Engine angle Pinion angle????????
Thread Starter
Teching In
Joined: Nov 2008
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Engine angle Pinion angle???????? Could somebody give me a hand with engine angle and pinion angle? Its a drag car that will see some street use it has a four link so I can adjust it and it is a big tire car hope to have 425 to 500 rwhp. The motor is sitting at 4 degrees down the drive shaft is 0 and the pinion is 4 degrees up. I see people on here talking about -2 on the pinion. It might not be pinion angle I'm looking for might just be the engine angle I need for now. Just trying to get the engine at the right angle. Ok, I don't know how so I would like to hear your thoughts. I'm using a motor plate and midplate and having to fab cross member so I would like to do it right the first time for a change. Is there anything else you need to know. Thanks 
Launching!
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 274
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From: Croydon, PA
from what I understand, you measure these where the drive shaft goes. the engine angle was important in the old days for oil flow.
I also understand you do want an angle, just not one too big. I was told the engine is 2 degrees down and pinion is 2 degrees up. sure there are other opinions out there.
I also understand you do want an angle, just not one too big. I was told the engine is 2 degrees down and pinion is 2 degrees up. sure there are other opinions out there.
I'm going to be working on this in the near future, and found these two sites helpful:
(I know it's a 4x4 site, but it applies)
http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/CheapTri...line-101.shtml
http://www.hotrodlane.cc/trannys/driveshaftangles.jpg
Hope that helps some. I've read up a little, and it's still not completely clear.
(I know it's a 4x4 site, but it applies)
http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/CheapTri...line-101.shtml
http://www.hotrodlane.cc/trannys/driveshaftangles.jpg
Hope that helps some. I've read up a little, and it's still not completely clear.
If you want it done right, get your info from the experts in that area, Inland Empire Driveline Service. Lots of great info there.
Mike
Mike
If you google "Pinon angle setting".. you will find many good write up on setting the engine/trans, pinon and driveshaft angle. But if you got -4 on the trans and +4 on the rear end pinon, yeah. you got some read and work to do.
As the rear end gets power and start to rotate up. that +4 is going to get worse.
Good Luck.
As the rear end gets power and start to rotate up. that +4 is going to get worse.
Good Luck.
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 3,148
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From: Downers Grove, IL
Depends what exactly you are looking for. 0 on the u joints transmits the power most efficiently but you will wear out u joints fast. The u-joints need to be slightly out of perfect to rotate so that they wear evenly. For even wear and to be free of vibration you need the angles to be equal but opposite (IE: -2 at the trans and +2 at the pinion). The thing with drag racing is that the pinion rotates up and with the flex in the control arms, bushings, etc that +2 becomes +4? or more on launch which increases friction and eats power......which lead some racers to set the pinion angle negative so it zero`s out under WOT and takes less power to turn the driveshaft. Of course that can lead to vibration.....so basically it becomes where do you want to set the compromise. From what I have read the ideal is 1-3 degrees off perfect, so most people seem to shoot for 2 degrees.
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Everyone has their opinions but for drag....here is what works. You want the u-joints at equal but opposite angles while under power. check out baselinesuspensions.com for more info BUT here is the best way to set you car up. FORGET your driveshaft's angle all together. Its the relationship between the pinion centerline (back to front) and the crank centerline that counts. SO measure your balancer's angle with the engine in and weight on the chassis.....etc. Let just say its sitting at zero degrees...I say zero b/c the term level has nothing to do with setting this. NOW, you check the face of the pinion flange....say you measure 2 degrees towards the sky. for a total difference of....2 degrees positive.
NOW, when you smash the skinny pedal that rear pinion tries to walk up the pinion causing the front of the axle to point skyward. As previously stated, under load or throttle, we want the u-joint angles to be the same roughly. SO in order to achieve this, we set the angle of the pinion down when compared to the crank so that, in theory, the flex in the rear suspension makes the angles the same.
