LS1 master question
Thread Starter
Joined: Aug 2005
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From: The trailer park
LS1 master question Currently setting up my LS1 brakes on all 4 corners, here's story..
LS1 M/C
I re-flared lines to make them metric, I did bubble flares, and it hooks up to m/c right.
this is a distribution block from my original 4 wheel brake car, I believe it's hollow, not sure though
I'm planning on putting an adj. prop valve in the line that'll go to the back (3/16")
will it work? Are my lines in the right places? It'll be cleaned up/polished, but i want to make sure it'll work, first.
thx in advance.
olly
LS1 M/C
I re-flared lines to make them metric, I did bubble flares, and it hooks up to m/c right.
this is a distribution block from my original 4 wheel brake car, I believe it's hollow, not sure though
I'm planning on putting an adj. prop valve in the line that'll go to the back (3/16")
will it work? Are my lines in the right places? It'll be cleaned up/polished, but i want to make sure it'll work, first.
thx in advance.
olly
Last edited by 67RSCamaroVette; Apr 4, 2006 at 11:35 PM.
TECH Regular
Joined: Apr 2005
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From: Bothell, WA
Is that an LS1 MC? I can't tell if it's got the low fluid indicator. But then again I haven't handled too many of them.
Why are you using a combo valve if it's open/hollow? Why not plumb the tubing straight through an adjustable to the rear and into a 'Y' for the front (or even a line lock--most have two out ports) ?
Either way, not sure how it's set up on f1st gens but on my turdgen...errr, thirdgen both "in" ports are on the top on either side of the low fluid plug in.
Why are you using a combo valve if it's open/hollow? Why not plumb the tubing straight through an adjustable to the rear and into a 'Y' for the front (or even a line lock--most have two out ports) ?
Either way, not sure how it's set up on f1st gens but on my turdgen...errr, thirdgen both "in" ports are on the top on either side of the low fluid plug in.
that doesnt look right to me.
on that combo/prop valve you have there, one should be feeding the front half, the other the rear half.
but i would NOT run that valve at all.. the LS1 master cyl has the switch for your brake warning light... for the rear brakes (front port on master cyl) i would just go thru an adjustible prop valve (i reccomend the wilwood) then to the rear brakes..
for the front, go optionally thru a line lock, then to a T fitting where it splits off to the front wheels..
on that combo/prop valve you have there, one should be feeding the front half, the other the rear half.
but i would NOT run that valve at all.. the LS1 master cyl has the switch for your brake warning light... for the rear brakes (front port on master cyl) i would just go thru an adjustible prop valve (i reccomend the wilwood) then to the rear brakes..
for the front, go optionally thru a line lock, then to a T fitting where it splits off to the front wheels..
Thread Starter
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,959
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From: The trailer park
that sounds good, and its a good excuse to get a line-lock, too. thanks for replies. The whole braking system thing confuses me. 
i'm guessing i run 3/16 line to the rear? (i destroyed the old one on accident with the jack, its probably best I ran new anyways..) Any certain brand of linelock to avoid? I've got 3/8" fittings on the front pre-formed lines already, but they're stainless and not re-flarable as far as I know, is there a way to keep them like they are? help would still be appreciated, i need to know what parts to get..
thx
olly
i'm guessing i run 3/16 line to the rear? (i destroyed the old one on accident with the jack, its probably best I ran new anyways..) Any certain brand of linelock to avoid? I've got 3/8" fittings on the front pre-formed lines already, but they're stainless and not re-flarable as far as I know, is there a way to keep them like they are? help would still be appreciated, i need to know what parts to get.. thx
olly
Last edited by 67RSCamaroVette; Apr 5, 2006 at 10:01 PM.
