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Today I'm playing with an E67 and T87A on the bench. But right beside it, I have the 2015 T87 Allison version I've been testing against the LBZ-LML ECU's. I've tested the T87 gasser OS quite a bit also. While all the T87/A TCM OS are fairly close on CANbus messages, that early one comes in an 6-8spd versions, and seems a little more backwards compatible to pre-2014 data sets. So have been testing some hacks in the T87A that lets ya roll the CANbus back to those T87 years, but with the 10spd OS.
My eyes are on you. I have an E67 for a 2009 TBSS application due to its ability to send a VSS/ABS signal and run analog cruise control inputs and new GM Express van E78 harness to modify to run the 383 SBC in my 97 Express van with a 58X setup. I was looking to use a T42 4L80E initially with plans for a 6L90E after I got it up and running. If a 10spd became a reality I would much rather use it since I do a fair bit of heavy towing. I will probably run the E67 without a cam signal unless I fabricate a 4x trigger to drop in place of the 1x on the vortec distributor. I am not spending what EFI connection wants for their 58X cam solution they now sell vs the modified L31 distributer they once sold inexpensively to do the same thing.
My eyes are on you. I have an E67 for a 2009 TBSS application due to its ability to send a VSS/ABS signal and run analog cruise control inputs and new GM Express van E78 harness to modify to run the 383 SBC in my 97 Express van with a 58X setup. I was looking to use a T42 4L80E initially with plans for a 6L90E after I got it up and running. If a 10spd became a reality I would much rather use it since I do a fair bit of heavy towing. I will probably run the E67 without a cam signal unless I fabricate a 4x trigger to drop in place of the 1x on the vortec distributor. I am not spending what EFI connection wants for their 58X cam solution they now sell vs the modified L31 distributer they once sold inexpensively to do the same thing.
The E67 with T87 or T87A in a stand alone config is possible with just a slightly modified TCM OS. Actually what I've been building on the bench, a version that will at least move ya down the road in a limp mode without any extra hardware or external inputs. Then to make it shift Happily, ya just need to talk nice to it on the CANbus.
However what you bring up about ABS and VSS is the stickler, especially when going back past about 2010. The TCM "would like to see" 4 wheel speed sensors from the EBCM, and some BCM stuff like brake pedal position. Since now all only via CANbus, we can either fake the required data, or write out the need for it in the TCM. As it's really doesn't Need To Know if you have a 3 wheel ABS sensors or 4 wheel. Nor if the brake is 10% or 80% depressed. Only that you're riding that brake pedal, and adjust power accordingly.
To your other part, regarding VSS, is where that year break come in again. This same TCM will run any Allison transmission. And when GM switched to it in 2014, they changed all speeds sensors from the old analog VR style used for decades, to a new inductive style square wave pattern. They also dropped the TOS/VSS signal sent from all previous TCM's to the other nodes such as the ECM, BCM, and EBCM. Everything including the P/N Safety and Reverse gear position signal is now only a CANbus message. This has VSS Input Option has been addressed for several E38 OS by EFIlive some years past. But unless the ECM will reproduce that VSS pulse from CANbus data and pass it to other nodes, there's gonna be some pissy node when that VSS doesn't match up to what the EBCM is squawking. We experienced this in a 2006 LBZ truck with a T87 swap. No TOS line equals a Christmas tree dash...
Because no New Style off the shelf speed sensors are available to fit the pre 2014 Allison cases, others have made sensor or socket adapters to fit. But the T87 doesn't provide any TOS/VSS pulse, only CANbus values. To resolve both issues for the Allison, I designed a little board similar to the VR conditioner use by Speeduino and others to run an old style analog crank pickup, on a 5v digital square wave input. Except for the 9V lines these new TCM's operate at. While at it, I replicated that 5v TOS/VSS line, and so far so good in the 06 truck. But since the 10L only has internal speed sensors, this same approach won't work. That VSS line will need to be replicated by same device that does the P/N/R output conversions from CANbus data.
You've sparked my interest on the 24/58 conversion. Spent the last year mastering the reading of 60-2/3 wheels patterns for another MPU driving project. This speed sensor converter prototype shares the same chip used to create/modify crank/cam signals for most of those the converters...
The E67 with T87 or T87A in a stand alone config is possible with just a slightly modified TCM OS. Actually what I've been building on the bench, a version that will at least move ya down the road in a limp mode without any extra hardware or external inputs. Then to make it shift Happily, ya just need to talk nice to it on the CANbus.
