Help me get traction :)
Thread Starter
TECH Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 10,341
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Help me get traction :) Hi guys,
Here is my chassis setup:
Hotchkis LCAs and PH rod
Random Tech Torque Arm (Maybe bent, need to check it today)
28x10 inch slicks at 9psi with BIG burnout
RR airbag (needs new valve)
Best sixty I could muster with the 28 inch slicks was a 1.77
Now the track wasnt hooking for **** but unfortunately it is the track I most frequent <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
I am getting a custom chromeoly six point weld in cage put in the car soon so hopefully that will help the car rigidity wise <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
What else can I do? Going to make sure the TA is set at -3 degrees and also get the RR airbag fixed and start at 15psi. Is there anything I am missing? I am going to load up the converter super hard next time (3Krpms) and see how it responds.
I am not sure what else I can try? I know the 2.75 first gear in the tranny with the 28 inch slicks is hurting me a little gearing wise but I dont want to put more gear in the car if I can help it. Cant hook at all on 26's.
Basically I need traction and a good 1.50 sixty <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> Any ideas??
Cheers,
Chris
Here is my chassis setup:
Hotchkis LCAs and PH rod
Random Tech Torque Arm (Maybe bent, need to check it today)
28x10 inch slicks at 9psi with BIG burnout
RR airbag (needs new valve)
Best sixty I could muster with the 28 inch slicks was a 1.77
Now the track wasnt hooking for **** but unfortunately it is the track I most frequent <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
I am getting a custom chromeoly six point weld in cage put in the car soon so hopefully that will help the car rigidity wise <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
What else can I do? Going to make sure the TA is set at -3 degrees and also get the RR airbag fixed and start at 15psi. Is there anything I am missing? I am going to load up the converter super hard next time (3Krpms) and see how it responds.
I am not sure what else I can try? I know the 2.75 first gear in the tranny with the 28 inch slicks is hurting me a little gearing wise but I dont want to put more gear in the car if I can help it. Cant hook at all on 26's.
Basically I need traction and a good 1.50 sixty <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> Any ideas??
Cheers,
Chris
TECH Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 9,246
Likes: 3
From: Troy, AL
Re: Help me get traction :) (Dumb question time)...
Front swaybar removed?
Also, how new are those slicks and what wheels are they mounted on? 8 psi hot may be a little low. I use 10 hot.
The car isn't lowered, right? Either way, I like LCA relocators.
Front swaybar removed?
Also, how new are those slicks and what wheels are they mounted on? 8 psi hot may be a little low. I use 10 hot.
The car isn't lowered, right? Either way, I like LCA relocators.
Thread Starter
TECH Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 10,341
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Re: Help me get traction :) I tried anywhere from 15psi hot down to about 12psi hot with the lower hooking better. The slicks are the 28x10x16 inch slicks newly made by Hooiser and are mounted on stock 16 inch firebird wheels. Problem is I get worse traction with the 26x8.5x16 inch slicks.
The track prep is pretty shitty there but I have to fun some way to get it down <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
Also I have the front swaybar removed and stock springs and shocks in the car.
Cheers,
Chris
<small>[ May 20, 2002, 02:10 PM: Message edited by: Chris ARE 360 ]</small>
The track prep is pretty shitty there but I have to fun some way to get it down <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
Also I have the front swaybar removed and stock springs and shocks in the car.
Cheers,
Chris
<small>[ May 20, 2002, 02:10 PM: Message edited by: Chris ARE 360 ]</small>
TECH Resident
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 908
Likes: 0
From: Knoxville, TN
Re: Help me get traction :) What the hell's a torque arm?? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />
Loading the converter might work, as that will lessen the shock on the tires. Beyond..........what Terry said. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
Loading the converter might work, as that will lessen the shock on the tires. Beyond..........what Terry said. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
Re: Help me get traction :) adjustable Hals! The Hal struts will make a significant difference in weight transfer. I know that they helped both my T/A and my SS out a LOT. I'm having great success with the stock springs and Hal struts. I'd also recommend the LCA relocation brackets, as Stephen mentioned. That seemed to help quite a bit.
__________________
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Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 7,234
Likes: 1
From: Mississauga, Ontario
Re: Help me get traction :) Chris, St.Thomas has been crazy this year, one week the traction sucks, the next week it's awesome. I don't think you need to make major changes, you simply need to get there on a good day. The first time I went there this year the track sucked, I couldn't do better than a 2.5 60ft, and not many others could either. Went back two weeks after that and cut a 2.04 60ft (was able to leave at 100% full throttle without wheelspin) St.Thomas is a good track, they just need to be more consistent with their track prep. Back when it was owned by John Fletcher, the track was sticky every single week, and I'd cut 1.59 60fts all the time in my supercharged Mustang.
