Cam only, winter upgrades. Bitch in on a diet
03-27-2011, 01:58 PM
#383
ya, most stock uppers weigh more then stock, I know the UMI ones are. Kinds the same on the lowers, most only save 5-7#s and cost $4-500. If a see a clean set used I might get a set of lowers. But as of now I'm waiting till I go to a motor plate, then getting a racecraft Kmember, with there lower arms for holes and not slots in the Kmember.
03-27-2011, 04:00 PM
#385
The benefit of the upper a arms isn't the weight, it's that they are mounted witha bushing/rod end, and provide a bind free suspension movement. Try taking the top of a spindle off, and moving the stock upper a arm. It doesn't even want to move, because the rubber bushing's are always seized and are trying to twist as you move it.... not good.
Adding a couple lbs for a bind free suspension believe me is worth while.
Fwiw, the lw spindles that are out there I wouldn't run on the street... As for the K member, I dunno some of the ones I have seen, I don't know what would happen with a good pothole. If you're really careful, yeah you should be ok but I still wonder... Same goes for any of the strut style lower a arms. I question how well they would stand up to street use.... my thoughts are that they won't be all too happy. I have the burkhart setup, I can speak from exp on that.. it's a really nice light weight front end for a race car, nice holes in it no slots, etc.... but when you take their design and try to lighten it up further, I don't know if it's going to take abuse all too well.
Adding a couple lbs for a bind free suspension believe me is worth while.
Fwiw, the lw spindles that are out there I wouldn't run on the street... As for the K member, I dunno some of the ones I have seen, I don't know what would happen with a good pothole. If you're really careful, yeah you should be ok but I still wonder... Same goes for any of the strut style lower a arms. I question how well they would stand up to street use.... my thoughts are that they won't be all too happy. I have the burkhart setup, I can speak from exp on that.. it's a really nice light weight front end for a race car, nice holes in it no slots, etc.... but when you take their design and try to lighten it up further, I don't know if it's going to take abuse all too well.
03-27-2011, 10:43 PM
#386
that midwest front end, has a un sealed spherical bearing for the balljoints. Thats not going to last on the street or if you get them wet.
Thanks for that info JL I've looked into this alot and taked to alot of guys thay run diffrent setups. this should fit me the best. If you tighten up your stock bushings at ride height its not that bad, then they only have to move a few degs each way and thats before you have to twist the bushings were they bind. And my friend told me today he has a gobalwest delin bushing kit for stocks then is bind free, So I'm gona look into that,
The burkhart spindles you can only get with a manual rack style strait tierod holes, and don't fit stock rims I run anyway on the street. I would need to buy a bumpsteer kit to put on my stock rack to bolt to the spindles for $150, and there spindles I was told were $595 on the phone. They did have a tax sale (-5%) but it was still more then the racecraft ones, for $550 ready to bolt on. I think it was something like $720 to run the burhart spindles. I have a lot of other racecraft stuff and been really happy with it.
clutch is in, I think its lighter then the old one.
Thanks for that info JL I've looked into this alot and taked to alot of guys thay run diffrent setups. this should fit me the best. If you tighten up your stock bushings at ride height its not that bad, then they only have to move a few degs each way and thats before you have to twist the bushings were they bind. And my friend told me today he has a gobalwest delin bushing kit for stocks then is bind free, So I'm gona look into that,
The burkhart spindles you can only get with a manual rack style strait tierod holes, and don't fit stock rims I run anyway on the street. I would need to buy a bumpsteer kit to put on my stock rack to bolt to the spindles for $150, and there spindles I was told were $595 on the phone. They did have a tax sale (-5%) but it was still more then the racecraft ones, for $550 ready to bolt on. I think it was something like $720 to run the burhart spindles. I have a lot of other racecraft stuff and been really happy with it.
clutch is in, I think its lighter then the old one.
Last edited by studderin; 03-27-2011 at 11:31 PM.
03-27-2011, 11:06 PM
#387
I hear ya on the spindles. Just be careful on the street with them.. keep a close eye on them, make sure they don't crack, etc. You "should" be fine... but ya never know. You're into race car parts now.
And I agree the midwest deal, with the way the joints on that are it's not going to last on the street.. and better be careful like you said even getting that wet, any rust starts in there you'll be replacing parts quick. I'm sure it's light, but at a cost.
And I agree the midwest deal, with the way the joints on that are it's not going to last on the street.. and better be careful like you said even getting that wet, any rust starts in there you'll be replacing parts quick. I'm sure it's light, but at a cost.
03-29-2011, 06:19 PM
#388
I've never heard of anyone bending one, even street driven cars. I remember superZ had a set of them with bigger willwood brakes on his 88-91?mm turbo car he drove no bunch on the street. Mark said they made them super light for mustangs years ago and guys were bending them that street drove them. So they made these camaro ones over strong. And they now make the "ultra light" spindles. But there not going to say there find for a daily driver, and have to deal with that. The burkart ones are lighter then these, I heard form some guys too the noticed the steering arms flexing when you turn without moving. The racecraft sets have some beef to them, I'll keep them updated for sure.
03-30-2011, 09:03 AM
#389
I looked my burkhart stuff over... and never saw any flex hen moving the tires while the car was sitting even with the motor in it... but I also had skinny's on the car... if you have street tires on it with some width, maybe I don't know.
I just noticed in your clutch pic, it doesn't look like you have a blowproof bellhousing on the car..... please tell me I'm wrong.
I just noticed in your clutch pic, it doesn't look like you have a blowproof bellhousing on the car..... please tell me I'm wrong.
03-31-2011, 10:33 AM
#393
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What was being said about MWC bushings ? i was getting ready to buy some A-arms for my MWC k-member but im unsure about whats being said up there ^^^.....ALSO was wondering how much you were loosing swapping brakes and spindles up front....they are SEXY as hell dude...
