slow4dr

iTrader: (5)

You make a good point about making sure the chassis is equal. I'd honestly like to see it, I think the outcome would be pretty damn close in stock form. What I'd like to see in addition to that is a $2500 budget of NEW store bought parts not including N20 and see where they end up. Maybe even a little higher budget just to make sure a H/C swap could be done. Maybe you could throw together a "package" that you think would be best for the LS1 and I'll use that budget and build a 2JZ.



Don't get me wrong, these are my two favorite engines but that is hardly an apples to apples comparison. All that video does is create more questions errr controversy for me. 13 psi? To me that says built engine against what is more than likely a stock motor Supra. Not to mention a 67mm turbo on a 2JZ is on the small side.

bowtiestang

iTrader: (1)

I have a few more questions.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3Mll...elated&search=


http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v3...isvsmikess.flv

AND WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED HERE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dag8EVyqW34

As we all can now see on line vids dont "answer" much

sciff5

iTrader: (1)

well first of all the last one is fake.

bowtiestang

iTrader: (1)

Yes I know....Point well made on my part

chuntington101

what the hell has the UKs car industry got to do with the LS1 or 2JZ?? or evne anything i said above?????????

dailydriver

Let me explain. Some of us (few, I know, but still some) do not like imports ONLY because of economic/trade reasons, NOT because we think the cars are slow/$h!t/"japcrap"/sound bad, etc. Some of us just do not "buy into" the whole global economics/Econ 101 thing being so great for us here in THIS country. Forget about your "fair trade", as that's a complete myth. We all know how "fair" it really is, right?? But, yes, this is a thousand page topic for another time, on the SSU (or other) forum. Just suffice it to say that IF MY country's auto industry was completely gone for many years, I guess I would not care/feel so strongly about the economic/trade factors. That being said, an Evo 9 or STI would be in my garage now IF they were made by an American nameplated manufacturer. Understand??

I NEVER stated the GTE was not a phenomenal engine, just that I doubt some of the "telephone game importfanboy" urban myths about said engine. Also that I prefer the LSxes since they originated from a domestic (to me) nameplate. Sorry, but I could NEVER drive anything of/from/by or for the land of the rising sun, NO matter how fast/well built/"indestructable" <-- /etc. it may be in reality OR riceboy fantasy.

bowtiestang

iTrader: (1)

sc300

you guys can argue all you want..but Supras own the ******* highways!!!!!!!! and we are begining to do some damages on the track too...just give us more seat time...

we have 2JZ based drag cars running 6.40s at over 215 mph!!!

we have supras with STOCK rear ends and stock independent rear suspensions doing 7s and low 8s in the 1/4 mile!!!!!! how many cars out there can say that???

and if some of ya dont believe me....just give me a PM me and we can set something up!!

i can get a supra that will beat pretty much any LSX based stock suspension cars with at the track..

a bunch of supras that will beat any LSX based streetcars on the highway....

and a bunch of supras that will beat any LSX streetcars on the dyno!!!!!!!!

and these are just from the texas area...

if you want to run a 6 speed...i can get a few of those too..what is the fastest 6 speed LSX based streetcar?? there are a bunch of low 9 second manual Supras and a few 8 second ones..

you want more?? what is the record for the standing mile for a LSX streetcar?? A supra from Houston did 201mph and won the Texas Mile two years ago..

im not saying the 2JZ is the best motor out there..but compared to the LSX...uh no competition....come on..you have to get a new block from chevy and aftermarket heads to make some real power!!!!!! the 2JZ makes over 1500hp on the STOCK block and stock ported head!!!!!!!!!

and dont even tell me that these motors are hard to find or expesive stock...you can get them from for 2k with the auto tranny, stock turbos and wiring harness ready to drop in..

you can get the NA motor (still 2JZ) from any sc300, gs300, IS300, NA supras..and a bunch of other cars from Japan!!!!

call me a ricerboy all you want...i know from experience...

sc300

btw...the cars in my sig are mine....so yeah Im a bit biased!!

the Supra runs 9s on 18" drag radials, the 2JZ based 240 ran 8.6s on drag radials..i will test it (240) out soon with slicks and a glide (with an extra 300hp)

the other two cars are stock except the wheels....although the porsche will give the C6 a good run..

sc300

oh did i also mentioned that all those supras making over 1200hp are using the STOCK head gasket too and thru a STOCK 6 speed!!!!

you guys can flame me all you want..but please give some facts...not just here say..


btw..i would trade the C6 plus the Supra for a new Z06 any day, not for because of the LSX motor..but an over all bad *** car!!!!!!

chuntington101

WOW! you have some very strong opinions there. and i have to respect you for them. not that i agree with many of them but thats what makes to world a more interesting place.

