None taken man..........I'd rather see an Fbod win against an ignorant (or arrogant) tool than see some stang guy bread ignorance.

IE: I want you to beat this guy.

 

A I was under the misconception that even though the computer is telling the car to do one thing it will take awhile for the car to get used to doing it. If that makes any sense.

 

I think that you take this due to weight and power; specifically torque.

I haven't seen a Roush Convert at the track but the 4.6 3 valve is no torque monster and unless he has gears I don't see him moving out on you too badly even with sticky tires.

The mods you listed plus a mail order tune should seal the deal. Practice launching and getthing through the gears cleanly and you should win.

 

I like ion, madz28.com.

Sounds like your mail order tune sucks then. They are either there, or they aren't.

 

I think the car runs great personally and pulled a solid number at the track with only one run that I got in.

 

And until you do some datalogging and or dyno runs to possibly get a custom tune, you'll never know.

BTW - 108 TS is what a stock LS does. No?

 

That is incorrect.

MINOR bolt ons are ok....as in catback and LID (for you guys) and maybe a Y pipe or a couple of other minor things.....any more than that, the OBDII based EEC can't adjust outside of that. THe factory computer can only adjust so much...it's actually quite limited pending the amount of mods (airflow mods really) that it can account for.

 

I am not even going to attempt to sound intelligent on this matter. I know next to nothing about tuning...other than it is a must for any serious driver. I have a '94 so it is OBd1; is data logging still available for me? If so, where do I go to have this done or what do I have to buy? I want to get the best tune I can for my money; $125 for a mail order tune sounds reasonable, but I have no idea how much money it would take to get it dyno tuned.

 

Dyno tunes can range from $300-600. Most shops around here are $500. It will give you better results for sure, but may not be worth it until you put in a cam. IMO go to a Lt1 specialty shop and get a mail order tune from the shop and then later on when money allows or you go cam/nitrous/boost you can go back and get a dyno tune from the same place. They will probably put your money for the previous tune towards your dyno tune.

 

dude...please, stop talking about tuning. It's obvious you are not familiar with it.
won't be worth a tune unless getting a cam?.....seriously SHOOOSH!!!.

BruceA - trust me....find a shop that is familiar with the older EEC setups, GM primarily. Ask around to guys that you know, or do a post in the LT section. A mail order may or may not be ok.....which, IIRC, you'll need a chip burnt not a handheld for the pre-96 setups.

 

Look if you had to choose between a tune and a shifter due to money right now, invest in the shifter. I've missed one upshift in 4 years since I got my aftermarket shifter, the stocker is so vague I missed a bunch of shifts while just on the test drive before I bought the car. Shifter was the very first mod I did to my car. I'm telling you just for exhaust and CAI the mail order tune won't be worth it if you try to shift fast with that stock shifter. I opted for a SLP short throw with a TNA short stick. So if its a money issue due to spending budget, get a good shifter instead of a mail order tune.

Don't forget, I put down 302rwhp/321 torque untuned with shorty headers. Car is rich from the factory, you'll be alright without a tune for now.

ponygt65, the 93 cars need a chip burnt, 94+ ecu can be reprogrammed. So yeah one year of the 4th gens get to deal with that bullshit.

 

'96 is the cut off for OBDII cars though. (first year).

I disagree with the 'you'll be ok because they are rich'. All cars are 'rich from the factory. I think we can all agree on that. But all cars are different and will respond differently to mods. No one (me, you joe blow down teh street) can say with any certainty that the car will ahve a safe A/F at WOT without doing some dyno pulls and checking.

 

First of all I did not say "a tune wouldn't be worth it unless getting a cam". I said a dyno tune "may not" be worth it until a more drastic change to the motor is made such as cam/nitrous/boost application. Sorry I didn't make that more clear for you. At least that is the consensus on this board. Check out this link, one of many.

https://ls1tech.com/forums/generatio...s-install.html


Second. I know a dyno tune is better than mail order/ computer tune and I stated that in an earlier post. There are many respectable tuners for lt1/ls1's on this board that can give you a very good base tune without even having to see your car. Why pay $300+++ on a dyno tune when you will just need a retune in the future after going internal or a power added. I don't think many f-body owners today can afford double tuning costs when the average age is around low 20's.

1993- Burnable Chip (i.e. Bastard Year)
1994-1995 Flashable PCM via ODB1 based software
1996-1997 Flashable PCM via ODB2 based software

A simple search could have of given you the answer without questioning an actual lt1 owner. I can tell by the threads you have started that do really need to begin using the search feature of this website, instead of just asking the members on the forum do the work for you.

 

Yeah I did only get a dynotune yesterday. If he thinks he should be worried about the A/F with just bolt ons/exhaust then I'd say a good 60%+ of this forum should be sweating bullets I guess......... There are a ton of intake/exhaust cars on here that aren't tuned at all. I suppose the OP could get some pulls done to make sure he isn't going too lean, just to see where it is at. I understand that not all of them respond the same, but I don't think I was just lucky beating on the car with the stock motor for 4 years. That just doesn't make any sense. Damn motor had 165k on it when I pulled it, still running strong.

