Ive got to ask this question... Are you sure your not talkin out ya ***?
The dyno graph you posted on the 28th of last month has way to many similiar traits ,in all aspects , as to your new dyno graph you posted on the 18th of this month...
If i was a betting man id say they are identical but with the hp and rpm moved up.... Id also have to think your full of S H I T.... 1 +1 = 2 and what im seeing just doesnt add up
If im wrong i apoligise but something smells
What gives it away to me is the exact same square edged dips in the afr but just moved up few 100 rpm

 

Believe it or not, using meth on top of E85 has shown 25-30whp gains on a few NA setups. One thing I wish I would have gone through with testing when I had my NA setup. These were 427ci, roughly 12:1 compression. Timing on e85 alone was near 26 degrees up top. Timing with the meth added was 24 degrees up top.

My vacuum pump setup lost 3hp on the dyno but it felt so much stronger on the street. Just the fact that we had to pull fuel out due to less load on the engine was proof enough that it was working.

 

You seem offended that he doesn't like Yella Terra. Do you work for them?

 

Talking out of my *** on what? What you see is what you get plain and simple I swapped springs, intake and rockers and thst is the before and after result what the hell do you want me to say? Why the hell would I waste my time posting lies?

 

 

I dont seem to recall mentioning Yella terra's..
Just comparing the dyno sheet posted on the 28th and the new dyno sheet , they look very very similiar , the afr has the exact same dips , except the rpm has moved up.
Thats what im seeing...
Seeing tho you mentioned yella terra, maybe you can answer how swapping to the crowers , using the same spring pressures, makes more hp even tho everyone else who have swapped to crowers have had to go up in spring pressures to stop float due to the extra weight of them.

 

The dyno graphs look very similiar to me.

 

What makes you think they should look very different?

 

I find it hard to believe that it's those rockers also.
I had a set of Yella Terra 1:8.1 on my old LS2 408 engine which had a mismatched valvetrain with valve float.
Once I upped the seat pressure the engine revved comfortably to 7500rpm without a hitch.
For yours to only go to 6400rpm originally something else was causing it, not the rockers.
Those shaft mounted rockers are heavier over the nose and require more spring to maintain the same valve control.
Without doing a spring change and then claiming to have no issues while blaming the rockers has me scratching my head.
If the yella terra rockers were causing float/power loss, the shaft mount rockers would make things worse using the same spring and pressures.
I'm not advocating that Yella Terra are the best here, it's just my interpretation of the information in this thread.

 

We can **** and moan all we want I have a set of yella terra rockers if any of you want to buy them. Got the car home today and it pulls so much harder than before. Springs swapped, rockers and Intake so you take your guess. Im not saying it was all the rockers or the rockers for 100% sure but I'll never run a yt rocker in any of my combos again. If I pursue the Frankenstein heads next year they will have jesel rockers.

It dont matter at all to me now cause I am 100% happy with how the car performs its unreal how much harder this pulls up top now. Its performing how a solid roller should. With a tad more cam it will still move that peak up.

End numbers on a mustang dyno (sae) were 607 rwhp 511 rwtq throgh a 6l80e.

 

Also I know a few guy running the same springs I have with the crowers Installed. Infact I bought the spring/rockers from a guy that had them specd for his trickflows but he sold the car and split up the top end package since I had the trickflow already i bought the springs and rockers.

 

Ill be sure to pm hpr and tell them to get those pac 1209 springs and crower rockers off. Lol

 

Of course your car would be pulling harder than before.
It's all working properly now by the looks of things.
But I doubt the rockers were the cause of limiting your rpm range to only 6400rpm.
There was definitely a mismatch somewhere.
Darth and Mick have the Yella terras on their ls7 setups and are making more power than you at nearly 700rwhp.
All the way to about 7500rpm without an issue.
Don't forget also that infamous Josh B thread the rockers were found to not have been the issue.
It was a spun bearing causing the power loss and wavy power curve.
Everyone is quick to blame the rockers when they are only 11gm heavier over the nose compared to the stock rocker.
They just require a bit more spring pressure and are good to go.

And yes take off those crower rockers and throw them in the bin. Lol





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Actually youre wrong his valve seats were trashed but nice try there bud. His bottom.end gave out on his new top end not when he was running the trickflow heads.


Darth is running a larger cam is manual and on a dynojet really big difference In dyno numbers alone. I bought this car with orginal dyno sheet from previous owner reading 545 rwhp on a dyno jet. I made 470 on my tuners mustang dyno. That's about how useless comparing dyno numbers from different dynos are.




​​​​​​also please explain to me where the mismatch was. From the time the car was making power to 6400 I only swapped 3 parts. And only 3.


My cam was specd for the original 427 not the 447 In the car. Tony wanted to go bigger at the time but I decided against it cause I didnt want to be stuck selling a solid roller at the time.