Keep in mind also, the weather has been very cold here lately, and cold pavement doesn't hook very well. It's barely been above 50F here lately, when it starts getting in the 70s, the track will consistently hook better, and if they prep it as well, you'll see your 60fts go way way down. Trust me.
Keep in mind also, the weather has been very cold here lately, and cold pavement doesn't hook very well. It's barely been above 50F here lately, when it starts getting in the 70s, the track will consistently hook better, and if they prep it as well, you'll see your 60fts go way way down. Trust me.
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On The Tree
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 136
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From: LOS ANGELES
Re: Help me get traction :) TRY THIS next pass, 12 psi cold tires, do a burn out till ya see smoke in both mirrors, ease off the gass and stage, (dont do a dry hop)if you can have someone VHT the tires that will help too
Todd
Todd
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Re: Help me get traction :) Two issues here Pippinator...
1) Track prep. The track must have been truly pathetic if you could not even go low 1.6's with those 28's. Y'see if I can't get at least a 1.65 I just go home. It's not the car it's the track! Heck I went a 1.51 on 26" ET Streets at 15psi and the car tracked great in 3rd and did not wander all over the track.
2) What should you do next? I agree with the boyz, Hal/QA1 front shocks. I'd just keep the stock front springs the Hal's make the car bouncy. The hals will make you consistent. I was cutting 1.60's on some work out old MH tires... and consistent 1.65's on ET Streets...
I would not do the 6 pt rollbar for stiffen the car up, you don't want to make the car heavy until the track officials are yelling at you.
1) Track prep. The track must have been truly pathetic if you could not even go low 1.6's with those 28's. Y'see if I can't get at least a 1.65 I just go home. It's not the car it's the track! Heck I went a 1.51 on 26" ET Streets at 15psi and the car tracked great in 3rd and did not wander all over the track.
2) What should you do next? I agree with the boyz, Hal/QA1 front shocks. I'd just keep the stock front springs the Hal's make the car bouncy. The hals will make you consistent. I was cutting 1.60's on some work out old MH tires... and consistent 1.65's on ET Streets...
I would not do the 6 pt rollbar for stiffen the car up, you don't want to make the car heavy until the track officials are yelling at you.
On The Tree
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 120
Likes: 0
From: Washington, D.C.
Re: Help me get traction :) Chris,
Sometimes bad track prep is the only answer!. With the amount of power that you're making and the chassis mods that you have in place, there is no reason for you not to have a better launch. You said it yourself,..."good track prep is walking up to the line and loosing you're sneaker". Unfortunately there are still tracks around that think they don't have to prep the track unless they are running top fuel cars. I'm sure you will get this worked out...one note on the 28" Hoosiers; I really would be careful about lowering those tires below 14 lbs. This is a very soft compound that will give you alot of contact patch w/o reducing the air pressure to the point of running over you're own rubber...that in itself creates its own set of problems on launch and obviously at the traps.
Hang in there, Chris. Try some other tracks before you change your combination too radically.
Good Luck,
Chuck
Sometimes bad track prep is the only answer!. With the amount of power that you're making and the chassis mods that you have in place, there is no reason for you not to have a better launch. You said it yourself,..."good track prep is walking up to the line and loosing you're sneaker". Unfortunately there are still tracks around that think they don't have to prep the track unless they are running top fuel cars. I'm sure you will get this worked out...one note on the 28" Hoosiers; I really would be careful about lowering those tires below 14 lbs. This is a very soft compound that will give you alot of contact patch w/o reducing the air pressure to the point of running over you're own rubber...that in itself creates its own set of problems on launch and obviously at the traps.
Hang in there, Chris. Try some other tracks before you change your combination too radically.
Good Luck,
Chuck
Thread Starter
TECH Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 10,341
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Re: Help me get traction :) Thanks guys for the advice <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
With the number of accidents there the past month they are MUCH stricter with tech. (All traction related.... Two 9 second cars losing it the whole way down the track and wiping at the big end)
I wont be able to get many more 11 second passes in without the bar. After witnessing that Mustang crash I can't wait to get a bar in the car even if I lose a tenth/mph from weight.
Also the guy said I couldnt race again if I came back without a helmet rated "90".)
Anyways thanks for the advice, I am going to make sure my TA and airbag are setup and working properly and try the tires again around 13psi.
I have been heating up the tires a LOT (first gear shifting to second gear burnouts for at least 12 seconds, rolling out of the burnout up to the line)
I am going to hold off on the Hals for now and see what a little warmer weather, working airbag and readjusted TA brings in terms of traction.
