Hybrids and the 1/4 mile
Hybrids and the 1/4 mile For the most part, it's been the waiting game on my '87 Fiero GT/LS1 project. Hopefully my short block from TSP will be here in a week 
The car is gonna be a weekend car with trips to the 1/4 mile once a month or so. I'm trying to get an idea of where I'll be in the quarter to see if I should just get a bar or a cage. Here's the setup: Running a TSP 347 aluminum block, LPE CNC 853 heads w/ 2.02/1.57 valves, TSP MS3 cam on a 112 LSA. All this is going through a '93 Cavalier Muncie 282 tranny (It'll hold together...really...maybe)
The car started out at 2700 lbs with a iron engine, A/C, sunroof, etc, with removal of those items, I hope to be under 2400 lbs. My goal at the beginning was mid 11s with just a cam on a 6.0L, but the 347 and LPE heads worked their way into the picture. So here's my question: anyone running similar power and weight and what times are you running? Guesses are appreciated as well. I have absolutely no clue how this car is going to launch, if the trans internals remain internal.
The car is gonna be a weekend car with trips to the 1/4 mile once a month or so. I'm trying to get an idea of where I'll be in the quarter to see if I should just get a bar or a cage. Here's the setup: Running a TSP 347 aluminum block, LPE CNC 853 heads w/ 2.02/1.57 valves, TSP MS3 cam on a 112 LSA. All this is going through a '93 Cavalier Muncie 282 tranny (It'll hold together...really...maybe)The car started out at 2700 lbs with a iron engine, A/C, sunroof, etc, with removal of those items, I hope to be under 2400 lbs. My goal at the beginning was mid 11s with just a cam on a 6.0L, but the 347 and LPE heads worked their way into the picture. So here's my question: anyone running similar power and weight and what times are you running? Guesses are appreciated as well. I have absolutely no clue how this car is going to launch, if the trans internals remain internal.
Wow, thats gotta be fast..I had a little fiero back in the day and that little go cart could move ! 
That tranny is toast though when you hook! Watched someone blow the tranny out of a cavalier with the stock engine. Was doing burnouts in a puddle and as soon as he hit dry pavement and grabbed it blew his gears all over the parking lot.
That tranny is toast though when you hook! Watched someone blow the tranny out of a cavalier with the stock engine. Was doing burnouts in a puddle and as soon as he hit dry pavement and grabbed it blew his gears all over the parking lot.
I think it will be faster than mid 11s. My cam only heavy *** convertible camaro has been 11.9s ... but that is with an auto and big stall. My car probably weights atleast a 1000 pounds more. That motor in a car as light as yours with the right tranny/gear/tire combo should be FAST.
well a stock ls1 in a stock camaro runs a 13.1-.2 so taking something 1000 lbs lighter, sticking to the 100lbs=.1 that means u should run a 12.1 or so plus with your cam and heads i think you are very capable of low 11s.
I'm sending the tranny internals to be cryo treated and possibly shot-peened. Might buy me some time on it. I already have a spare tranny though, just in case. So what is the rules for running in the 11s? Hoop or cage?
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It all depends on the tires. What is the maximum diameter that will fit into a Fiero wheel well? If it's 25" or less, you can forget 11's as you'll never get enough side wall /width needed for a successful launch. That tranny is toast; don't even waist your time with it.
Originally Posted by LS1-450
It all depends on the tires. What is the maximum diameter that will fit into a Fiero wheel well? If it's 25" or less, you can forget 11's as you'll never get enough side wall /width needed for a successful launch. That tranny is toast; don't even waist your time with it.
Originally Posted by Bimmer Tech
I'll be using the stock 15" rims to mount some track tires. Dunno what size yet. As for the tranny, there aren't many options out there when it comes to transverse mounting a LS1. It should last at least through the clutch break in period
On the track, your tires will spin & 12's will be very difficult. Doesn't matter if the rims are 15, 16, 17. There is not a tire wide enough that equals an outside diameter of 25" or less that will handle the launch. My guestimate is that 25" is about the limit for that wheel well. You'll end up with a 225/50/15 drag radial or slick & it's not enough. I have to feather my supercharged car with these tires mounted which has half the HP & 1/3 of the torque of the LS1 Miata.
Am not judging, as the hammer you posted suggests, just responding to the quest for 11's & the safety of the build. Good-luck.
