Manual or Auto?
12-16-2011, 07:35 AM
#1
TECH Resident
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Roseville, Ca.
Posts: 843
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Manual or Auto? I'm looking at 08 and up Vettes. I've driven an LS M6 Camaro for 12 years and love it. I know all of the pro's and con's of a manual, but know very little about the newer A6 other than it will get you out of the hole more consistantly.
I'm not sure about my goals yet. Either a medium cam and full exhaust or a blower, but probably not much over 500ish rwhp and daily driven.
I like the idea of snatching up any gear at any time and having less drivetrain loss, but I've been told the new auto is amazing. A Manual will eventually need a clutch upgrade and an Auto will want a stall.
What do you like about the Auto? What are the downsides? Is the new auto really that great? Is a stall a dramatic upgrade?
Any thoughts would be helpful.
Thanks.
I'm not sure about my goals yet. Either a medium cam and full exhaust or a blower, but probably not much over 500ish rwhp and daily driven.
I like the idea of snatching up any gear at any time and having less drivetrain loss, but I've been told the new auto is amazing. A Manual will eventually need a clutch upgrade and an Auto will want a stall.
What do you like about the Auto? What are the downsides? Is the new auto really that great? Is a stall a dramatic upgrade?
Any thoughts would be helpful.
Thanks.
12-16-2011, 12:43 PM
#6
There is a lot of wool being pulled over people eyes about them too. They are getting better as time goes on. But the earlier units are failing regularly. We have done many many 4L60e and 4L80e conversions in 6L80e equiped cars. The problem lies in the way they are controlled by the ECM/TCM. Every aspect of the engine tuning affects the transmission tuning as well. The 6L80e transmission is also a clutch/clutch type transmissions. Where-as the 4L60e and 4L80e are clutch/band type transmissions. With a clutch/clutch trans you have to allow time for the first clutch to disengauge before you apply the next clutch. And while doing this you need to allow some torque management to remain in the tuning to pull timing and power down the engine on the shifts. This is similar to what they have been doing with the Allison transmissions in the Duramax trucks for years. But everyone wants that firm, tire chirping shift they have grown accustomed to over the years. So the tuner cuts the shift timing out and rams the clutches home into the next gear which will bind the clutches and eventually fail the transmission.
Some of the tuners on here have had great success with them. But eventually they fail and non of the aftermarket rebuilders (including us) can build them any better/stronger than the OEM GM unit was from the factory.
So by the time you put 3-4 6L80e transmissions in the car over a few years and delt with the downtime and labor to R&R the trans you could have done a 4 speed auto conversion and been enjoying your car instead of fixing it.
Some of the tuners on here have had great success with them. But eventually they fail and non of the aftermarket rebuilders (including us) can build them any better/stronger than the OEM GM unit was from the factory.
So by the time you put 3-4 6L80e transmissions in the car over a few years and delt with the downtime and labor to R&R the trans you could have done a 4 speed auto conversion and been enjoying your car instead of fixing it.
Trending Topics
12-18-2011, 06:28 AM
#10
There is a lot of wool being pulled over people eyes about them too. They are getting better as time goes on. But the earlier units are failing regularly. We have done many many 4L60e and 4L80e conversions in 6L80e equiped cars. The problem lies in the way they are controlled by the ECM/TCM. Every aspect of the engine tuning affects the transmission tuning as well. The 6L80e transmission is also a clutch/clutch type transmissions. Where-as the 4L60e and 4L80e are clutch/band type transmissions. With a clutch/clutch trans you have to allow time for the first clutch to disengauge before you apply the next clutch. And while doing this you need to allow some torque management to remain in the tuning to pull timing and power down the engine on the shifts. This is similar to what they have been doing with the Allison transmissions in the Duramax trucks for years. But everyone wants that firm, tire chirping shift they have grown accustomed to over the years. So the tuner cuts the shift timing out and rams the clutches home into the next gear which will bind the clutches and eventually fail the transmission.
Some of the tuners on here have had great success with them. But eventually they fail and non of the aftermarket rebuilders (including us) can build them any better/stronger than the OEM GM unit was from the factory.
So by the time you put 3-4 6L80e transmissions in the car over a few years and delt with the downtime and labor to R&R the trans you could have done a 4 speed auto conversion and been enjoying your car instead of fixing it.
