1970 Camaro RS: Operation Budget LSx
06-26-2011, 12:50 AM
#142
All done for the night. Too tired to move forward.
Fixed all of the leaks. Two of the fittings in the fuel log were finger tight, so that had a lot to do with it. Tefloned all of the NPT fittings and that was that.
Got the electric fuel pressure guage working. I will get pictures of that later. Found that the sendor wasn't getting ground through the fuel fitting it was in. Made a ground strap, grabbed a couple of washers and sandwhiched the terminal end between the fitting and the sendor. Viola, pressure guage works. Only 4psi at the moment, but I will adjust that later.
Disconnected the fuel pump relay ground and started wiring in a on/off toggle switch. (12v switched plus toggled ground). This also allowed me to work on the electrical system without the pump running.
Wired in another relay and breaker for the ignition. Verified there was 12v going to the coil packs. Figured, "hey...there's enough fuel still in the fuel bowls to fire this thing off...". Cranked it over and....nothing. Pulled a plug wire and no spark. Must not be getting a signal from one of the sensors. I will have to figure that out later next week. I have a usb to serial adaptor coming in the mail and I will use the MSD software to see what's happening. No work tommorrow, the McGrew family heads to the Zoo for the day!
Fixed all of the leaks. Two of the fittings in the fuel log were finger tight, so that had a lot to do with it. Tefloned all of the NPT fittings and that was that.
Got the electric fuel pressure guage working. I will get pictures of that later. Found that the sendor wasn't getting ground through the fuel fitting it was in. Made a ground strap, grabbed a couple of washers and sandwhiched the terminal end between the fitting and the sendor. Viola, pressure guage works. Only 4psi at the moment, but I will adjust that later.
Disconnected the fuel pump relay ground and started wiring in a on/off toggle switch. (12v switched plus toggled ground). This also allowed me to work on the electrical system without the pump running.
Wired in another relay and breaker for the ignition. Verified there was 12v going to the coil packs. Figured, "hey...there's enough fuel still in the fuel bowls to fire this thing off...". Cranked it over and....nothing. Pulled a plug wire and no spark. Must not be getting a signal from one of the sensors. I will have to figure that out later next week. I have a usb to serial adaptor coming in the mail and I will use the MSD software to see what's happening. No work tommorrow, the McGrew family heads to the Zoo for the day!
07-15-2011, 01:02 AM
#143
CAR GOES VROOOM!
Got to thinking about the 12v switched source I was using to power my ignition and fuel pump relays. Could I have picked a source that went to 0 volts while cranking? Hooked up the old volt meter and cranked...sure enough, from 12v to 0 while cranking! Ok, new 12v source needed. Stole the one I was using for my electric fan...same issue. Not a problem for the fan though. Actually want that to quit running while cranking.
So, new approach. Wired 12 volts directly to the ignition and fuel pump relays and made the grounds switched. Well, I planned to make the fuel pump switched earlier, so what's one more toggle switch in my console going to hurt? So, I made up a temp wire to run around into the cabin to ground the ignition relay. Grounded the fuel pump relay long enough to run the pump and fill the fuel bowls. Held the ignition relay ground to a screw in the cabin..pumped the gas and cranked.
Sputter...sputter...sputter.
Ok! Now we're getting somewhere. More fuel. Sputter. More fuel.
VROOOOOM.
I immediately let go of the ground to the ignition and the engine stopped. All is well in my world tonight.
Got to thinking about the 12v switched source I was using to power my ignition and fuel pump relays. Could I have picked a source that went to 0 volts while cranking? Hooked up the old volt meter and cranked...sure enough, from 12v to 0 while cranking! Ok, new 12v source needed. Stole the one I was using for my electric fan...same issue. Not a problem for the fan though. Actually want that to quit running while cranking.
So, new approach. Wired 12 volts directly to the ignition and fuel pump relays and made the grounds switched. Well, I planned to make the fuel pump switched earlier, so what's one more toggle switch in my console going to hurt? So, I made up a temp wire to run around into the cabin to ground the ignition relay. Grounded the fuel pump relay long enough to run the pump and fill the fuel bowls. Held the ignition relay ground to a screw in the cabin..pumped the gas and cranked.
Sputter...sputter...sputter.
Ok! Now we're getting somewhere. More fuel. Sputter. More fuel.
VROOOOOM.
I immediately let go of the ground to the ignition and the engine stopped. All is well in my world tonight.
07-16-2011, 02:34 AM
#144
Wired up the switches for the fuel pump and ignition relays. They work. I know, it surprises even me. Also hooked up the tach signal wire, water temp guage, and the guage lights. Pre-ran the switch wire and installed the switch for the nitrous system.