However what you bring up about ABS and VSS is the stickler, especially when going back past about 2010. The TCM "would like to see" 4 wheel speed sensors from the EBCM, and some BCM stuff like brake pedal position. Since now all only via CANbus, we can either fake the required data, or write out the need for it in the TCM. As it's really doesn't Need To Know if you have a 3 wheel ABS sensors or 4 wheel. Nor if the brake is 10% or 80% depressed. Only that you're riding that brake pedal, and adjust power accordingly.
To your other part, regarding VSS, is where that year break come in again. This same TCM will run any Allison transmission. And when GM switched to it in 2014, they changed all speeds sensors from the old analog VR style used for decades, to a new inductive style square wave pattern. They also dropped the TOS/VSS signal sent from all previous TCM's to the other nodes such as the ECM, BCM, and EBCM. Everything including the P/N Safety and Reverse gear position signal is now only a CANbus message. This has VSS Input Option has been addressed for several E38 OS by EFIlive some years past. But unless the ECM will reproduce that VSS pulse from CANbus data and pass it to other nodes, there's gonna be some pissy node when that VSS doesn't match up to what the EBCM is squawking. We experienced this in a 2006 LBZ truck with a T87 swap. No TOS line equals a Christmas tree dash...
Because no New Style off the shelf speed sensors are available to fit the pre 2014 Allison cases, others have made sensor or socket adapters to fit. But the T87 doesn't provide any TOS/VSS pulse, only CANbus values. To resolve both issues for the Allison, I designed a little board similar to the VR conditioner use by Speeduino and others to run an old style analog crank pickup, on a 5v digital square wave input. Except for the 9V lines these new TCM's operate at. While at it, I replicated that 5v TOS/VSS line, and so far so good in the 06 truck. But since the 10L only has internal speed sensors, this same approach won't work. That VSS line will need to be replicated by same device that does the P/N/R output conversions from CANbus data.
You've sparked my interest on the 24/58 conversion. Spent the last year mastering the reading of 60-2/3 wheels patterns for another MPU driving project. This speed sensor converter prototype shares the same chip used to create/modify crank/cam signals for most of those the converters...
If you get to the point of needing a 24x to 58x live running tester I would definitely be up for it.
I came to ask to buy a few hand fulls, Sucks that it was a bust.
I have been working on the same and resorted to a 3d printed header. instead.
I did something similar for a 2007 NNBS truck and T93 But some people shouldn't be able to mess with wiring so chopping the connector off is a hard one for newbies.
I came to ask to buy a few hand fulls, Sucks that it was a bust.
I have been working on the same and resorted to a 3d printed header. instead.
I did something similar for a 2007 NNBS truck and T93 But some people shouldn't be able to mess with wiring so chopping the connector off is a hard one for newbies.
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Little harness re-work does not scare me, lol. The P59 harness I reconcstructed to run run a L31 350 in a G20 van with a port fuel injected 4150 style intake manifold.
I currently have a code free working version in an 08 WT truck with originally a 4 speed. E38/T87a runs/drives with tq management. I'm lacking a few extra things and then I'm going to attempt a newer e38. But from what I've checked on another truck 10-13 e38 the CAN seems to look for the same things. So I'm optimistic.
Tapshift as well as tow haul are also working finally and no more late random shifting it follows the CAL now.
Unfortunately, since I was unable to get anyone to give me the time of day to help me with an A2L, I just made a gateway that controls the coms between both units.
the T87A things it's talking to a DI engine and the E38 thinks its talking to a transmission from its own time.
This method works without changing a single thing in the bin files as well as no codes to delete.
Last edited by Piston_Killa; Oct 28, 2024 at 04:51 PM.
Not exactly, I used parts and pieced a micro controller together. with CAN modules then coded in .C
I wish I knew what @kidturbo knows about the internals of the TCM stuff. I don't know anything about breaking down a module like that.
But I'm sure it would answer a TON of questions I have about what's going on module to module I have been seeing
It's pretty awesome to see others accomplishing what we once thought was impossible.
Our device, Multi_Gate, wasn't originally created for the same purpose, but I was asked if we could make it happen. After countless hours, a ton of R&D, and a fair share of sanity (and money) spent, here we are—it works!
Check out the link—no WOT due to rain, but it gets the job done.
Would any of this be applicable, or helpful if I wanted to use a Holley Max to control an LS3 and 6L80E that I swapped into a 2007 TBSS with an E67 PCM?
Having trouble because wasn't enough resolution to scale injectors properly, which means everything was fudged to get it to work.
I would just like all the gauges in the dash to work, and preferably cruise control/traction control, abs, etc.
I spoke with Kid Turbo and he informed me that he worked with Speartech on there 10L project and that he did the coding. Speartech has some test vehicles running around right now with them for beta testing. I am not sure if they are going to offer kits or what in the near future.
Kid Turbo tells me has also done 3 holley dominators with a 10L and they are also up and running around.
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