Cheers,
Chris
With the number of accidents there the past month they are MUCH stricter with tech. (All traction related.... Two 9 second cars losing it the whole way down the track and wiping at the big end)
I wont be able to get many more 11 second passes in without the bar. After witnessing that Mustang crash I can't wait to get a bar in the car even if I lose a tenth/mph from weight.
Also the guy said I couldnt race again if I came back without a helmet rated "90".)
Anyways thanks for the advice, I am going to make sure my TA and airbag are setup and working properly and try the tires again around 13psi.
I have been heating up the tires a LOT (first gear shifting to second gear burnouts for at least 12 seconds, rolling out of the burnout up to the line)
I am going to hold off on the Hals for now and see what a little warmer weather, working airbag and readjusted TA brings in terms of traction.
Cheers,
Chris
TECH Enthusiast
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 559
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From: West Monore
Re: Help me get traction :) I know how it feels to have traction problems. I have tried this, that, and experiment. Don't let it get you down. Over a period of time, you will sort it out. I highly recommend you get the Hal's front and back. After the install, it is very easy to adjustment the **** with your finger. It is easy to tune your suspension through these shocks. Good luck with your traction and hang in there. Kent.
TECH Regular
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 484
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From: Houston
Re: Help me get traction :) What gear are you running in the rear?
If you are running a 4.10 or lower that might be a problem.
A big 28 inch tire with gear you up Quite a bit from a stock dia. tire
It may not be your problem, but it was mine.
KEn
If you are running a 4.10 or lower that might be a problem.
A big 28 inch tire with gear you up Quite a bit from a stock dia. tire
It may not be your problem, but it was mine.
KEn
Re: Help me get traction :) Have you tried flashing the converter off the line?
I keep my RR airbag @ 22 psi the car launches straight as an arrow and I cut 1.57-1.61 60's. And I am dumping the clutch @ 6500 <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
I would try the tire pressure @ 14-15psi. 9lbs might be causing the tire to cup which would cause you to lose alot of contact area on the tire. Do a good 8 second burnout, stage and let it rip!
Good luck!
I keep my RR airbag @ 22 psi the car launches straight as an arrow and I cut 1.57-1.61 60's. And I am dumping the clutch @ 6500 <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
I would try the tire pressure @ 14-15psi. 9lbs might be causing the tire to cup which would cause you to lose alot of contact area on the tire. Do a good 8 second burnout, stage and let it rip!
Good luck!
Thread Starter
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Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 10,341
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Re: Help me get traction :) That is VERY interesting about the compound!! I bet that plays a factor especially with the cooler track surface!!
I have 4.11 gears in the 12 bolt currently.
Thanks for that info!
Chris
I have 4.11 gears in the 12 bolt currently.
Thanks for that info!
Chris
Thread Starter
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Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 10,341
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Re: Help me get traction :) Dave,
Wade and I were talking about that at the track. I am going to screw the rims for next time I think. The tires are definitely rotating a little on the rim.
Cheers,
Chris
ps- I am able to stall my car pretty high on the line. (Around 3Krpm) is this normal with a TP4400 stall? I have awesome aftermarket brakes though that hold the car really well.
Cheers
Wade and I were talking about that at the track. I am going to screw the rims for next time I think. The tires are definitely rotating a little on the rim.
Cheers,
Chris
ps- I am able to stall my car pretty high on the line. (Around 3Krpm) is this normal with a TP4400 stall? I have awesome aftermarket brakes though that hold the car really well.
Cheers
TECH Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 9,246
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From: Troy, AL
Re: Help me get traction :) Next time I'd go with the 15" tire. That combined with LCA relocators should really help.
Have you moved the battery to the rear? I could definitely tell a difference when I did. <img border="0" alt="[Burnout]" title="" src="graemlins/burnout.gif" />
It's hard to get around bad/no track prep.
Have you moved the battery to the rear? I could definitely tell a difference when I did. <img border="0" alt="[Burnout]" title="" src="graemlins/burnout.gif" />
It's hard to get around bad/no track prep.
Thread Starter
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Re: Help me get traction :) Havent moved the battery yet but am seriously considering it.
I wonder if a 26x10 inch full Hoosier slick with the soft compound would hook better than the 28's I have now?
Maybe I will break down and grind the brakes so I can fit a 10 inch rim on the car... That way I can run a 26x10 inch slicks without worrying about ballooning the tire.
thanks,
Chris
I wonder if a 26x10 inch full Hoosier slick with the soft compound would hook better than the 28's I have now?
Maybe I will break down and grind the brakes so I can fit a 10 inch rim on the car... That way I can run a 26x10 inch slicks without worrying about ballooning the tire.
thanks,
Chris