Odd thing happened. Tried firing it up, pumped gas just like last night. Sputter, sputter...WHOOOOOSH big 6 foot high fireball! That got me out of the car and shaking a bit. Looked everything over and things checked out ok. Gave the car a minute, tried again and it fired up the second I hit the key. Ran it up to 3,000-4,000rpm for about 20 seconds. Damn thing runs well! Let it idle before I shut it off and it was at 1,400rpm. Made sure to adjust the idle screw a bit before I went about the next task.
BTW, this was at 11pm and I shouted into the night, "Sorry! I'M ALL DONE FOR TONIGHT, GOING TO BED! WOOOOHOOOO!" Sure my neighbors enjoyed the open headers for 30 seconds. They will LOVE them on Sunday when I go up and down the block...
To do for street trials:
1. Install steering wheel (removed it due to poor horn wire install job by me and for access to under dash wiring)
2. Reinstall or secure speedo cable
3. Get car off jackstands
4. Clean out car of the tons of crap in, on and around it
5. Fire and idle for leak check, cooling system bleed/function test
6. Find out why electric fuel pressure guage now reads 15psi when turned on, even with pump off... (likely will be replaced with a mechanical under-hood guage)
Then it's off for mufflers and save some money for a hood and registration. Oh and I need to call Hagerty.
Odd thing happened. Tried firing it up, pumped gas just like last night. Sputter, sputter...WHOOOOOSH big 6 foot high fireball! That got me out of the car and shaking a bit. Looked everything over and things checked out ok. Gave the car a minute, tried again and it fired up the second I hit the key. Ran it up to 3,000-4,000rpm for about 20 seconds. Damn thing runs well! Let it idle before I shut it off and it was at 1,400rpm. Made sure to adjust the idle screw a bit before I went about the next task.
BTW, this was at 11pm and I shouted into the night, "Sorry! I'M ALL DONE FOR TONIGHT, GOING TO BED! WOOOOHOOOO!" Sure my neighbors enjoyed the open headers for 30 seconds. They will LOVE them on Sunday when I go up and down the block...
To do for street trials:
1. Install steering wheel (removed it due to poor horn wire install job by me and for access to under dash wiring)
2. Reinstall or secure speedo cable
3. Get car off jackstands
4. Clean out car of the tons of crap in, on and around it
5. Fire and idle for leak check, cooling system bleed/function test
6. Find out why electric fuel pressure guage now reads 15psi when turned on, even with pump off... (likely will be replaced with a mechanical under-hood guage)
Then it's off for mufflers and save some money for a hood and registration. Oh and I need to call Hagerty.
07-17-2011, 06:38 PM
#146
07-18-2011, 01:36 AM
#147
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yeah ! it lost a wheel/tire and took out the passenger fender on the way out 
stupid lugnuts !
the cool thing is that this thread is so full of pics and details , fixing the fender should be a breeze
stupid lugnuts !
the cool thing is that this thread is so full of pics and details , fixing the fender should be a breeze
07-19-2011, 12:35 AM
#148
Fixed the leak at the fuel pump, attached the speedo cable and routed it away from the headers (already previously melted by them), cleaned up some wiring in the engine bay and installed the steering wheel. Then I dropped it onto it's tires for the first time in almost 2 years! Looks so stange sitting so low in the garage now!
Cranked it and it fired easily. Settled into a very high idle. I pumped the brakes a few times and the pedle firmed up. Put it in reverse and let out the brake...barely moved, thanks 3,000 rpm stall converter! Goosed the gas and out into the driveway I went. No more pushing this thing around! Next door neighbor who I hadn't met before came to his door with his daughter to watch.
I jumped out and adjusted the carb, 15 inches of vaccuum at 850rpm idle. Checked for leaks, none could be found anywhere. No coolant, no oil, no fuel, no trans fluid, no power steering fluid (oh wait, no power steering!). That's a first for my car!
Now, on to the bad part. No coolant flow at all. I made sure to fill the block since the LSx design has the thermostat on the suction side. Temp went up to 220+ and no coolant flow at all! Shut it down and went inside to eat a grumpy meal (or a meal grumpily). Came back out and fired it up again, backed out of the driveway and went 50 yards to the end of the street, turned around and goosed the thorttle. Not enough to leave marks (ain't gonna happen in this neighborhood), but enough for my other neighbor to give me a thumbs up. He's working on a GTO, so I'm pretty sure it was a thumbs up....Oh, and the car hits hard when you tell it to.
My other neighbor heard the noise and came over to congratulate me. He help me machine the alternator adaptor earlier.