Thread Starter
Joined: Aug 2005
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From: The trailer park
I stopped reading there about 2 months ago when I noticed there wasnt a whole lot to learn on it, compared to protouring.net or here. I never saw anything about someone having LS1 brakes on that site. I just need a few questions answered, there's no difinitive answer on anything wherever I look, it seems. What i'm looking for is someone just showing me how to do it.. like, run a 1/4" line from your m/c to a XXX brand linelock, to a X/X" T fitting, to the stock style lines.. I've bought quite a few different lines and fittings and stuff, and they all turned out wrong. Laramie at precision brakes helped me out with the hoses I need, so im pretty sure what to do with the hard lines for the front. i'm really frustrated with the whole thing..
olly
What i'm looking for is someone just showing me how to do it.. like, run a 1/4" line from your m/c to a XXX brand linelock, to a X/X" T fitting, to the stock style lines.. I've bought quite a few different lines and fittings and stuff, and they all turned out wrong. Laramie at precision brakes helped me out with the hoses I need, so im pretty sure what to do with the hard lines for the front. i'm really frustrated with the whole thing.. olly
Last edited by 67RSCamaroVette; Apr 5, 2006 at 11:52 PM.
Originally Posted by 67RSCamaroVette
I stopped reading there about 2 months ago when I noticed there wasnt a whole lot to learn on it, compared to protouring.net or here. I never saw anything about someone having LS1 brakes on that site. I just need a few questions answered, there's no difinitive answer on anything wherever I look, it seems. What i'm looking for is someone just showing me how to do it.. like, run a 1/4" line from your m/c to a XXX brand linelock, to a X/X" T fitting, to the stock style lines.. I've bought quite a few different lines and fittings and stuff, and they all turned out wrong. Laramie at precision brakes helped me out with the hoses I need, so im pretty sure what to do with the hard lines for the front. i'm really frustrated with the whole thing..
olly
What i'm looking for is someone just showing me how to do it.. like, run a 1/4" line from your m/c to a XXX brand linelock, to a X/X" T fitting, to the stock style lines.. I've bought quite a few different lines and fittings and stuff, and they all turned out wrong. Laramie at precision brakes helped me out with the hoses I need, so im pretty sure what to do with the hard lines for the front. i'm really frustrated with the whole thing.. olly
i can try to help ya...
ok, you have a modern metric master cyl, correct?
your first problem will be, all line locks are standard line.. not metric.
what you need to do is take a metric line like you have above, and cut it.
slide a standard tube nut on it, and using a metric double flare tool, flare it. the flare angle is the same. and the size is not critical and very close, so it works well.
you now have a line that fits in the master cyl, and will screw into a standard double flare fitting...
most line locks have 1/8" NPT ports.. so you screw in a 1/8"NPT-> double flare fitting, and connect the line... another fitting is on the out.
if you're not using a line lock, get a double flare fitting T.... this will allow you to connect this output to your two front lines.
for the rear, do the same, except instead of the line lock, the line connects to a prop valve. from the prop valve, it goes to the back of the car.
thats a general overview... do you have any specific questions? i may not be able to answer everything, but i can try to help ya..
heres a closeup of my MC line lock and prop valve... all mounted on the factory combo valve bracket:
(disclaimer: the car was that scratched up in the engine bay when i got it... lol... it looks MUCH nicer in person, i swear.....)
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From: Bothell, WA
Dude, what about using a braided flex line? While looking through the Russel catalogs most all of types of lines say, "not for use on brake lines" How come? How much does the line size make a difference? 3an vs 4an vs whatever?
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Originally Posted by iansane
Dude, what about using a braided flex line? While looking through the Russel catalogs most all of types of lines say, "not for use on brake lines" How come? How much does the line size make a difference? 3an vs 4an vs whatever?
alot of that "not for use" stuff is for liability, but some of it is because some line isnt intended to have a working pressure that high.. it wont burst at that pressure, but the burst pressure is generally 3 times the working pressure.. i only use braided brake lines, and i wouldnt reccomend trying the regular lines as a means to find out what the diff is...
