First run at the track with the TR224
First run at the track with the TR224 Well I made it out to MMP this morning to try out the TR224/114 cam with stock heads. The weather was great. The DA was -1150’! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="gr_eek2.gif" />
To the point, I am not too happy with the results. My best 1/8 mile run of the day was a 7.34 @ 92.34 on a 1.57 60’. I backed that up with a 7.39 @ 92.12, and a 7.37 @ 92.63.
Just a FYI MMP is a ¼ mile track but today there was a 1/8 mile event being held.
My best 1/8 prior to this was a 7.44 @ 90.63 on a 1.59 60’. The DA on that day was -34’ and my race weight was about 100lbs lighter than today.
Overall I am not sure how much I really gained. By the clock I am about a 1/10 quicker and about 2 mph faster in the 1/8. Today my race weight (3463) was about 100lbs heavier but the DA was substantially better. I was hoping for low 7.2s in the 1/8. With the mods listed below I think that is reasonable or are my times on the mark? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />
98 Z28 A4 3.23
TR224 cam, LS6 intake, MAC headers, Yank PT4000 converter, cutout, FTRA, ET Streets, Convo Pro skinnies, and most of the bolt ons.
So is 7.34 @ 92.34 1/8 mile about right with my mods? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />
Thanks
John
To the point, I am not too happy with the results. My best 1/8 mile run of the day was a 7.34 @ 92.34 on a 1.57 60’. I backed that up with a 7.39 @ 92.12, and a 7.37 @ 92.63.
Just a FYI MMP is a ¼ mile track but today there was a 1/8 mile event being held.
My best 1/8 prior to this was a 7.44 @ 90.63 on a 1.59 60’. The DA on that day was -34’ and my race weight was about 100lbs lighter than today.
Overall I am not sure how much I really gained. By the clock I am about a 1/10 quicker and about 2 mph faster in the 1/8. Today my race weight (3463) was about 100lbs heavier but the DA was substantially better. I was hoping for low 7.2s in the 1/8. With the mods listed below I think that is reasonable or are my times on the mark? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />
98 Z28 A4 3.23
TR224 cam, LS6 intake, MAC headers, Yank PT4000 converter, cutout, FTRA, ET Streets, Convo Pro skinnies, and most of the bolt ons.
So is 7.34 @ 92.34 1/8 mile about right with my mods? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />
Thanks
John
Re: First run at the track with the TR224 </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by JNorris:
<strong> Just a FYI MMP is a ¼ mile track but today there was a 1/8 mile event being held.
So is 7.34 @ 92.34 1/8 mile about right with my mods? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />
Thanks
John </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Should have come up to Steele man, we had a great crowd! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
https://ls1tech.com/ubb/ultimatebb.p...;f=14;t=000454
More to answer your question, my 11.6 @ 119 pass last year had a 7.5 @ 94 1/8 mile time (1.771 60'). So I think your time from today isn't too shabby.
<strong> Just a FYI MMP is a ¼ mile track but today there was a 1/8 mile event being held.
So is 7.34 @ 92.34 1/8 mile about right with my mods? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />
Thanks
John </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Should have come up to Steele man, we had a great crowd! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
https://ls1tech.com/ubb/ultimatebb.p...;f=14;t=000454
More to answer your question, my 11.6 @ 119 pass last year had a 7.5 @ 94 1/8 mile time (1.771 60'). So I think your time from today isn't too shabby.
TECH Fanatic
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 1,055
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From: Baton Rouge, LA
Re: First run at the track with the TR224 A 7.34 is somewhere around an 11.5. You mph would have been high 115 low 116.
For comparisons sake, when I was running on drag radials and at a 3545 raceweight I ran a 1.53 7.18@94.50 11.34@118. The D/A on this raceday was about 1000 more than yours.
For a first time out your times look promising <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="gr_images/icons/cool.gif" />
I think you should put atleast 3.73's in the car to take advantage of the cam. Do you have an underdrive pulley on the car? A short belt?
Where were your shiftpoints? And lastly, what was your sixty foot?
For comparisons sake, when I was running on drag radials and at a 3545 raceweight I ran a 1.53 7.18@94.50 11.34@118. The D/A on this raceday was about 1000 more than yours.
For a first time out your times look promising <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="gr_images/icons/cool.gif" />
I think you should put atleast 3.73's in the car to take advantage of the cam. Do you have an underdrive pulley on the car? A short belt?
Where were your shiftpoints? And lastly, what was your sixty foot?
Re: First run at the track with the TR224 John,
I wanted to make the drive up to Steele but I needed to stick around Montgomery. I am glad you all had a good time. I hope I can make it the next time.