So, now I wait for a new thermostat to arrive and the fuel pressure guage to arrive as well...hope those are the only gremlins I run into.
Couple of pictures.
Video will be provided once I fix the cooling issue and my wife is actually home to supervise me...I mean use the camera while I drive. Once the car cools reliably...off to the muffler shop I go!
Cranked it and it fired easily. Settled into a very high idle. I pumped the brakes a few times and the pedle firmed up. Put it in reverse and let out the brake...barely moved, thanks 3,000 rpm stall converter! Goosed the gas and out into the driveway I went. No more pushing this thing around! Next door neighbor who I hadn't met before came to his door with his daughter to watch.
I jumped out and adjusted the carb, 15 inches of vaccuum at 850rpm idle. Checked for leaks, none could be found anywhere. No coolant, no oil, no fuel, no trans fluid, no power steering fluid (oh wait, no power steering!). That's a first for my car!
Now, on to the bad part. No coolant flow at all. I made sure to fill the block since the LSx design has the thermostat on the suction side. Temp went up to 220+ and no coolant flow at all! Shut it down and went inside to eat a grumpy meal (or a meal grumpily). Came back out and fired it up again, backed out of the driveway and went 50 yards to the end of the street, turned around and goosed the thorttle. Not enough to leave marks (ain't gonna happen in this neighborhood), but enough for my other neighbor to give me a thumbs up. He's working on a GTO, so I'm pretty sure it was a thumbs up....Oh, and the car hits hard when you tell it to.
My other neighbor heard the noise and came over to congratulate me. He help me machine the alternator adaptor earlier.
So, now I wait for a new thermostat to arrive and the fuel pressure guage to arrive as well...hope those are the only gremlins I run into.
Couple of pictures.
Video will be provided once I fix the cooling issue and my wife is actually home to supervise me...I mean use the camera while I drive. Once the car cools reliably...off to the muffler shop I go!
07-19-2011, 01:11 AM
#149
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great news!
man its got to feel great when you take it out for its first test drive and everything ( well mostly everything ) works!!
congratulations!
man its got to feel great when you take it out for its first test drive and everything ( well mostly everything ) works!!
congratulations!
07-21-2011, 10:57 PM
#150
New thermostat arrived in the mail today. Tested it and it passed with flying colors opening at an indicated 190ish degrees on the Taylor multiple meat thermometer. I was in such a rush, I forgot the camera and before you knew it, the old one was off and the new one was installed. Spilled barely a drop of coolant (ok...a lot of coolant) into a freshly cleaned bucket, was filtered and replaced. Yes, I admit to doing that, reusing coolant...brand new ran for 10 minutes coolant. Anyway, on to the fun!
I took the old one and wanted to verify it was indeed the cause to my troubles.
How to Cook a Thermostat
1. Place in pot of hot water, turn heating element to 11. (If yours only goes to 10, then just remark 10 to read 11...) Since this is a scientific test and accuracy is key, steal you wife's cooking thermometer, they are actually surprisingly accurate. Tape it, vise grip it or whatever to the pot. (keep a lookout for the wife...she might not like this activity)
2. Cook until an indicated 190-200 degrees depending on your thermostat's rating. Of course, some of you in those stupid hot states might have one that opens at 160...you can figure out when to stop cooking and check to see if it's done. I let mine go to 200 (197 is the rating on it) and removed to check. Yes, I know it looks much higher than 200...that's the angle of the picture, it was 200, trust me. Not that it would have mattered.
3. Check to see if it opened!
Ruh-roh.
4. Repeat if necessary. I let mine go until I saw movement in the element. 230-250ish degrees...not sure how accurate this thing is off the chart.
Finally.
The car went to from 190 to 240 degrees indicated very quickly before I shut down last weekend without any coolant flow. Now I know why.
On Sunday I should be able to install my mechanical fuel pressure gauge and set the correct fuel pressure. Then some more coolant to top things off and find out if the cooling system actually works now!
I took the old one and wanted to verify it was indeed the cause to my troubles.
How to Cook a Thermostat
1. Place in pot of hot water, turn heating element to 11. (If yours only goes to 10, then just remark 10 to read 11...) Since this is a scientific test and accuracy is key, steal you wife's cooking thermometer, they are actually surprisingly accurate. Tape it, vise grip it or whatever to the pot. (keep a lookout for the wife...she might not like this activity)
2. Cook until an indicated 190-200 degrees depending on your thermostat's rating. Of course, some of you in those stupid hot states might have one that opens at 160...you can figure out when to stop cooking and check to see if it's done. I let mine go to 200 (197 is the rating on it) and removed to check. Yes, I know it looks much higher than 200...that's the angle of the picture, it was 200, trust me. Not that it would have mattered.