Thread Starter
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,959
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From: The trailer park
LS1 master, LS1 brakes, jeepinpete. 12" all around, I figured the more OEM the better, LS1/C5 are nearly the most powerful stock brakes you can get. MrDude, that helped alot, i'm going to order lots of stuff, and as I piece it together, i may have more questions. I have one right now, though.. It looks like you used the front (bigger) port for the rear brakes, and the rear one (with the linelock) for the front.. will that be the same with mine? thanks alot everyone.
olly
olly
Originally Posted by 67RSCamaroVette
LS1 master, LS1 brakes, jeepinpete. 12" all around, I figured the more OEM the better, LS1/C5 are nearly the most powerful stock brakes you can get. MrDude, that helped alot, i'm going to order lots of stuff, and as I piece it together, i may have more questions. I have one right now, though.. It looks like you used the front (bigger) port for the rear brakes, and the rear one (with the linelock) for the front.. will that be the same with mine? thanks alot everyone.
olly
olly
on GM master cyls, the port closest to the firewall is for the front brakes, and the other one is for the rear. they've done that ever since the first dual master cyl... im not going to guess why, i just know it as how it is...
Originally Posted by MrDude_1
on GM master cyls, the port closest to the firewall is for the front brakes, and the other one is for the rear. they've done that ever since the first dual master cyl... im not going to guess why, i just know it as how it is...
On The Tree
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From: Quakertown, PA
I am guessing that the Vette accomplished brake proportioning through the ABS system, so grabbing a combination valve off a C5 ain't a likely option
I would find a Camaro/Firebird with f/r disc brakes and use that combination valve. The weight distribution of your car compared to a new pony car is probably very similar.
I would also recommend a larger line to the rear brakes. 3/16" is typically used with drum brakes, where the volume of fluid moved is pretty small. Discs brakes typically have larger lines.
Pete
I would find a Camaro/Firebird with f/r disc brakes and use that combination valve. The weight distribution of your car compared to a new pony car is probably very similar.
I would also recommend a larger line to the rear brakes. 3/16" is typically used with drum brakes, where the volume of fluid moved is pretty small. Discs brakes typically have larger lines.
Pete
Originally Posted by 70 LS1
The newer ones are like that, but the older vette style (67-82) that you see on a lot of street rods are the other way.
every GM car ive ever looked at has been the same way, i was under the impression ALL of them were that way..
in anycase, i know that master cyl is intended for it to go that way.
Originally Posted by jeepinpete
I am guessing that the Vette accomplished brake proportioning through the ABS system, so grabbing a combination valve off a C5 ain't a likely option
I would find a Camaro/Firebird with f/r disc brakes and use that combination valve. The weight distribution of your car compared to a new pony car is probably very similar.
I would also recommend a larger line to the rear brakes. 3/16" is typically used with drum brakes, where the volume of fluid moved is pretty small. Discs brakes typically have larger lines.
Pete
I would find a Camaro/Firebird with f/r disc brakes and use that combination valve. The weight distribution of your car compared to a new pony car is probably very similar.
I would also recommend a larger line to the rear brakes. 3/16" is typically used with drum brakes, where the volume of fluid moved is pretty small. Discs brakes typically have larger lines.
Pete
the thirdgens had the crappy 10.5" fronts and PBR rear discs similar to the "LT1" rear discs.. unless it was a 1LE, then it got the 12" ones..
i wouldnt reccomend a 3rdgen combo valve to anyone.. they suck.. GM set it up so the rear brakes are bearly used, EVER... thats the reason i took the combo valve off of mine.
id run a aftermarket prop valve and set it for the car.
Thread Starter
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,959
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From: The trailer park
I agree, the reason I asked about the 3/16 line is because I thought the rear cylinder was for the back brakes, and my car orig had 1/4" line for the back. That had me confused. Also the linelock being a reducer (so I thought) didnt make sense either. Its all becoming clear now, lol. Thanks everyone, I think i've got it figured out. I'm not going to run any combo valve, just do it like Mrdude did. except without the scratched up engine compartment. (jk)
olly
olly
olly
olly
Originally Posted by jeepinpete
I am guessing that the Vette accomplished brake proportioning through the ABS system, so grabbing a combination valve off a C5 ain't a likely option