03-31-2011, 12:58 PM
#394
My MOROSO DS-2's 26x15 were 10lbs
My MOROSO 24x15 2-ply bias racing tires were 8-9lbs each
I could have gotten 10,000 miles easy out of the Kumho's. My MOROSO's burn up after about 1000-1500 miles. Something to think about if you street drive your car a lot. I go through 2 sets of front tires and 1 set of rears every year.
03-31-2011, 02:36 PM
#396
[QUOTE=00blacka4;14718061]Can i run the moroso Ds2s with the M/T ET street radials?[quote]
Yes, that whole "don't mix bias-ply with radial tires" myth is crap. Run whatever you want.
No clue, but i'm pretty sure they are a radial tire. Probably closer in weight to the Kumho's.
Yes, that whole "don't mix bias-ply with radial tires" myth is crap. Run whatever you want.
No clue, but i'm pretty sure they are a radial tire. Probably closer in weight to the Kumho's.
03-31-2011, 03:58 PM
#397
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damn 16lbs rotational in just front tires is alot...im deffinetly going to get the DS-2s if they are safe !!! i do drive on the street but not daily just weekend warrior...
Still wanting a response on what you were refering to studdering about the MWC bushings or something ? are you talking about on their A-arms (because i was going to buy from them) or are you talking about their spindles ?
Still wanting a response on what you were refering to studdering about the MWC bushings or something ? are you talking about on their A-arms (because i was going to buy from them) or are you talking about their spindles ?
03-31-2011, 04:27 PM
#398
My 165/85r/15 Kumho's were 18lbs each iirc
My MOROSO DS-2's 26x15 were 10lbs
My MOROSO 24x15 2-ply bias racing tires were 8-9lbs each
I could have gotten 10,000 miles easy out of the Kumho's. My MOROSO's burn up after about 1000-1500 miles. Something to think about if you street drive your car a lot. I go through 2 sets of front tires and 1 set of rears every year.
My MOROSO DS-2's 26x15 were 10lbs
My MOROSO 24x15 2-ply bias racing tires were 8-9lbs each
I could have gotten 10,000 miles easy out of the Kumho's. My MOROSO's burn up after about 1000-1500 miles. Something to think about if you street drive your car a lot. I go through 2 sets of front tires and 1 set of rears every year.
Yup. Timmy mounted the DS2s for me. Said he ran on his nova once, a few years ago. After like 500 miles they were about half warn so he changed them for track only rims and got something else. I've had the same DS2s sice that 1st time I went to the track after putting in the streetsweeper cam. And went 11.51@121 I think that was in 2007? is posted many pages ago. I don't leave them on for the week. I have put a few hundred street miles, in some car meets, photo shoots, and drove to the track 5-7 times on the race wheels when I pressed for time. (changed them the night before, drove the car to the track right after work getting there late anyway) Joelster gave me his old kumos, I didn't end up running them for the weight saving with the DS2. But ya I wouldn't try to get alot of street miles on them.
My setup (this is how the DS2 look right now, still good for this year)
Greg weld 15x3.5 with a moroso DS2 26x4.5x15 22.4 each
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y11...cture006-2.jpg
some other weights
15x3.5 Prostars w/165 R15 radial tires = 26.6#'s each
15x8 Prostars w/26x10.5x15 ET Streets = 28.6#'s each
Bogart Aluma Light 15x3.5 w/Moroso DS-2: 19.5
Pro Star 15x3.5 w/Steel Belted Radial: 25.5
Bogart Aluma Light 15x10.5 w/28x10.5 ET Drag: 34.5
Pro Star 15x8 w/27.1x9 ET Drag: 31.0
03-31-2011, 04:35 PM
#399
The MWC thing is about what they use for the balljoints on there spindle/contraol arm race setup. Its a dry spherical joint with no dust boot. LIke this
Its a very nice setup, designed clean sheet around a race setup with no stock parts working with it. For a race car that stays on a trailer its a great setup. But I dont see it lasting long at all for some street miles, and with that getting wet. You can have rod end control arm stuff last on a weekend driver for 5-7K miles that you drive in the rain once a month. Your LCA and PHR only move a few degrees. Th balljoints hold all the weight of them car, and them turn in 100% of the steering motion, with moving thu the suspension travle. I'm not a chassis engineer, but would think that placement has 5x+ more the load, and movment then a rod end on the front or rear control arm.
It looks like the control arm tubes are welded right to the spherical joint? I dont think thats possible but what I see on the pics? I don't know the price on those joints? It would be cool if they were cheap, and pressed in a cup. So you could change them out when they get warn.
Its a very nice setup, designed clean sheet around a race setup with no stock parts working with it. For a race car that stays on a trailer its a great setup. But I dont see it lasting long at all for some street miles, and with that getting wet. You can have rod end control arm stuff last on a weekend driver for 5-7K miles that you drive in the rain once a month. Your LCA and PHR only move a few degrees. Th balljoints hold all the weight of them car, and them turn in 100% of the steering motion, with moving thu the suspension travle. I'm not a chassis engineer, but would think that placement has 5x+ more the load, and movment then a rod end on the front or rear control arm.
It looks like the control arm tubes are welded right to the spherical joint? I dont think thats possible but what I see on the pics? I don't know the price on those joints? It would be cool if they were cheap, and pressed in a cup. So you could change them out when they get warn.
Last edited by studderin; 03-31-2011 at 04:48 PM.
03-31-2011, 04:42 PM
#400
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i got ya, what do you think about the MWC A-arms as far as street driving are they as strong as the others....
how much weight are you expecting aprox. to save with the brake/spindle setup....looks awesome
how much weight are you expecting aprox. to save with the brake/spindle setup....looks awesome