.50 cals banned in NJ!
03-07-2007, 03:26 PM
#141
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Originally Posted by MrDude_1
mmk... now if you have the free time, could you read (or atleast skim over) both of these?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberal
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialist
totally diffrent thinking... i just get annoyed by it, because one side always accuses the other of being a "no good damn liberal"... :lmao:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberal
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialist
totally diffrent thinking... i just get annoyed by it, because one side always accuses the other of being a "no good damn liberal"... :lmao:
Someone else explained conservatism as "conservative in control of the people" in otherwords, less government, less activisim, less interference, conservative in the use and abuse of power.
Unfortunately, today, too many liberals meld too much socialistic agendas into their platforms, and that...is not disputable. I'm speaking in modern day terms when I refer to liberals...obviously, you want to do such in terms of the birth of the country.
03-07-2007, 03:30 PM
#142
Originally Posted by sb427f-car
I'm not reading "wiki" for my highly coveted and "controversial" information...try again.
Someone else explained conservatism as "conservative in control of the people" in otherwords, less government, less activisim, less interference, conservative in the use and abuse of power.
Unfortunately, today, too many liberals meld too much socialistic agendas into their platforms, and that...is not disputable.
Someone else explained conservatism as "conservative in control of the people" in otherwords, less government, less activisim, less interference, conservative in the use and abuse of power.
Unfortunately, today, too many liberals meld too much socialistic agendas into their platforms, and that...is not disputable.
in anycase, i just found it wierd how contradictory everything is... one of the reasons i hate politics.
i also get pissed every time i pickup a newspaper, or see the news... blatant manipulation of statistics is a pet peeve... along with opinions stated as facts...ect... its just all.... wrong. and i dont want to be a part of it.
03-07-2007, 03:32 PM
#143
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Originally Posted by MrDude_1
but by very definition, when they do that, they're nolonger true liberals...
in anycase, i just found it wierd how contradictory everything is... one of the reasons i hate politics.
i also get pissed every time i pickup a newspaper, or see the news... blatant manipulation of statistics is a pet peeve... along with opinions stated as facts...ect... its just all.... wrong. and i dont want to be a part of it.
in anycase, i just found it wierd how contradictory everything is... one of the reasons i hate politics.
i also get pissed every time i pickup a newspaper, or see the news... blatant manipulation of statistics is a pet peeve... along with opinions stated as facts...ect... its just all.... wrong. and i dont want to be a part of it.
Then...why are you in this thread?
03-07-2007, 03:42 PM
#144
Originally Posted by sb427f-car
Then...why are you in this thread?
and because im not working on my car... but im bored at work... so i dont really want to read car stuff, but this site is still on my usual rounds of forums to check......
but mostly, i was hoping someone in the general area would say something like "i have one, im going shooting with it next weekend".. then i could go... "where? i gotta see this!" and then talk them into letting me shoot $12 in rounds.. ( you know, 2 or 3 bullets..)
03-07-2007, 03:45 PM
#145
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Originally Posted by MrDude_1
initally i opened it because i think the idea of a .50 cal gun is cool.
and because im not working on my car... but im bored at work... so i dont really want to read car stuff, but this site is still on my usual rounds of forums to check......
but mostly, i was hoping someone in the general area would say something like "i have one, im going shooting with it next weekend".. then i could go... "where? i gotta see this!" and then talk them into letting me shoot $12 in rounds.. ( you know, 2 or 3 bullets..)
and because im not working on my car... but im bored at work... so i dont really want to read car stuff, but this site is still on my usual rounds of forums to check......
but mostly, i was hoping someone in the general area would say something like "i have one, im going shooting with it next weekend".. then i could go... "where? i gotta see this!" and then talk them into letting me shoot $12 in rounds.. ( you know, 2 or 3 bullets..)
Definately NOT the thread to get into, lol
if you are abvilant to politics.Interesting thoughts...
An interesting letter in the Australian Shooter Magazine, quote:
"If you consider that there has been an average of 160,000 troops in the
Iraq theatre of operations during the past 22 months, and a total of 2112
deaths, that gives a firearm death rate of 60 per 100,000 soldiers.
The firearm death rate in Washington DC is 80.6 per 100,000 for the same
period. That means you are about 25 percent more likely to be shot and
killed in the US capital, which has some of the strictest gun control laws
in the US, than you are in Iraq.
Conclusion? "The U.S. should pull out of Washington DC".
03-07-2007, 03:52 PM
#146
Originally Posted by sb427f-car
Well...there ya go...
Definately NOT the thread to get into, lol if you are abvilant to politics.