3. Check to see if it opened!
Ruh-roh.
4. Repeat if necessary. I let mine go until I saw movement in the element. 230-250ish degrees...not sure how accurate this thing is off the chart.
Finally.
The car went to from 190 to 240 degrees indicated very quickly before I shut down last weekend without any coolant flow. Now I know why.
On Sunday I should be able to install my mechanical fuel pressure gauge and set the correct fuel pressure. Then some more coolant to top things off and find out if the cooling system actually works now!
07-25-2011, 02:15 AM
#152
No video yet since the videographer was away again today. Installed the mechanical fuel pressure gauge, set the PSI at 7lbs (or near there). Added another half gallon of coolant and fired it up. Backed it into the driveway as stuff was falling off the shelves in the garage...damn this thing is loud and thumps hard. Went up to 200...cooling hoses got warm finally. Temp dropped briefly. Good, coolant is circulating. Got up almost to 210 and the fan turned on. Dropped temp to about 200 again and fan turned off. It's all working perfectly. Idled for about 20 minutes without overheating. I think it's ready to be tagged and go for a drive to get mufflers.
Video WILL be coming, I promise.
Video WILL be coming, I promise.
08-01-2011, 10:53 PM
#153
Problem: My 2000 Camaro SS overheated this weekend and ate it's LS1. No oil pressure....
Solution: Make my 1970 Camaro my daily driver again until I can replace the 2000 Camaro's motor (LY6 maybe?)
Problem: My 1970 looks kind of like this:
There is no money for a new hood....
Solution: Best redneck repair I've ever done...I hope. Involves duct tape, epoxy, and rustolium. It should get me through the summer.
Also needed: Exhaust, registration and insurance. Will be taken care of Thursday. By Monday I should be taking it to work every day...
Solution: Make my 1970 Camaro my daily driver again until I can replace the 2000 Camaro's motor (LY6 maybe?)
Problem: My 1970 looks kind of like this:
There is no money for a new hood....
Solution: Best redneck repair I've ever done...I hope. Involves duct tape, epoxy, and rustolium. It should get me through the summer.
Also needed: Exhaust, registration and insurance. Will be taken care of Thursday. By Monday I should be taking it to work every day...
08-02-2011, 11:12 PM
#154
Changed the oil in the 2000...fired up....pressure was a bit wavy for a bit...then it was strong and normal. Slight....very...very slight ticking noise. I'll change the pump and stat and fix the overflow hose and see what happens. 1970 got it's steering wheel straightened, wires and terminals covered, and the redneck repair of the hood is drying and will be painted tomorrow. Have a line on another 2" cowl for next to nothing that I might grab.
08-04-2011, 10:06 PM
#155
This update contains 200% more video.
Got the Camaro off to the exhaust shop today. Made it 7 miles or so without any major issues. Only big squawk is a coolant leak from the heater hose at the waterpump. Went between 200 and 205 degrees most of the time. Almost got to 210 at one point. Not bad for an 80 degree day. Steering wheel still isn't very straight and is really loose on center. But I was expecting that from a used box. Going to have to get used to the manual steering, it's not too bad though. Like to try to make multiple lane changes when I only want one... Brakes are a bit soft, I will have to flush the lines and bleed them later. And find and fix the coolant leak. And I should have a replacement hood coming.
You have to love the backyard repair I did to the hood. Can't see it very well in the videos. Actually doesn't look half bad from far away. A little duct tape, some epoxy and the high temp rustolium.
Also, what do you do if your exhaust system you need to have modified won't fit in your car? Redneck it to the top of your car of course!
Videos as promised.
http://youtu.be/TcU2u8vhAsU
http://youtu.be/TRdqwI_wJhs
Oh, and this was WAY too fun for words! Drove it really gentle since this was the first time on a long distance drive...but I can tell it will move out when I'm ready to give it a go!
Got the Camaro off to the exhaust shop today. Made it 7 miles or so without any major issues. Only big squawk is a coolant leak from the heater hose at the waterpump. Went between 200 and 205 degrees most of the time. Almost got to 210 at one point. Not bad for an 80 degree day. Steering wheel still isn't very straight and is really loose on center. But I was expecting that from a used box. Going to have to get used to the manual steering, it's not too bad though. Like to try to make multiple lane changes when I only want one... Brakes are a bit soft, I will have to flush the lines and bleed them later. And find and fix the coolant leak. And I should have a replacement hood coming.
You have to love the backyard repair I did to the hood. Can't see it very well in the videos. Actually doesn't look half bad from far away. A little duct tape, some epoxy and the high temp rustolium.