Nah, the hammer was for the transmission breaking. I value the opinions given here. The best thing about mid engine cars is that they don't rely on the chassis to put the power to the ground. With the engine siterally sitting on the drive wheels, the power doesn't have to be tranmitted through the body to get to the ground. I really don't need to modify the frame at all to handle this power. But yes, you are right. 25" tires is proably the limit, but I think 245s or 255 will fit with a coilover conversion on the back. Thanks again for the inputs!
There is an '87 Fiero GT with LS1 and a 150 Nitrous shot in the new Hot Rod mag. It is in the Dare to be Different section. Dyno'd 508/542 at the rear wheels. He is running a Getrag 5 speed. Does not appear to have any sort of cage. He only managed an 8.20 in the eighth on the motor, but could not hook up. The article says the car weights 2920. They speculate with slicks and and the bottle it should run a high 10. For what it's worth. It is a slick looking ride.
Pat
Pat
Originally Posted by Bimmer Tech
25" tires is proably the limit, but I think 245s or 255 will fit with a coilover conversion on the back. Thanks again for the inputs!
In regards to the transmission, have you looked into Porche or Ford mid/rear engine type transmissions? There must be an available high power capable mid/rear engine type transmission other than the Cavalier/Muncie.
Originally Posted by Bimmer Tech
The best thing about mid engine cars is that they don't rely on the chassis to put the power to the ground. With the engine siterally sitting on the drive wheels, the power doesn't have to be tranmitted through the body to get to the ground.
Teching In
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
From: Columbia, MO
You should be alright without a cage. You will most likely blow the trans before you break 11.50 more then once. I hear people talk about the trans case flexing and breaking which causes the trans failure. You may want to consider adding some additional bracing to the case itself and see if this helps with trans life.
You can fit a 255 or 265 on the back of a Fiero pretty easily.
Are you planning on taking your car to Bradenton when it is complete? If so let me know. It would be fun to run against another Fiero.
You can fit a 255 or 265 on the back of a Fiero pretty easily.
Are you planning on taking your car to Bradenton when it is complete? If so let me know. It would be fun to run against another Fiero.
Originally Posted by Lincoln
You should be alright without a cage. You will most likely blow the trans before you break 11.50 more then once. I hear people talk about the trans case flexing and breaking which causes the trans failure. You may want to consider adding some additional bracing to the case itself and see if this helps with trans life.
You can fit a 255 or 265 on the back of a Fiero pretty easily.
Are you planning on taking your car to Bradenton when it is complete? If so let me know. It would be fun to run against another Fiero.
You can fit a 255 or 265 on the back of a Fiero pretty easily.
Are you planning on taking your car to Bradenton when it is complete? If so let me know. It would be fun to run against another Fiero.
Originally Posted by LS1-450
I also run 245's on the street (actually Bridgestone Pole position S03's are 245's that equal a 255 width). You're car can be an awesome street rod; there's no doubt about that. The people that I know of whom are running lightweight short wheel base cars in the 10's are doing so with modified wheel wells to allow tall wide slicks & drag specific suspensions; "dune buggy" style. It's really too much of a sacrifice. A street/long track set-up is more appealing to me.
In regards to the transmission, have you looked into Porche or Ford mid/rear engine type transmissions? There must be an available high power capable mid/rear engine type transmission other than the Cavalier/Muncie.
In regards to the transmission, have you looked into Porche or Ford mid/rear engine type transmissions? There must be an available high power capable mid/rear engine type transmission other than the Cavalier/Muncie.
It'll probably be too much power for autocross, but with some suspension tuning, it might be right for Sebring or Homestead.
As for transmissions, without going to a longitudinal setup, the NSX tranny has shown alot of potential, but at $5-7k, it isn't worth it. The new G6 6-speed is nice, but the load rating is less than the Muncie. We'll try the Muncie first, see how it takes the power.
Teching In
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
From: Columbia, MO
You may want to check this out.
http://www.tamparacing.com/forums/tampa-racing-events/
They set up track events at Bradenton on a regular basis and are going to start having a dyno at the events. Keep us updated on how the cryoing the case works out. I went with an automatic because I don't trust the manuals. I blew up and manual with a NA V6.
If it works out well I wouldn't mine going back to a manual.
http://www.tamparacing.com/forums/tampa-racing-events/
They set up track events at Bradenton on a regular basis and are going to start having a dyno at the events. Keep us updated on how the cryoing the case works out. I went with an automatic because I don't trust the manuals. I blew up and manual with a NA V6.
If it works out well I wouldn't mine going back to a manual.