Interesting thoughts...
An interesting letter in the Australian Shooter Magazine, quote:
"If you consider that there has been an average of 160,000 troops in the
Iraq theatre of operations during the past 22 months, and a total of 2112
deaths, that gives a firearm death rate of 60 per 100,000 soldiers.
The firearm death rate in Washington DC is 80.6 per 100,000 for the same
period. That means you are about 25 percent more likely to be shot and
killed in the US capital, which has some of the strictest gun control laws
in the US, than you are in Iraq.
Conclusion? "The U.S. should pull out of Washington DC".
Definately NOT the thread to get into, lol
if you are abvilant to politics.Interesting thoughts...
An interesting letter in the Australian Shooter Magazine, quote:
"If you consider that there has been an average of 160,000 troops in the
Iraq theatre of operations during the past 22 months, and a total of 2112
deaths, that gives a firearm death rate of 60 per 100,000 soldiers.
The firearm death rate in Washington DC is 80.6 per 100,000 for the same
period. That means you are about 25 percent more likely to be shot and
killed in the US capital, which has some of the strictest gun control laws
in the US, than you are in Iraq.
Conclusion? "The U.S. should pull out of Washington DC".
lol, yea, someone posted that exact same thing on another forum i frequent (also a car forum)....... but didnt site the same source.
in anycase, im about to go do something thats far more lethal then anything else mentioned in this thread... im going to leave work, and drive in traffic.....
03-07-2007, 03:54 PM
#147
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Originally Posted by MrDude_1
lol, yea, someone posted that exact same thing on another forum i frequent (also a car forum)....... but didnt site the same source.
in anycase, im about to go do something thats far more lethal then anything else mentioned in this thread... im going to leave work, and drive in traffic.....
in anycase, im about to go do something thats far more lethal then anything else mentioned in this thread... im going to leave work, and drive in traffic.....
I'll probably get ripped for where this is posted...BUT...
It's all with BATFE statistics.
http://www.nraila.org/Issues/FactShe...ad.aspx?ID=126
Guns, Gun Ownership, & RTC at All-Time Highs, Less "Gun Control," and Violent Crime at 30-Year Low
Guns.
The number of privately owned guns in the U.S. is at an all-time high. The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (BATFE) estimates that there were about 215 million guns in 1999,1 when the number of new guns was averaging about 4.5 million (about 2%) annually.2 A report for the National Academy of Sciences put the 1999 figure at 258 million.3 According to the Bureau of Justice Statistics, there were 60.4 million approved (new and used) NICS firearm transactions between 1994 2004.4 The number of NICS checks for firearm purchases or permits increased 3.2% between 2003-2004.
Gun Owners.
The number of gun owners is also at an all-time high. The U.S. population is at an all-time high (294 million), and rises about 1% annually.5 Numerous surveys over the last 40+ years have found that almost half of all households have at least one gun owner.6 Some surveys since the late 1990s have indicated a smaller incidence of gun ownership,7 probably because of some respondents` concerns about "gun control," residually due, perhaps, to the anti-gun policies of the Clinton Administration.
Right-to-Carry.
The number of RTC states is at an all-time high, up from 10 in 1987 to 38 today.8 In 2004, states with RTC laws, compared to other states, had lower violent crime rates on average. Total violent crime was lower by 21%, murder by 28%, robbery by 43%, and aggravated assault by 13%.9
"Less Gun Control."
Violent crime has declined while many "gun control" laws have been eliminated or made less restrictive. Many states have eliminated prohibitory or restrictive carry laws, in favor of Right-to-Carry laws. The federal Brady Act`s waiting period on handgun sales ended in 1998, in favor of the NRA-supported National Instant Check, and some states thereafter eliminated waiting periods, purchase permit requirements, or other laws delaying gun sales. The federal "assault weapon" ban expired in 2004. All states now have hunter protection laws, 46 have range protection laws, 46 prohibit local jurisdictions from imposing gun laws more restrictive than state law, 44 protect the right to arms in their constitutions, and 33 prohibit frivolous lawsuits against the firearm industry.10
Studies by and for Congress, the Congressional Research Service, the Library of Congress, the National Institute of Justice, the National Academy of Sciences, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, and even researchers who support "gun control," have found no evidence that "gun control" reduces crime.11
Crime.
