heard.
I think this is why the GTO and new camaro is built down under. They have these type of powertrains in regular production.
We have a winner! The contract was that they had to build it under the deal with that Canadian plant, or else they could not build anything with the name Camaro or Firebird. They chose the latter. You can thank UAW Canada. How'd they get such a sweet contract? Because the govenment forces GM to deal with them. And you thought there was a free market. Hah!
Last edited by black_knight; 07-05-2006 at 05:38 PM.
07-05-2006, 05:59 PM
#23
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well if V6 sales had been up - they coulda just kept churning them out.
its obviously a combination of everything listed before.
Oh well - i'm sure they will all make a glorious return at some point.
its obviously a combination of everything listed before.
Oh well - i'm sure they will all make a glorious return at some point.
07-05-2006, 06:18 PM
#24
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As some have stated before, it is a combination of factors that led GM to throw in the towel.
(1)Sales were down. The V6 model couldn't compete with the V6 Mustang. Lets face it folks, the fbody platform isn't exactly easy to live with. Especially if you don't have the peformance bug to blind you to the shortcomings like us on this board do. To the unwashed masses, there were too many compromises with the V6.
(2)Labor disputes in the St. Teresa (SP?) plant in Canada. I've read mixed opinions on this, but the most widely agreed upon consenses is that no other plant could build Camaro and it would be too costly to retool the Canada plant for the next gen.
(3)The fbody would not meet the next round of government crash standards.
(4)GM lacked the desire and funds to invest in a new plantform. Trucks were the cash cows and the brass did not want to divert funds.
(1)Sales were down. The V6 model couldn't compete with the V6 Mustang. Lets face it folks, the fbody platform isn't exactly easy to live with. Especially if you don't have the peformance bug to blind you to the shortcomings like us on this board do. To the unwashed masses, there were too many compromises with the V6.
(2)Labor disputes in the St. Teresa (SP?) plant in Canada. I've read mixed opinions on this, but the most widely agreed upon consenses is that no other plant could build Camaro and it would be too costly to retool the Canada plant for the next gen.
(3)The fbody would not meet the next round of government crash standards.
(4)GM lacked the desire and funds to invest in a new plantform. Trucks were the cash cows and the brass did not want to divert funds.
07-05-2006, 06:23 PM
#25
Originally Posted by HandsomeBWouderful
Lets face it folks, the fbody platform isn't exactly easy to live with. Especially if you don't have the peformance bug to blind you to the shortcomings like us on this board do.
</blind to 'em>
07-06-2006, 12:17 PM
#27
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Simple... advertising. Not advertising like on TV. Other kinds of advertising. It is about getting it out there and letting people see them.
Example. When the new GTO's first came out how many did you see on the road. VERY FEW. If you had saw more more people would have had it grow on them and they would have bought them. Now when the '05 Mustang came out how many of those did you see. Not because everybody went out and bought them but look at the rental car business. Yeah they may have only been V6's but they were out there for people to look at. The only TV advertising (until recently) that I saw for new cars was not put out by the manufacturer it was put out by individual dealers.
I was excited when the new GTO came out as I am excited about the new Camaro. Heres another problem. They don't even have a chip for the GTO's. I know they changed the firing order to get more hp out of them but the aftermarket is tiny compared to many other cars out there.
Example. When the new GTO's first came out how many did you see on the road. VERY FEW. If you had saw more more people would have had it grow on them and they would have bought them. Now when the '05 Mustang came out how many of those did you see. Not because everybody went out and bought them but look at the rental car business. Yeah they may have only been V6's but they were out there for people to look at. The only TV advertising (until recently) that I saw for new cars was not put out by the manufacturer it was put out by individual dealers.
I was excited when the new GTO came out as I am excited about the new Camaro. Heres another problem. They don't even have a chip for the GTO's. I know they changed the firing order to get more hp out of them but the aftermarket is tiny compared to many other cars out there.
07-06-2006, 01:48 PM
#28
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Originally Posted by black_knight
Ding ding ding!
We have a winner! The contract was that they had to build it under the deal with that Canadian plant, or else they could not build anything with the name Camaro or Firebird. They chose the latter. You can thank UAW Canada. How'd they get such a sweet contract? Because the govenment forces GM to deal with them. And you thought there was a free market. Hah!