Mike,
I have an ASP underdrive crank pulley. I did not do the short belt mod. I just changed the tires and headed to the track. The only weight reduction in addition to the skinnies was the removal of the spare and jack.
I was shifting at 6400rpm.
My 60ft was 1.57.
What were your mods and race weight when you ran the 1.53 7.18 @ 94.50 11.34 @ 118?
“The D/A on this raceday was about 1000 more than yours.”
Was your DA -150 or -2150?
John
I wanted to make the drive up to Steele but I needed to stick around Montgomery. I am glad you all had a good time. I hope I can make it the next time.
Mike,
I have an ASP underdrive crank pulley. I did not do the short belt mod. I just changed the tires and headed to the track. The only weight reduction in addition to the skinnies was the removal of the spare and jack.
I was shifting at 6400rpm.
My 60ft was 1.57.
What were your mods and race weight when you ran the 1.53 7.18 @ 94.50 11.34 @ 118?
“The D/A on this raceday was about 1000 more than yours.”
Was your DA -150 or -2150?
John
TECH Fanatic
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 1,055
Likes: 0
From: Baton Rouge, LA
Re: First run at the track with the TR224 -150 was the D/A on that run.
That was the thunder race that had a 3500 raceweight minimum and dragradial limit for my class. That pass the car weighed 3545.
Futral 226 cam
Yank TP4400
4.10's
G-hanns, 2.5" y-pipe, borla.
My mods are linked in my sig. |
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V
That was the thunder race that had a 3500 raceweight minimum and dragradial limit for my class. That pass the car weighed 3545.
Futral 226 cam
Yank TP4400
4.10's
G-hanns, 2.5" y-pipe, borla.
My mods are linked in my sig. |
|
|
|
V
Re: First run at the track with the TR224 With 3.23s that is not bad at all for the first time out. The cam is starving for some 3.73s or 4.10s. If i had to do over again the gears i would go with would be 4.10s/26x10 ET Drag. That would give you more gear up top and not to much with the bigger ET Drags. 6400 rpms is about right infact i shift at 6450 with my B1 cam. Don't worry just get some gears and keep hammering on the car and it will all come into place. Do you have tuning yet?
Mike,looks like im finally getting the TP4400 and should have it in the car in the next month before the cooler weather is gone <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" /> Look out! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> Might be another LOW 11sec. cam only car soon <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
Mike,looks like im finally getting the TP4400 and should have it in the car in the next month before the cooler weather is gone <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" /> Look out! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> Might be another LOW 11sec. cam only car soon <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
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Re: First run at the track with the TR224 Thanks for the response.
I don’t understand about the cam needing gears. I understand that the gears will put you into a higher rpm quicker and hopefully into your power band quicker and if I can hook up a better 60 ft time. With the Yank PT4000 (which seems to act more like a PT4400) after I leave the line my RPMs hit about 5800 - 5900 and never drop below that for the entire run. With 3.73 gears the RPM would increase about 200 or so. Would that be enough to matter?
I have LS1 Edit and have been working on the tuning. The only changes I have made for far have been with the idle speed and shift points. The stock fuel and timing tuning seems to be working fine. See the Autotap run below.
Do you have any suggestions for tuning?
Link to AutoTap data
Thanks
John
I don’t understand about the cam needing gears. I understand that the gears will put you into a higher rpm quicker and hopefully into your power band quicker and if I can hook up a better 60 ft time. With the Yank PT4000 (which seems to act more like a PT4400) after I leave the line my RPMs hit about 5800 - 5900 and never drop below that for the entire run. With 3.73 gears the RPM would increase about 200 or so. Would that be enough to matter?
I have LS1 Edit and have been working on the tuning. The only changes I have made for far have been with the idle speed and shift points. The stock fuel and timing tuning seems to be working fine. See the Autotap run below.
Do you have any suggestions for tuning?
Link to AutoTap data
Thanks
John
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Verdad Gallardo Re: First run at the track with the TR224 Mike,
Thanks for the explanation of the gears and the feedback on the shift points. For the next run I bumped the 1-2 shift points up by 150 rpm and the shifts took place closer to 6400.
As far as the knock retard goes I wish I knew. I usually have little to no KR in 1st and 2nd gear however as soon as I hit 3rd I get 1-2 degrees of KR sometimes more. I have reduced and increased the timing up to 4 degrees from the stock settings and always get the same KR. It even does it on 103 octane unleaded.
Thanks
John
Thanks for the explanation of the gears and the feedback on the shift points. For the next run I bumped the 1-2 shift points up by 150 rpm and the shifts took place closer to 6400.
As far as the knock retard goes I wish I knew. I usually have little to no KR in 1st and 2nd gear however as soon as I hit 3rd I get 1-2 degrees of KR sometimes more. I have reduced and increased the timing up to 4 degrees from the stock settings and always get the same KR. It even does it on 103 octane unleaded.