The FBI reports that the nation`s total violent crime rate declined every year between 1991 2004.12 In 2004, the violent crime rate fell to a 30-year low, lower than any time since 1974. The murder rate fell to a 39-year low, lower than any time since 1965. The 2004 robbery and aggravated assault rates were lower than any time since 1968 and 1984, respectively. Since 1991, total violent crime has decreased 39%; murder and non-negligent manslaughter, 44%; rape, 24%; robbery, 50%; and aggravated assault, 33%.13 Between 2003-2004, the violent crime rate declined 2.2%.14 Concurrently, the most recent Bureau of Justice Statistics crime victimization survey found that violent crime is lower than anytime since 1973, when the first such survey was conducted.15
Notes
1. BATF, "Crime Gun Trace Reports (1999) National Report," Nov. 2000, p. ix (www.atf.gov/firearms/ycgii/1999/index.htm).
2. BATF, "Firearms Commerce in the United States 2001/2002" (www.atf.gov/pub/index.htm#Firearms).
3. National Research Council, Firearms and Violence: A Critical Review, National Academies Press, 2005.
4. BJS, "Background Checks for Firearm Transfers, 2004" (http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov./bjs/pub/pdf/bcft04.pdf).
5. Bureau of the Census (http://www.census.gov/popest/states/NST-ann-est.html).
6. Gary Kleck, Targeting Firearms, Aldine de Gruyter, 1997, pp. 94, 98-100.
7. E.g., BJS Sourcebook of Criminal Justice Statistics 2002, Table 2.58, (www.albany.edu/sourcebook/).
8. See NRA RTC fact sheet (within www.nraila.org/Issues/Filter.aspx?ID=003).
9. See FBI, Crime in the United States 2004 (http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/ucr.htm#cius) for state crime statistics.
10. See NRA-ILA Compendium of State Firearms Laws (www.nraila.org/media/misc/compendium.htm). Also, note that in October 2005, federal legislation prohibiting such lawsuits was signed into law.
11. Federal "assault weapon" ban: Roth, Koper, et al., Impact Evaluation of the Public Safety and Recreational Firearms Use Protection Act of 1994, March 13, 1997 (www.urban.org/url.cfm?ID=406797); Reedy and Koper, "Impact of handgun types on gun assault outcomes: a comparison of gun assaults involving semiautomatic pistols and revolvers," Injury Prevention 2003, (http://ip.bmjjournals.com/cgi/reprint/9/2/151); Koper et al., Report to the National Institute of Justice, An Updated Assessment of the Federal Assault Weapons Ban: Impacts on Gun Markets and Gun Violence, 1994-2003, June 2004 (http://www.sas.upenn.edu/jerrylee/jl...aw_final.pdf); Wm. J. Krouse, Congressional Research Service Report for Congress, "Semiautomatic Assault Weapons Ban," Dec. 16, 2004. "Gun control," generally: Library of Congress, Report for Congress: Firearms Regulations in Various Foreign Countries, May 1998, LL98-3, 97-2010; Task Force on Community Preventive Service, "First Reports Evaluating the Effectiveness of Strategies for Preventing Violence: Firearms Laws," Morbidity and Mortaility Weekly Report, Oct. 3, 2003 (www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/rr5214a2.htm); National Research Council, Firearms and Violence: A Critical Review, National Academies Press, 2005 (http://books.nap.edu/books/0309091241/html/index.html).
12. Note 9 and BJS (http://bjsdata.ojp.usdoj.gov/dataonline/). See also FBI (http://www.fbi.gov/pressrel/pressrel...tat101705.htm).
13. Note 10. Condensed at www.nraila.org, click on "Research," then "Crime Statistics."
14. Note 12.
15. BJS (http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov./bjs/pub/press/cv04pr.htm).
Guns.
The number of privately owned guns in the U.S. is at an all-time high. The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (BATFE) estimates that there were about 215 million guns in 1999,1 when the number of new guns was averaging about 4.5 million (about 2%) annually.2 A report for the National Academy of Sciences put the 1999 figure at 258 million.3 According to the Bureau of Justice Statistics, there were 60.4 million approved (new and used) NICS firearm transactions between 1994 2004.4 The number of NICS checks for firearm purchases or permits increased 3.2% between 2003-2004.
Gun Owners.
The number of gun owners is also at an all-time high. The U.S. population is at an all-time high (294 million), and rises about 1% annually.5 Numerous surveys over the last 40+ years have found that almost half of all households have at least one gun owner.6 Some surveys since the late 1990s have indicated a smaller incidence of gun ownership,7 probably because of some respondents` concerns about "gun control," residually due, perhaps, to the anti-gun policies of the Clinton Administration.
Right-to-Carry.
The number of RTC states is at an all-time high, up from 10 in 1987 to 38 today.8 In 2004, states with RTC laws, compared to other states, had lower violent crime rates on average. Total violent crime was lower by 21%, murder by 28%, robbery by 43%, and aggravated assault by 13%.9
"Less Gun Control."