We have a winner! The contract was that they had to build it under the deal with that Canadian plant, or else they could not build anything with the name Camaro or Firebird. They chose the latter. You can thank UAW Canada. How'd they get such a sweet contract? Because the govenment forces GM to deal with them. And you thought there was a free market. Hah!
07-07-2006, 09:56 AM
#30
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The actual decision to kill the F body was made back in 1996. Due to demand they decided to continue production beyond 1997-1998 model year. The LS1 introduction in 1998 helped sales and kept the car alive till 2002. The car wouldn't pass the crash standards for 2003 and there was nothing planned at the time to replace it with so production ended. The part about not being able to produce another car with the Camaro/Firebird name is true because of the contracts with GM Canada. They negotiated with them and got the contract changed to allow them to use the Camaro/Firebird name for 2006 which is when the new concept was introduced.
As for the V6's I'd like to see what 4.3 was pushing 240HP from the factory. The truck motors were only rated at 180-190HP. The had a slightly higher torque rating than the 3.8 did. The power of the V6 had nothing to do with the decline in sales. The 4th gen cars in general were hard to see out of and hard to get in and out of and the styling was pushed too far from the original pony car to more of a full on 2+2 sports car. A lot of people also didn't like the fact that they were mostly plastic.
As for the V6's I'd like to see what 4.3 was pushing 240HP from the factory. The truck motors were only rated at 180-190HP. The had a slightly higher torque rating than the 3.8 did. The power of the V6 had nothing to do with the decline in sales. The 4th gen cars in general were hard to see out of and hard to get in and out of and the styling was pushed too far from the original pony car to more of a full on 2+2 sports car. A lot of people also didn't like the fact that they were mostly plastic.
07-07-2006, 06:02 PM
#31
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Originally Posted by ASUSMC
They don't even have a chip for the GTO's.
Also the Camaro isn't "being built" down under. If you guys want some real info, check out camaroz28.com's 5th gen section.
07-07-2006, 07:12 PM
#32
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Originally Posted by GETGONE
As for the V6's I'd like to see what 4.3 was pushing 240HP from the factory. The truck motors were only rated at 180-190HP. The had a slightly higher torque rating than the 3.8 did. The power of the V6 had nothing to do with the decline in sales. The 4th gen cars in general were hard to see out of and hard to get in and out of and the styling was pushed too far from the original pony car to more of a full on 2+2 sports car. A lot of people also didn't like the fact that they were mostly plastic.
07-08-2006, 10:35 AM
#33
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Last time I checked, the Corvette had zero metal body panels and was still a hell of a car. I don't think most people, particularly gearheads, care that GM decided to use lighter materials in the F body. Lighter body panels= better hp to weight ratio, better gas mileage, etc.
07-08-2006, 10:50 AM
#34
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I didn't care that the car was plastic. Since always liking and owned a Fiero I knew that it was nice not to worry about dings and rust with plastic panels. Most muscle car fans however thought it was cheap and wasn't a "real" car because it was mostly plastic. Most people somehow feel that steel is better/safer.
07-08-2006, 01:29 PM
#35
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Originally Posted by ChocoTaco369
they stuck a shitty 200hp motor in the V6 camaro's. they ran 16's! they should have had a 4.3L motor in there. those things should have been pushing 240hp and running low 15's off the floor. nobody wanted to buy a V6 and run 16's when for 4 grand more you can be running 13's and get the SAME GAS MILEAGE! gm did a terrible job building the V6 car. there is no reason why it should have been producing such low numbers. those things were dogs. the Y87 cars were the only decent cars (came with a posi and 3.42's). if they all came with 4.3L V6's, a posi and 3.42's, they would have sold a lot better.
Anyways, F-Bodys died due to poor sales and lack of help from GM to get the car out...and for some unknown reason people liked the Mustangs more dunno why.
07-08-2006, 07:10 PM
#37
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Originally Posted by ChocoTaco369
they stuck a shitty 200hp motor in the V6 camaro's. they ran 16's! they should have had a 4.3L motor in there. those things should have been pushing 240hp and running low 15's off the floor. nobody wanted to buy a V6 and run 16's when for 4 grand more you can be running 13's and get the SAME GAS MILEAGE! gm did a terrible job building the V6 car. there is no reason why it should have been producing such low numbers. those things were dogs. the Y87 cars were the only decent cars (came with a posi and 3.42's). if they all came with 4.3L V6's, a posi and 3.42's, they would have sold a lot better.