Chris.

dailydriver

Again, are you talking stock block with upgraded internals, or completely stock, untouched, unopened bottom end?? Also, I hope you're not implying this happened on pump gas, becuase then I will not believe you, no matter what

They are still mechanical devices, subject to the same laws of physics as everything else. Their limits may be higher than most, or even all, but they are NOT "indestructible", like the urban myth the ricefanboy worshippers seem to believe. I've seen them break at the line AND up track, so don't try to tell me they are infallible.

BTW; what was your screen name on the old LS1.com??

sc300

i dont have an old LS1.com sn..

why do you guys even bring up pump gas vs race gas?? who the **** cares??NO one ever uses pump gas when they are making big power not even SBCs or BBCs..so dont even try that..

im not saying the 2JZs are indestructible...but they are much better built from the factory than the LS1s and they are proven to make crazy HP with just forged internals..

like my post above..the LSX block from the factory cant handle that kind of power (1000hp+++) without having to go with an aftermarket block and heads..SO pretty much its not a production LSX motor anymore...so why even compare the two???

rao

iTrader: (18)

This thread delivers

Alt

iTrader: (6)

Yeah well Vtec still owns. A B-series motor with a turbo on it can whistle buzz and then change its buzz tone all in the same gear. Can a 2JZ do that? No it cannot. If it doesn't have an unnecessary amount of cam specs and capture the hearts of 16 year olds at a used car dealership I think its poopy.

[/Sarcasm]

C5AJ

You are wrong! The stock block can handle the power. For those that want an even stronger engine to be sure, they go with the iron (again a stock block).
There are only 2 reasons that the 2JZ is worth anything.
1. It was built as a FI engine. Common sense would tell you that it would be superior to a NA engine. For instance compare it to the 2JZ-GE.
2. The over engineered it as the 1JZ had problems (especially with the head).

Maybe you should focus on your LSx instead of, leaving it stock and bashing it;or maybe you should sell it to someone that knows how to make some power with it.

dailydriver

There, fixed it for you.
Hey, I could say stock vs. modded who the f*** cares, right? Or production vs. aftermarket who the f*** cares?
But yes, you're right, the whole thing is apples to watercress since your "Supdawg" GTE is an iron block built for boost, and the LS1 is an alloy block built for NA power.
One could also argue that once you open up a GTE it is NO LONGER a "production motor" anymore as well.

John B

iTrader: (10)

Please keep this post on topic & civil or it will be locked! Thanks!

distortion_69

iTrader: (20)

A big block making 2200hp from nelson performance vs a 2200hp built supra motor in 2 street/strip car's.

? Is the big block not a better platform, regardless of block. Overall the big block is going to make more torque, and flow more air.. making the same power at less boost with less stress, and more easily. It will also likely run a better 1/4 time, as the supra will take much longer to spool such a giant turbo.

Your argument is completely useless when comparing the overall performance capability of each platform. Displacement wins.

Not only that, both the iron and aluminum block have made well over 1000hp. In fact, I've seen a stock aluminum block stock crank'd motor run 1200rwhp right in front of me running 8.1-8.2 @ 160-170mph at No Problem Raceway in 2005.

The block change the fact that the platform is more capable regardless if the block is modded or if the pistons/rods/crank is changed. This is just a pathetic attempt to argue Supra superiority.. Similar to how Honda's argue HP/L while getting drug down the track. You can stay with your 1000hp Supra all day, but when it come's to real power, your going to step up to a larged cube LSx, BBC, or modded SBC.

1000hp turbo supra on stock block? You speak like 1000hp is a large amount of power. SBC of all gen's have attained those motor's N/A in many race applications, much less with FI.

While the supra makes a fun street car.. so can any car.. honda hatch, rx7, whatever.. they all can be fun when modified.

But if you are looking for the most potential ever, a 400ci BBC/SBC based motor (of any generation, LSx included) is going to have the ability to make the same or more power easily.

Later,
Josh

V8 Supra Builder

iTrader: (37)

Somehow I get the feeling my kids and their kids will be reading & debating this thread when I am no longer around . But at least by then my LM7 Supra will be running right .

How is this for a classic argument