Also, what do you do if your exhaust system you need to have modified won't fit in your car? Redneck it to the top of your car of course!
Videos as promised.
http://youtu.be/TcU2u8vhAsU
http://youtu.be/TRdqwI_wJhs
Oh, and this was WAY too fun for words! Drove it really gentle since this was the first time on a long distance drive...but I can tell it will move out when I'm ready to give it a go!
Last edited by 1970camaroRS; 08-04-2011 at 10:26 PM.
08-09-2011, 11:52 PM
#156
Made it home after one problem after another on the drive home. Car started missing and chugging while climbing a hill then died on the way down. Found zero fuel pressure when I pulled over. Wracked my brain to try and figure it out. Did my brand new pump take a dump on me?
Had my sister in law come pick me up and I grabbed my tools (should have had the damn things with me) and my 5 gallon fuel can. Figured I would be smart and try putting more fuel in before I went messing with anything else. Well, I'm absolutely shocked that with some actual fuel in the tank the fuel pressure came back...imagine that. Car fired and ran just fine. That's when the 2nd problem occurred.
Earlier, the vent petcock had come loose and allowed coolant to spew all over the place. I tightened it, checked the radiator level and figured I was good. Nope, thermostat opened and emptied the radiator into the block. Temp went above 210, I pulled over and shut down. Sis-in-law once again took me back to my house and I grabbed some more coolant and returned to the car. Filled it up, let in idle for a heat cycle and viola...car is fine.
So, now it is home in the garage and I'm a bit wary of it, but it sounds great, has more power than I was expecting and all the kinks should work themselves out over time.
Video
http://youtu.be/9qzpsv5MFgQ
Had my sister in law come pick me up and I grabbed my tools (should have had the damn things with me) and my 5 gallon fuel can. Figured I would be smart and try putting more fuel in before I went messing with anything else. Well, I'm absolutely shocked that with some actual fuel in the tank the fuel pressure came back...imagine that. Car fired and ran just fine. That's when the 2nd problem occurred.
Earlier, the vent petcock had come loose and allowed coolant to spew all over the place. I tightened it, checked the radiator level and figured I was good. Nope, thermostat opened and emptied the radiator into the block. Temp went above 210, I pulled over and shut down. Sis-in-law once again took me back to my house and I grabbed some more coolant and returned to the car. Filled it up, let in idle for a heat cycle and viola...car is fine.
So, now it is home in the garage and I'm a bit wary of it, but it sounds great, has more power than I was expecting and all the kinks should work themselves out over time.
Video
http://youtu.be/9qzpsv5MFgQ
Last edited by 1970camaroRS; 08-09-2011 at 11:59 PM.
08-10-2011, 01:00 AM
#158
I didn't realize there were rednecks in WA.
Had a similar experience thinking my fuel pump was going bad. Car was stuttering and the gauge was all over the place. Turns out cars need gas to run. Who'd of thought.
Looks cool. You should give it a 'nice' rattle can paint job. Two tone, stripes, all that. Maybe epoxy paint then clear it with more rattle can. Always wondered how it might turn out.
Had a similar experience thinking my fuel pump was going bad. Car was stuttering and the gauge was all over the place. Turns out cars need gas to run. Who'd of thought.
Looks cool. You should give it a 'nice' rattle can paint job. Two tone, stripes, all that. Maybe epoxy paint then clear it with more rattle can. Always wondered how it might turn out.
08-10-2011, 11:12 AM
#159
There are a ton of them...just not around my area. I get a lot of looks right now simply because everyone thinks I'm Joe Dirt.
I know! Running out of gas was the last thing on my mind.
I'm thinking flat black and everyone is yelling at me for thinking that. I'll get the grinder out, get all the old paint off, sand a few things down and added a few pounds of bondo....then I am thinking I might actually go with a two tone. Flat black on top and something that pops on the bottom. All rattle can, mind you.
Had a similar experience thinking my fuel pump was going bad. Car was stuttering and the gauge was all over the place. Turns out cars need gas to run. Who'd of thought.
Looks cool. You should give it a 'nice' rattle can paint job. Two tone, stripes, all that. Maybe epoxy paint then clear it with more rattle can. Always wondered how it might turn out.
08-10-2011, 11:24 AM
#160
There are a ton of (rednecks in WA)...just not around my area. I get a lot of looks right now simply because everyone thinks I'm Joe Dirt.
Oh and I need to call Hagerty
) friend. I pay less for my Nova and GTO through Chubb than what I paid for Hags for the Nova alone. Not to mention they didn't hassle me like Hags did. Plus the name makes me giggle, which is good for something.