Thanks
John
Re: First run at the track with the TR224 Like mike said with the added gearing the car will hit the power band sooner and will make third gear feel like your rolling down hill,that's how hard mine pulled from changing to 3.73s. I picked up .15tenth and 2MPH in the 1/4 with 3.73s over 3.42s and most all of the gains came in 3rd gear.
KR that your seeing is similar to what i see at times. Mine is in 3rd gear and will not see but 1-1.5 degrees of KR but i only see it for about 200rpms,is yours the same? I came to the conclusion that it COULD be from the valvetrain cause i never had KR when i was just bolt ons.
Looks like it might need to shift a tad higher like mike said. I would do it at the track and Atap then log it and go over it and see by looking at the ETs and compare them to what you have now. Your car looks to be about right on your o2 readings but you need a bit more timing. With my ed wright tuning i get an average of 28.5 drgrees of timing and sometimes get some in the 29 degree range,but the average is what you want and it looks to me like your average is about 27.3 or so.
KR that your seeing is similar to what i see at times. Mine is in 3rd gear and will not see but 1-1.5 degrees of KR but i only see it for about 200rpms,is yours the same? I came to the conclusion that it COULD be from the valvetrain cause i never had KR when i was just bolt ons.
Looks like it might need to shift a tad higher like mike said. I would do it at the track and Atap then log it and go over it and see by looking at the ETs and compare them to what you have now. Your car looks to be about right on your o2 readings but you need a bit more timing. With my ed wright tuning i get an average of 28.5 drgrees of timing and sometimes get some in the 29 degree range,but the average is what you want and it looks to me like your average is about 27.3 or so.
Re: First run at the track with the TR224 Scott,
Is your Camaro white?
What are you crossing the traps at with the 3.73 and what converter are you running?
The KR has always been there on my car. There does seem to be less since I added the cam and lifters. When the KR starts in 3rd gear it slowly ramps up to about 2 degrees or so and then tapers off to less than 1 degree. I will add a little more timing and see how it does.
Different subject –
My cold start ups are fine but I am having problems on the warm starts. Do you have any tips on how to improve warm starts? My car hunts for idle for about 1 min on warm starts and wants to die if I stab the gas from a stop and then let off real fast.
Thanks
John
Is your Camaro white?
What are you crossing the traps at with the 3.73 and what converter are you running?
The KR has always been there on my car. There does seem to be less since I added the cam and lifters. When the KR starts in 3rd gear it slowly ramps up to about 2 degrees or so and then tapers off to less than 1 degree. I will add a little more timing and see how it does.
Different subject –
My cold start ups are fine but I am having problems on the warm starts. Do you have any tips on how to improve warm starts? My car hunts for idle for about 1 min on warm starts and wants to die if I stab the gas from a stop and then let off real fast.
Thanks
John
Re: First run at the track with the TR224 J,my car is white <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> White cars are faster <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
Right now im running a Vigilante 3200 and the shift extentions SUCK lol with the 3.73s/3200 stall i drop all the way down to 4900-5000 and the car bogs then picks up around 5200rpms. The YTP4400 should wake my car up BIG time <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
Your warm start up has to do with tuning. Mine done it with stock tuning and after ed wright tuned it i idle like a stock car at 800rpms except for the thumping of the cam <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" /> . I think it might have something to do with your timing and LTtrims at idle but i dunno,prolly would not hurt to call Thunderracing and get some tips on that if your doing the LS1edit yourself.
Scott
Right now im running a Vigilante 3200 and the shift extentions SUCK lol with the 3.73s/3200 stall i drop all the way down to 4900-5000 and the car bogs then picks up around 5200rpms. The YTP4400 should wake my car up BIG time <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
Your warm start up has to do with tuning. Mine done it with stock tuning and after ed wright tuned it i idle like a stock car at 800rpms except for the thumping of the cam <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" /> . I think it might have something to do with your timing and LTtrims at idle but i dunno,prolly would not hurt to call Thunderracing and get some tips on that if your doing the LS1edit yourself.
Scott
Re: First run at the track with the TR224 Scott,
I was running a Vigilante 3200 before the cam and my best with it was an
11.961 @ 111.87 with a 1.62 60'. With the Yank PT4000 my best was an 11.774 @ 113.02 with a 1.59 60' I picked up .2 in the ¼ with just a converter swap. I am thinking about changing back to the Vigilante 3200. I am having a hard time dealing with the lack of drivability with the PT4000. You can not beat the drag racing performance of the Yank PT converters.
You are right white car are faster! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
Thanks for the help.