Some of the tuners on here have had great success with them. But eventually they fail and non of the aftermarket rebuilders (including us) can build them any better/stronger than the OEM GM unit was from the factory.
So by the time you put 3-4 6L80e transmissions in the car over a few years and delt with the downtime and labor to R&R the trans you could have done a 4 speed auto conversion and been enjoying your car instead of fixing it.
12-18-2011, 08:18 PM
#12
But I do believe that my tuner (Cartek Performance Engineering) utilizes much of the intelligent programming procedures that Jeremy was talking about above so that could be part of it.
12-19-2011, 07:26 AM
#13
There is a lot of wool being pulled over people eyes about them too. They are getting better as time goes on. But the earlier units are failing regularly. We have done many many 4L60e and 4L80e conversions in 6L80e equiped cars. The problem lies in the way they are controlled by the ECM/TCM. Every aspect of the engine tuning affects the transmission tuning as well. The 6L80e transmission is also a clutch/clutch type transmissions. Where-as the 4L60e and 4L80e are clutch/band type transmissions. With a clutch/clutch trans you have to allow time for the first clutch to disengauge before you apply the next clutch. And while doing this you need to allow some torque management to remain in the tuning to pull timing and power down the engine on the shifts. This is similar to what they have been doing with the Allison transmissions in the Duramax trucks for years. But everyone wants that firm, tire chirping shift they have grown accustomed to over the years. So the tuner cuts the shift timing out and rams the clutches home into the next gear which will bind the clutches and eventually fail the transmission.
Some of the tuners on here have had great success with them. But eventually they fail and non of the aftermarket rebuilders (including us) can build them any better/stronger than the OEM GM unit was from the factory.
So by the time you put 3-4 6L80e transmissions in the car over a few years and delt with the downtime and labor to R&R the trans you could have done a 4 speed auto conversion and been enjoying your car instead of fixing it.
Some of the tuners on here have had great success with them. But eventually they fail and non of the aftermarket rebuilders (including us) can build them any better/stronger than the OEM GM unit was from the factory.
So by the time you put 3-4 6L80e transmissions in the car over a few years and delt with the downtime and labor to R&R the trans you could have done a 4 speed auto conversion and been enjoying your car instead of fixing it.
12-24-2011, 10:31 AM
#15
TECH Fanatic
iTrader: (6)
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: DSM
Posts: 1,433
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This scares me as I was in love with the quick shifts and paddle shifters of the 6l80e.
That is crazy. I guess I was so happy seeing guys like Silver Bullet easily pull 9's on many passes in his 2008 SC Corvette and was considering swapping a 6l80e in a C6Z if I get one. Had no clue the 4l80e is such a better option. I really don't want to go through many transmissions though. Just kind of want to get into it and drive. Maybe bolt-ons for a few years, heads and cam later long term goals
There is a lot of wool being pulled over people eyes about them too. They are getting better as time goes on. But the earlier units are failing regularly. Some of the tuners on here have had great success with them. But eventually they fail and non of the aftermarket rebuilders (including us) can build them any better/stronger than the OEM GM unit was from the factory.
So by the time you put 3-4 6L80e transmissions in the car over a few years and delt with the downtime and labor to R&R the trans you could have done a 4 speed auto conversion and been enjoying your car instead of fixing it.
So by the time you put 3-4 6L80e transmissions in the car over a few years and delt with the downtime and labor to R&R the trans you could have done a 4 speed auto conversion and been enjoying your car instead of fixing it.
01-23-2012, 11:12 AM
#18
12 Second Club
iTrader: (23)
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Fort Hood TX. 76522
Posts: 639
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
well if your gonna have a 4 speed auto in a C6 you might as well not even buy one and just get a C5. the whole reason i would even consider a auto in a C6 is because its a 6 speed.
01-23-2012, 11:31 AM
#19
The 6 speed auto in the C6 has been a headache from day one. There are many other reasons to buy a C6 besides the 6 speed auto. If I was corvette shopping and didn't have the cash for a C6 Z06, I would buy an 08+ base model C6 M6 car. Then if I wanted an auto I would buy the same car and have it converted to a 4L65e.