Finally, depending on what type of suspension you run depends on your angle you should set it at. Depending on bushings etc. For all intense and purposes, 3 degrees less that the crank is a pretty good start point. Pinion angle affects also how much squat your car has off the line. I run my mustang this way and its work flawlessly. Check baselinesuspensions b/c literally what I just wrote was cliffnotes
NOW, when you smash the skinny pedal that rear pinion tries to walk up the pinion causing the front of the axle to point skyward. As previously stated, under load or throttle, we want the u-joint angles to be the same roughly. SO in order to achieve this, we set the angle of the pinion down when compared to the crank so that, in theory, the flex in the rear suspension makes the angles the same.
Finally, depending on what type of suspension you run depends on your angle you should set it at. Depending on bushings etc. For all intense and purposes, 3 degrees less that the crank is a pretty good start point. Pinion angle affects also how much squat your car has off the line. I run my mustang this way and its work flawlessly. Check baselinesuspensions b/c literally what I just wrote was cliffnotes
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Teching In
Joined: Nov 2008
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Thanks for the great info guys. I know the rear is set high it came to me as a roller and that was how it was set. Its the trans that is going to give me trouble. Just not much room for headers and every little bit hurts but first things first. It looks like I have some read ahead of me. Thanks Again All
Teching In
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 10
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From: Wilmington, NC
pinion mock up Back from the dead....... but
I now have a chassis on jack stands for my chevelle. The chassis is dead level with the floor. LS2 and T56 sitting at 2deg down.
All the brackets have been cut off of the 12 bolt rear end and i'm starting from scratch with new weld on brackets that came with my coilover kit. So, being that the engine will be really close to 500 RWHP i'm concerned with pinion wrapping up. Im not really, sure how much the pinion will pitch up when i stab the throttle, so i was thinking about instead of setting the pinion at 2 deg up to match the motor, i would set it at 1 deg up so the angle wont be too far off when i nail it.
Am i looking at this right?
I now have a chassis on jack stands for my chevelle. The chassis is dead level with the floor. LS2 and T56 sitting at 2deg down.
All the brackets have been cut off of the 12 bolt rear end and i'm starting from scratch with new weld on brackets that came with my coilover kit. So, being that the engine will be really close to 500 RWHP i'm concerned with pinion wrapping up. Im not really, sure how much the pinion will pitch up when i stab the throttle, so i was thinking about instead of setting the pinion at 2 deg up to match the motor, i would set it at 1 deg up so the angle wont be too far off when i nail it.
Am i looking at this right?
Last edited by 71driver; Mar 22, 2011 at 11:33 PM.
Like mentioned above, a good starting point would be -1 to -3 degrees. You get that by simply adding your motor and pinion angles together. So, if your motor angle is -2 degrees try to set your pinion angle to zero. I've done this many times with zero complications.
Launching!
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 213
Likes: 2
i think alot of these posts are on the right track, but not being described correctly. you cannot just mount the engine at "2 degrees down from level" and mount the pinion "2 degress up from level" and stab the driveshaft in and drive. you would think that gives you your 4 degress total. but it really doesnt. imagine your engines crank centerline sitting at a height of 18" from ground. then place your rear's pinion centerline at 18" from ground. (both at perfect horizontal 0 degrees) the shaft would perfectly horizontal and you would have 0 degree driveline angle. lets now imagine your engine was actually sitting at a higher height of 22". the rear remains the same at 18" height.(both still at perfect horizontal 0 degrees). you now probably have 2 degrees at the pinion without even changing any angles, just changing relative heights of the two joints. My point is, you have to work with a combination of engine and tranny height, as well as engine/tranny angle. as well as rearend angle to get both joints at good angles at rest. if you are just worrying about pinion/shaft angle, there is more to it than that. the link above for INLAND DRIVELINE discusses this in depth
Staging Lane
Joined: Apr 2007
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