 

The bottom end was already gone while mamos gear was on, hence the lower power and wavy power curve.
He puts the all pro set up on and then notices low oil pressure when started.
Then the engine gets pulled apart for an inspection.
This is when it's discovered it's a spun main bearing.
It's all documented in the thread.
You have it backwards.
By your own admission you say it's the bottom end that went out so that means it's not the damn rockers!
How can the top end cause the bottom end to spin a bearing?
I would say the likely cause is high rpm.
He was shifting at 8000 and with his piston speed close to 6000fpm, it was only a matter of time something would give.
Lol

 

I never said the top end would make the bottom end spin a bearing. But his valve seats were trashed which you did fail to mention. Even when josh got the 454 completely done he never made power over 6900 rpm no matter what intake he tried.

No one will ever know the for a fact when he spun a bearing even josh said he could have hurt it in a 1/2 or on the dyno that day or maybe even at start up. I'll read into that thread later or ask josh myself even tho he dont care to talk about it.

Either way you want to toss the dice I still made more power this time around than any time before. Even if you claim these rockers are miss matched to the spring I still make more power.


Your dyno comparison above was pretty damn pointless too that's like comparing apples to watermelons. Your comparing a manual with a 9 inch and gears which does eat up power with a larger cam to a 6l80e which the 80 is a big time power robber on a mustang dyno (sae) you really cant get much lower than that for dyno numbers. Let me throw a manual in on his dyno jet then I'll come back and brag. NOT

I'd put money on it if you swapped my engine or his engine in my car it would be more that a 20 rwhp difference.

 

I love it how you keep coming back at me. lol

Read between the lines.
If that's your take with our friend Josh, you are not understanding what really happened here.
I know you made more power this time around!

I wasn't making a point about the power.
I just mentioned it.
It's the RPM I was referencing to, to counter your claim.
It still doesn't make sense why your engine would not rev past 6400RPM.

You have not given a believable explanation yet.
I just hope you have not been lied to by someone who has a vendetta against these rockers.
And they have you on board the hate train.

 

My tuner installed these straight from mamo himself he has no vendetta and is one of the most honest guys you would ever meet. He didnt even know mamo when I mentioned I bought a package from him my tuner/installer has been in the business since early 2000s I'm sure he knew what he was doing. I have not one single thing againt mamo either I would have him port something any day of the week given the chance. Mine and Josh's rickers were the earlier version and we both had issue with them. Josh had pics on his thread with the issues but I can't seem to find them they may be deleted or in one of the 2000 post. But from my understanding there was a redesign. I'm going to do some thread searching tonight.

What are your thoughts then why do you think it stopped making power at 6400?

You said Josh's bottom end lost oil pressure way before his start up with his new build so your saying it happened with the trickflows on the car. So if that is the case how come he never stated a oil pressure issue on the dyno? I would sure think that would be a time something like that would be noticed after doing some 7k plus pulls then leaving the car to idle while monitoring everything.

 

First of all, the rockers were not the issue on Josh's car.
Don't forget when Josh first had his car together with mamo's top end the combo was running extremely strong at 700rwhp and making good power to 7500rpm or so.
It was one of my favourite threads I have read.
If the rockers were an issue, this would have showed up back then.
Then as you know Josh, went around to other shops and they started blaming the rockers and convinced him that was the issue.
Then Tony and Josh had a falling out obviously as evidenced in the thread.
The claim was valve float when the dyno sheet proved otherwise.
Then the top end was taken off and the all pro top end was slowly installed.
Remember the oil pressure issue had to be have been there but it was never mentioned.
If it was, it would make him look like silly because this would reveal the real cause of the low power reading.
So of course it would be kept quiet and then mentioned later.
I think he knows this now and has kept quiet but it's fine.
As I said before, the piston speed when shifting at 8000rpm in a 454 would be so high, something will give which it did.

This is why I am not convinced it's the rockers especially when the crowers are heavier over the nose.

It could be a variety of factors why you had issues at 6400rpm.
Not enough spring pressure, may even be something computer related who knows.
I can't say just thinking about it.
I had yella terras for 10 years without an issue and I was making good power with them till I sold them to someone else when I went back to a cathedral setup.
I now have yella terras on those too.

 

What ever you need to convince yourself to sleep better at night so be it as stated before the springs were part of mamo package so there's that. And if they were wrong the package should have been tested out instead of me being the test mule. Im sure there are other guys other there with the same cam but I haven't seen it anywhere would be nice to see there results. I even said above you can buy these yella terra if you want. I'll let josh speak for himself neither one of us were there and he maybe lying but I wont accuse him of that cause hes been a wealth of knowledge.

I think Frankenstein really does a great job on the packages they put together with the 710s they are achievi results in the mid to high 700s and they dont use yella terra so that tells me something.