drivinhard

iTrader: (1)

The C5 Z06 really had no options to speak, they are all virtually the same weight (very minor weight differences, 01's having slightly (1.3 lb for all 4) wheels, no HUD, 4 cats instead of 2, etc. Z16 04's have the carbon fiber hood (10.8 lbs lighter). Shipping weight on the C5 Z with 3-4 gallons out of bowling green was 3040 lbs. F-body's ain't that light.

The C5 has a lower drag CF to. Makes a big difference above 100 mph.

spy2520

iTrader: (3)

my car weighs 3351 with SFCs, fulll interior except the spare tire, and no driver...

CamTom12

iTrader: (1)

Damn! Mine is 3740 with me in it. That's full interior (with spare), 9", SFC's, etc.

I only weigh 175, too!

Mr Peepers

When you say similarly then the 6-7 mph difference can exist. But in reality if both cars were as identical as humanly possible power, tranny, gearing, weight and 60' time wise and raced on the same day then the diff would most likely be 1-3 mph if both were in the 10-11 second range. If were talking 7-8 second range then the diff could be as much as 5-6 mph.

WS6TransAm01

iTrader: (13)

Maybe that has something to do with the fact that GM has not made a Camaro/Firebird in 5 years and have made many many Vettes since then.

Their fastest H/C car is an F-Body
Their fastest turbo car will soon be an F-Body
Their fastest NA Stroker car will soon be an F-body

The Dragon

iTrader: (6)

To the original poster:

Even though it's already been stated many times in this thread: aerodynamic advantage; plain and simple.

If you consider the top speed of a vehicle; the top speed of a vehicle and it's aerodynamics is going to play a far larger role than maximum horsepower will.

If you had an identical set-up and powered C5/C6/F-body (displacement, tranny, gearing etc.), the F-bodies top speed will be considerably lower than the 'Vettes.

Cross-sectional area is better on a Vette. CD is better on a Vette. As the speeds increase, even as low as 100 mph, the aerodynamics will start to effect mph between the two cars

I've also had real-world "crude" testing of high-speed aerodynamics between the two cars in question

Anonymous

Hey, I agree that the Vette has the Aero Dynamic advantage across the boards, no question. But if people start to pay attention, they will notice a difference greater than it should be. Remember that you have to be comparing cars from the same shop in similar weather etc...etc...

I have always noticed the higher MPH out of Vettes, but they are usually manuals 9 out of 10 times. Now I am starting to notice A4 Vettes going big MPH with similar (or exact) engines to a given f-body. With the ET's not being off as much (but still quicker)

Modified A4 C5 Vettes are getting more and more popular I have noticed.
There have always been a lot of A4 F-bodies.

This has been my observation. It is absolute.

tektrans

iTrader: (23)

true true, didn't think of that.

Mr Peepers

Exact engines as a given Fbody? Really, they couldn't even do that in the old IROC races.

You're beating this horse to death Bro.

OK, maybe it's due to greater length of the primary tubes in Vette headers.
Or the better exhaust design...they all have true duals whereas not every Fbody does, most still retain the Y-pipe.

And comparing the dyno numbers a Vette puts down vs what an Fbody puts down does nothing since they have different rear end set-ups. So "exact" same RWHP doesn't mean anything in reality.


There are so many variables in the Y and F platforms that you can't have an "exact" comparison. You or I have NOT seen a Fbody that was identically prepared to a Vette cause it's nearly impossible.

The MPH comes from the Aerodynamics. There's your absolute.

Anonymous

Soon to be's don't count. So what do you have One?
And the engine in that F-body is not identical to the one in the similar Vette.

And that Turbo engine will be like nothing else ever installed by them before.
And that new NA motor will be new as well.

Anonymous

I don't have the time to refute everyone of your statements.
But If you had seen what I have seen you would be saying the same thing.
I have been at this game for years & years.

If a car is making XXX amount of rear wheel HP what difference does it make what the drive train losses are???
We are not talking Crank HP?
As long as the area under the curve is the same.
(which they are in my observations)

Exact and Identical are relative terms, for the case of this discussion we are talking a ten RWHP difference or less. Same track, Same day, Same converter, same tuners, equal weights etc etc... Yet F-bodies are always down significantly on MPH. (and usually ET) F-body vs Vette. Absolute.

LSGunZ28

iTrader: (8)

when I had LTs and lid only I was going 8.07 @ 89.25 mph with a 1.89 60'

when I had LTs , lid and a aluminum fw. I was trapping a high MPH. 8.1 @ 90 mph with a 2.0 and high 1.9 60's !!!

now Im doing 8.0 @ 88 mph and I have a moser 12 bolt, 3.73s, suspension for road racing and underdrive pulley.

due to more weight and more RWHP being lost Im doing bad, but the underdrive pulley and 3.73 gearing should have made up for that, if not more. Plus Im cutting 1.79 60's now and still doing only 8.0s @ 88 mph. WTF?

2001stripper

Not always. I have yet to run into a C5 that traps higher than me and that includes the 2002 Z06 that was trapping 110-111 mph last friday ay the track.

WS6TransAm01

iTrader: (13)

Jesus Anonymous...

Quit whining and race your car

Even if you get the answer what will that give you? Will you sell your f-body and buy a Vette?

Anonymous

I may just have too!

Spankyspank

Well in your absolute observations there are still some holes. A chassis dyno doesn't take into account certain things. For one, almost all dyno runs are done with the hood open. What happens when they do a run with the hood closed? Cars make less power. What if the Vette loses less than the fbody?They also don't take into account the added power given by a cold air/ram air setup because the car is stationary. You're putting too much emphasis on dyno numbers. It's a 3 second one gear run on something that, if you're using a dynojet, doesn't even load the engine as hard as the same run on the street would.

Same torque converter means nothing because although both may have the same rated stall it doesn't make them idenical. One might be more efficient than the other even if they're both manufactured by the same company.

Have you also considered the fact that the vette has a much better flowing air intake than the fbody? Not gonna see the full effect of that on the dyno.

So once again bro, no such thing as two identical or even as similarly prepared cars when comparing 2 different platforms.

Anonymous

I have taken most of this into consideration, the dyno load should be wash. You may have something with the hood part, but it can't see that drastic of a difference?

The converters in the examples I am thinking of are the same manufacturer. I think you are reaching with this one?

I think you have somthing here. I have come up with this deduction myself since this thread was started.
I have since purchased and installed a SS Ram Air for my Camaro, I am going to see what kind of difference it makes?

I am doing the best I can with what I have to work with.
A blind man can see, that when you factor in all that you can, that the Vette is almost always faster and thus usually quicker than the f-body.
I am just trying to figure out Why?

Thank you for your contributions, you are thinking down the same roads I am.