legal engine swaps
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Joined: Feb 2012
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From: Mount Union PA
legal engine swaps I was just talking to my classmates about engine swaps and such(The normal since Im in an automotive school). I brought up about putting my 4.8 in my fox or my c10. One kid speaks up and said well your stuck with the c10 arent you as it is a truck and its a truck motor. He goes on to describe the rules where he is from(California). So this makes me wonder about the laws from home(Pennsylvania) and other states. Now PA I know isnt as strict as Cali as we can at least but a 1994 s10 motor in a 1995. From what I read all motor swaps with older motor(efi to carb or obd2 to obd1) and motors they didnt offer(v8 in s10) arent legal yet my roommate from PA is doing a 350 in his s10. s10 sure didn't come with a v8 and he is using a 77 vette block. I see swaps like this all the time tho 350 s10, small block imports, and even Titan motor in corolla. To me bigger or better engine swaps are coolest thing since sliced bread but doesnt seem legal from my recent information. Can someone tell me what is really legal with swaps or does it just fall under what they dont know wont hurt them? Now i plan to atleast swap my c10 as im not wasting my money but it just feels sketchy now. This has me wanting to put every little thing i have as i have the whole silverado into the c10 now incase any stupid Cali rule migrate to PA.
Yah, Califuck'nfornia can be considered a separate Country as far as I'm concerned. Smog trapped against the San Bernadino mountains is what initially caused them to create strict emmissions laws. Only way that LA residents can attempt to breath.
Anyway, we cannot tell you what's legal in your State/County. You can go to the County web site to find info regarding modifications. Often times, the car can be re-registered as a "Collector Car," & is legal based on a certain $ figure spent on mods. May also have to be inpected. Again, this info will be available on a State/County DMV web site or by contacting them in some way. Good-luck.
Anyway, we cannot tell you what's legal in your State/County. You can go to the County web site to find info regarding modifications. Often times, the car can be re-registered as a "Collector Car," & is legal based on a certain $ figure spent on mods. May also have to be inpected. Again, this info will be available on a State/County DMV web site or by contacting them in some way. Good-luck.
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Joined: Feb 2012
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From: Mount Union PA
Thanks for the info. I was just seeing mainly what people did to make their stuff legal. I know in Michigan ya can pretty much do as ya please as my roommate chevelle has carbs out the hood and no mufflers(Wish that was ok in PA).
TECH Fanatic
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,356
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From: Felton Pa
I live in York Co, PA and my Chevelle has antique tags I got with the BBC. Just put in the LS and drove it but it was already tagged. Antique tags require the car be vitually stock and pics must be sent in, but after you get your tags you never have to do anything again except keep insurance on the car. The registration never expires and there are no fees every year and inspection. My friend has a wild GTO and he sent in pics of another GTO that was stock to get his tags. Once the car is registered you can pretty much do as you please.
This subject has many threads and posts. If you research you will find many of them. And many arguments and opinions on it, depending on understanding of the laws. Even the Smog tech will have different understanding and opinions on the same sections of the laws.
Most states, if not all, have adopted California SMOG and Conversion laws (C.A.R.B.) or parts of it.
http://www.bar.ca.gov/80_BARResource...uidelines.html
First of all, even if your state or area doesn't check or test for SMOG equipment and sniffers test. It is still illegal to remove or modify it unless it has a approved C.A.R.B approved sticker. Also, Fed law will proceed any Local and State Laws.
Even if you have some exempt status (collector, 30 year law, Historical, etc) that still doesn't exempt you from removing and having the OEM original equipement. If the wanted to, they can still issue you a ticket.
As listed in California. You can swap a newer engine in but not a older engine in than the Car/Truck year. But you will have to get it re-certified. That means basically if you use an engine out of a (i.e.) 02 Camaro, you will need all of the smog parts and equipment, it will basically have to be passed as a 02 Camaro standard and equipement (cats, evap, air pump, etc).
It is said that cars and light duty truck engine are the same standard and considered ok for swapping in to a Car (but many have different opinions.)
good luck with you conversion. hope this helps, but might not be what you wanted to hear. The Law is the Law.. can't help that..!
BC
Most states, if not all, have adopted California SMOG and Conversion laws (C.A.R.B.) or parts of it.
http://www.bar.ca.gov/80_BARResource...uidelines.html
First of all, even if your state or area doesn't check or test for SMOG equipment and sniffers test. It is still illegal to remove or modify it unless it has a approved C.A.R.B approved sticker. Also, Fed law will proceed any Local and State Laws.
Even if you have some exempt status (collector, 30 year law, Historical, etc) that still doesn't exempt you from removing and having the OEM original equipement. If the wanted to, they can still issue you a ticket.
As listed in California. You can swap a newer engine in but not a older engine in than the Car/Truck year. But you will have to get it re-certified. That means basically if you use an engine out of a (i.e.) 02 Camaro, you will need all of the smog parts and equipment, it will basically have to be passed as a 02 Camaro standard and equipement (cats, evap, air pump, etc).
It is said that cars and light duty truck engine are the same standard and considered ok for swapping in to a Car (but many have different opinions.)
good luck with you conversion. hope this helps, but might not be what you wanted to hear. The Law is the Law.. can't help that..!
BC
Staging Lane
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 72
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From: Tennessee
Thank god i live in Tennessee. As long as it has lights and turn signals your good down here. i remember running open headers around town in my old ford and no one really cares, and swaped s10's/ blazers are everywhere here.