John
I was running a Vigilante 3200 before the cam and my best with it was an
11.961 @ 111.87 with a 1.62 60'. With the Yank PT4000 my best was an 11.774 @ 113.02 with a 1.59 60' I picked up .2 in the ¼ with just a converter swap. I am thinking about changing back to the Vigilante 3200. I am having a hard time dealing with the lack of drivability with the PT4000. You can not beat the drag racing performance of the Yank PT converters.
You are right white car are faster! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
Thanks for the help.
John
TECH Fanatic
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 1,055
Likes: 0
From: Baton Rouge, LA
Re: First run at the track with the TR224 If you have ls1 edit it couldnt hurt to raise shift points and try it. Looking at that autotap data I'd say you need to shift about 300 rpm higher. on the 1-2. I'd try to get the car to shift as high as possible on the 1-2. 2-3 looks good though. But again, it could hurt to try even higher.
More gear will put you in the power band sooner. Despite the awesome shift extenstion of the TP convertors your car needs to be higher in the rpms in third gear.
I imagine your car feels killer at the top of second gear, but you will be going through the traps too low to feel that in third. Plain and simple that's why I think you need more gear. Or atleast, thats why I felt I needed more gear.
StreetStalker documented his gains from 3.42's to 3.73's with his B1 cam, but I cant quite remember them. Scott?
I went 11.40's@117 first time out with my cam.
Then I dropped about 70 pounds (3280 raceweight from 3350), added 4.10's (from 3.42's) and 26X10's (from 26X8.5's) and went 11.16@119. Weather was probably 300 d/a better for the 11.16 run.
Also, what's with the knock? You might consider disabling your knock sensors.
More gear will put you in the power band sooner. Despite the awesome shift extenstion of the TP convertors your car needs to be higher in the rpms in third gear.
I imagine your car feels killer at the top of second gear, but you will be going through the traps too low to feel that in third. Plain and simple that's why I think you need more gear. Or atleast, thats why I felt I needed more gear.
StreetStalker documented his gains from 3.42's to 3.73's with his B1 cam, but I cant quite remember them. Scott?
I went 11.40's@117 first time out with my cam.
Then I dropped about 70 pounds (3280 raceweight from 3350), added 4.10's (from 3.42's) and 26X10's (from 26X8.5's) and went 11.16@119. Weather was probably 300 d/a better for the 11.16 run.
Also, what's with the knock? You might consider disabling your knock sensors.
Re: First run at the track with the TR224 Hey John, just get a vig3600 <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" /> HAHAHA... I didnt know how awesome your times were till I saw this post.. But with those 1/8th's and juding from your NA 1/4th before the cam swap I'd say you will be around 11.3-4's which is flying man! Im thinking about going from 3.23's to 3.73's also cause we would be getting in the power band ALOT sooner.. and you will find out running the 1/4th at the track... i cross the traps really low in my RPM's shifting at 6400 <img border="0" alt="[shoot]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_guns.gif" />
I woulda thought the 4000 stall would feel great on the street though. My 3600vig feels awesome and VERY streetable.
But I'd be very proud of those ET's for your first time out with the cam. Hell I may just leave 3.23's in the car for now since i dont know if a .15 is worth the change <img border="0" alt="[judgement]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_judge.gif" />
I woulda thought the 4000 stall would feel great on the street though. My 3600vig feels awesome and VERY streetable.
But I'd be very proud of those ET's for your first time out with the cam. Hell I may just leave 3.23's in the car for now since i dont know if a .15 is worth the change <img border="0" alt="[judgement]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_judge.gif" />
Re: First run at the track with the TR224 Thanks Harold. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" /> I am happy with the times but I was expecting more.
I am having some rear end problems (one wheel burn outs) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="gr_sad.gif" /> . I just bought a new carrier and when I change it out I might go with the 3.73s. I hate to go through the labor only to put the 3.23s back in there. If the 3.73s can give me a 1/10 in the ¼ then I will do it. It seems like they could. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />
John
I am having some rear end problems (one wheel burn outs) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="gr_sad.gif" /> . I just bought a new carrier and when I change it out I might go with the 3.73s. I hate to go through the labor only to put the 3.23s back in there. If the 3.73s can give me a 1/10 in the ¼ then I will do it. It seems like they could. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />
John
Re: First run at the track with the TR224 </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Mike Hoffpauir:
<strong> If it matters any more gear will make the convertor feel a little tighter driving around. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Took the words right out of my mouth lol The driveability of the TP4000 will be better with a lower gear ratio (3.73 or 4.10). It should feel about like the 3200 Vigil. i would think.
<strong> If it matters any more gear will make the convertor feel a little tighter driving around. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Took the words right out of my mouth lol The driveability of the TP4000 will be better with a lower gear ratio (3.73 or 4.10). It should feel about like the 3200 Vigil. i would think.