 

yeah a dyno tune is more ideal but not needed at his mod level. What did you gain from the tune???

 

I did some reading and I was thinking if I could find a place to give me a cheap dyno run (no tuning) an then based on how the car is running get it tuned(computer/datalogger/mailorder) and after wards make another dyno run and make sure everything is cool. However, I am pretty sure that after I spend the money on dyno runs and a good mail order, I will be close to the price of a mediocre dyno tune and should just do that. I really wouldn't ever think that a dyno tune is necessary at this point. Once I get some money for a rear end, I also plan on adding 125-150 shot of nitrous, a cam and maybe heads and forged internals(depending on how much money I have). Some people say that it is not wise to extensively mod your daily driver; still, I want to get from point A to point B fast when I want to. I don't plan to spray often, but this was a big downgrade from my original noob plan of an 800 + HP turbo LT1 daily driver...don't laugh hahaheheha.

 

WOW...great.
1) you stated may not be worth it without a cam. I disagreed. Not sure why you're confused on that.
2) that link provides MOSTLY simple opinion of members saying "nope you dont' need it". It is ALSO mentioned in there that the LT's could throw off hte A/F which is the point. NO ONE knows what the OP's A/F will be like without strapping it down and running it. Not only that, why not get the timing and A/F adj. while there for more power...OH WAIT, that WAS mentioned in that link you provided...a member picked up 20/30 power with a tune with mods similar to the OP's...fancy that one. Thanks for proving me right with that link.


How do you know that mail order tune is good for the OP's car without datalogging? Again, not all car's are the same. Did I say it was most economical to do it? NO. I said it was the safest/smartest thing to do.

Maybe pushrod tuning is just THAT much different than modular tuning.



A simple re-read WTF I told corey would have been good too ya know. I SIMPLY asked if he was sure because of the ODB2 software in the 96 year. THAT's IT!. Don't sit there and tell me I need to do a freaking search and not to second guess members and make them do the freakin work. You obviously dont' know me (even on other boards) for you to make a blinding statement like that.

It's obvious what happened here. You made the commetn that a mail order is fine or maybe not even that and I disagreed for everyone to see it and you got pissy.

SIMPLE BASIC FACT: NO ONE knows if the stock tune or mail order tune will suffice for the OP's new mods. To tell him other wise or to insist that those two tunes will be fine is absolute ignorance because no one knows without checking.
Just because those cars are not tuned, doesnt' mean they are safe. YOu know how many cars I seen fry their motors because they were lean and assumed the tune was fine?....probably more than you've owned. GREAT.....YOUR car was rich enough and was not affected enough....or what have you. Doesn't mean all cars will. I've seen exact same cars dyno'd with exact mods come up with different A/F ratio's. Doesnt' mean SQUAT without double checking.

Again......my experience is with Modulars. Maybe the affects on pushrods are that much different. And if that's the case................I deeply apologize and will not mention anything abotu tuning on this board again.

see above.


Maybe you two and I should just agree to disagree and let the OP do as he wishes.

At the least Bruce, I'd pay for dyno runs after your mail tune to ensure the A/F is on par. BTW - it's not just the 'peak A/F'....it's the curve of it too. It affects the power.

 

I did not get "pissy" when you disagreed with me. I was upset when you replied saying something like don't post anymore about tuning you don't know what your talking about. Obviously I'm no tuner, I was just giving my opinion in the topic. If the OP wants to take it then he can, if not I could care less. I wouldn't have gone out of my way if I hadn't felt like you were making the rude comments and adding in the confusing face, acting like corey was wrong.

I'm sure there many differences between both modular and pushrod tuning, but not enough to completely disregard your opinion. The thread should be about helping the OP beating some cocky 3v's ***, not bashing each other on how much they know about tuning. I guess we will have to agree to disagree. I was just going by how most feel on this board.

On the other note, the person that gained 20/30 from the dyno, had no previous mail order tune done. That was from the stock tune. I bet if he had a computer tune before hand those gains would probably be cut in half.

 

OK...I'll agree, I was a tad rude on that comment. For that, I apologize.

I also hope he beats this cocky guys *** and you're right that we went way off topic.

 

You guys were like two angry parents arguing about the best way to raise a kid, except my car was the kid and the raising= tuning. Still, I was always hoping and praying you two could could work it out and have that great makeup sex!! Just Kidding guys. I really do appreciate all of you guys help and your bickering forced me to do some more research of my own and it is always good to be educated. I am not sure exactly what I will do yet...A dyno tune is definitely safer and I have high miles, but I hate to spend that kind of money now only to add a cam and maybe heads in the future or nitrous and have to do it again.Pure morning~ Of course I would hate more to blow something up and have to spend mega money....I will do my best to beat this guy! My dad is up from Miami and he drives manual very well and may be able to teach me a few things. I got the headers today and I will PM you guys or update the thread on the outcome of the race. UMI has a very tempting sale"20% off" so I may add some suspension parts to my list. I am still yearning to hear more so feel free to tell me whatever...I know I will be really nervous before the race because the steaks are so high....get it? Steaks...winner gets a free steak dinner...You know it was witty!