I guess the real question is who honestly gives a ****? If you don't have to deal with California **** car inspections why care? **** them, what cop will ever tell you to open your hood? In Mn we do what we want with our cars even if is means a slap on the wrist later.
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Staging Lane
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 72
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From: Tennessee
I guess the real question is who honestly gives a ****? If you don't have to deal with California **** car inspections why care? **** them, what cop will ever tell you to open your hood? In Mn we do what we want with our cars even if is means a slap on the wrist later.
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Verdad Gallardo Thread Starter
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Joined: Feb 2012
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From: Mount Union PA
link doesnt work... this helps I am thinking more of the c10 and just do everything from engine to gas tank. Just because its going to be more of a daily/ work truck so better odds of crashing, getting into a wreck and pulled over by ******* cop who was bullied his high school life.
I have been rolling around in my LS 240sx, and haven't had any issues, and I have true dual 3 inch exhaust no cats, I take inspection stickers off my daily driver 240sx and put it on the LS 240. been pulled over a couple of times mainly for exhaut too loud, and I pretty much get the same question what's under the hood, I'm not an ***, police doesn't become an *** and I get a warning or a illegal light eqiptment ticket, as apparantly in Louisiana loud exhaust is considered disturbing the peace which is a minor felony, surprised me when I went to go pay that ticket, had to take a class to get it off my record. Basically If you don't live in cali, dont drive like an *** and don't wake up the neighborhood and you'll just get pulled over to find out whats in the car.
Staging Lane
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 74
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From: Mississippi
A loudness penalty would be the only thing to face here in MS. I could go the full hot rod treatment on a 1974 'Vette and still get it an Antique tag. Even Kit Cars are easy to get registered, albeit with the expected extra hoop or three. Most cops here won't hassle you unless you're being a doofus, either.
SEMA list the smog testing requirements for each state
http://www.semasan.com/page.asp?cont...sions&g=semaga
http://www.semasan.com/page.asp?cont...sions&g=semaga
Just remember, Even if the State doesn't have a requirement to check for the OEM equipement, sniffer, CARB Approved replacement equipement, etc. That doesn't mean it is legal to remove or modify without the CARB approved certification by the manufactor. Again Federal law preceeds anything not covered local or state law and policy. (I am just saying).
But yes, it does make it easy to know what you can get away with. (yes.. I am not completely legal on my smog required DD's either). But I know what I can get away with if needed. I also know what I can get tagged for if they wanted to throw the book at me LOL
You know what the judge will say "Ignorance is no excuse for breaking the law.." hmm where have I heard that before ??
BC
But yes, it does make it easy to know what you can get away with. (yes.. I am not completely legal on my smog required DD's either). But I know what I can get away with if needed. I also know what I can get tagged for if they wanted to throw the book at me LOL
You know what the judge will say "Ignorance is no excuse for breaking the law.." hmm where have I heard that before ??
BC
I hear you but try finding out what the swap laws ARE in a state with no active testing program. Everybody I talked to in the state of Maryland said something different. It was the state cops that told me to just get historic plates because they never get inspected.
Thread Starter
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Joined: Feb 2012
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From: Mount Union PA
PENNSYLVANIA
Pennsylvania requires emissions inspections annually the counties of Allegheny, Beaver, Berks, Blair, Bucks, Cambria, Centre, Chester, Cumberland, Dauphin, Delaware, Erie, Lackawanna, Lancaster, Lebanon, Lehigh, Luzerne, Lycoming, Mercer, Montgomery, Northampton, Philadelphia, Washington, Westmoreland and York. The emissions inspection is to be completed before or with the annual safety inspection.
Diesel Vehicles:
Diesel vehicles are not tested for emissions.
Exemptions:
1. New vehicles titled and registered for the first time and driven fewer than 5,000 miles
2. Pre-1975 MY vehicles
3. Vehicles with a GVWR of more than 9,000 lbs
4. A vehicle driven fewer than 5,000 miles during the 12-month period immediately preceding the inspection if the vehicle has been owned by the one owner for one year or more
Since my c10 is a 72 I feel like I dont have to worry about emissions correct? so I wouldnt have to put cats or anything on it really just motor swap? if i put it in my 87 mustang for instance just dont act like I just got my license and tell them its a 5.0 with a LS top end
Pennsylvania requires emissions inspections annually the counties of Allegheny, Beaver, Berks, Blair, Bucks, Cambria, Centre, Chester, Cumberland, Dauphin, Delaware, Erie, Lackawanna, Lancaster, Lebanon, Lehigh, Luzerne, Lycoming, Mercer, Montgomery, Northampton, Philadelphia, Washington, Westmoreland and York. The emissions inspection is to be completed before or with the annual safety inspection.
Diesel Vehicles:
Diesel vehicles are not tested for emissions.
Exemptions:
1. New vehicles titled and registered for the first time and driven fewer than 5,000 miles
2. Pre-1975 MY vehicles
3. Vehicles with a GVWR of more than 9,000 lbs
4. A vehicle driven fewer than 5,000 miles during the 12-month period immediately preceding the inspection if the vehicle has been owned by the one owner for one year or more
Since my c10 is a 72 I feel like I dont have to worry about emissions correct? so I wouldnt have to put cats or anything on it really just motor swap? if i put it in my 87 mustang for instance just dont act like I just got my license and tell them its a 5.0 with a LS top end