Violent crime has declined while many "gun control" laws have been eliminated or made less restrictive. Many states have eliminated prohibitory or restrictive carry laws, in favor of Right-to-Carry laws. The federal Brady Act`s waiting period on handgun sales ended in 1998, in favor of the NRA-supported National Instant Check, and some states thereafter eliminated waiting periods, purchase permit requirements, or other laws delaying gun sales. The federal "assault weapon" ban expired in 2004. All states now have hunter protection laws, 46 have range protection laws, 46 prohibit local jurisdictions from imposing gun laws more restrictive than state law, 44 protect the right to arms in their constitutions, and 33 prohibit frivolous lawsuits against the firearm industry.10
Studies by and for Congress, the Congressional Research Service, the Library of Congress, the National Institute of Justice, the National Academy of Sciences, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, and even researchers who support "gun control," have found no evidence that "gun control" reduces crime.11
Crime.
The FBI reports that the nation`s total violent crime rate declined every year between 1991 2004.12 In 2004, the violent crime rate fell to a 30-year low, lower than any time since 1974. The murder rate fell to a 39-year low, lower than any time since 1965. The 2004 robbery and aggravated assault rates were lower than any time since 1968 and 1984, respectively. Since 1991, total violent crime has decreased 39%; murder and non-negligent manslaughter, 44%; rape, 24%; robbery, 50%; and aggravated assault, 33%.13 Between 2003-2004, the violent crime rate declined 2.2%.14 Concurrently, the most recent Bureau of Justice Statistics crime victimization survey found that violent crime is lower than anytime since 1973, when the first such survey was conducted.15
Notes
1. BATF, "Crime Gun Trace Reports (1999) National Report," Nov. 2000, p. ix (www.atf.gov/firearms/ycgii/1999/index.htm).
2. BATF, "Firearms Commerce in the United States 2001/2002" (www.atf.gov/pub/index.htm#Firearms).
3. National Research Council, Firearms and Violence: A Critical Review, National Academies Press, 2005.
4. BJS, "Background Checks for Firearm Transfers, 2004" (http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov./bjs/pub/pdf/bcft04.pdf).
5. Bureau of the Census (http://www.census.gov/popest/states/NST-ann-est.html).
6. Gary Kleck, Targeting Firearms, Aldine de Gruyter, 1997, pp. 94, 98-100.
7. E.g., BJS Sourcebook of Criminal Justice Statistics 2002, Table 2.58, (www.albany.edu/sourcebook/).
8. See NRA RTC fact sheet (within www.nraila.org/Issues/Filter.aspx?ID=003).
9. See FBI, Crime in the United States 2004 (http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/ucr.htm#cius) for state crime statistics.
10. See NRA-ILA Compendium of State Firearms Laws (www.nraila.org/media/misc/compendium.htm). Also, note that in October 2005, federal legislation prohibiting such lawsuits was signed into law.
11. Federal "assault weapon" ban: Roth, Koper, et al., Impact Evaluation of the Public Safety and Recreational Firearms Use Protection Act of 1994, March 13, 1997 (www.urban.org/url.cfm?ID=406797); Reedy and Koper, "Impact of handgun types on gun assault outcomes: a comparison of gun assaults involving semiautomatic pistols and revolvers," Injury Prevention 2003, (http://ip.bmjjournals.com/cgi/reprint/9/2/151); Koper et al., Report to the National Institute of Justice, An Updated Assessment of the Federal Assault Weapons Ban: Impacts on Gun Markets and Gun Violence, 1994-2003, June 2004 (http://www.sas.upenn.edu/jerrylee/jl...aw_final.pdf); Wm. J. Krouse, Congressional Research Service Report for Congress, "Semiautomatic Assault Weapons Ban," Dec. 16, 2004. "Gun control," generally: Library of Congress, Report for Congress: Firearms Regulations in Various Foreign Countries, May 1998, LL98-3, 97-2010; Task Force on Community Preventive Service, "First Reports Evaluating the Effectiveness of Strategies for Preventing Violence: Firearms Laws," Morbidity and Mortaility Weekly Report, Oct. 3, 2003 (www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/rr5214a2.htm); National Research Council, Firearms and Violence: A Critical Review, National Academies Press, 2005 (http://books.nap.edu/books/0309091241/html/index.html).
12. Note 9 and BJS (http://bjsdata.ojp.usdoj.gov/dataonline/). See also FBI (http://www.fbi.gov/pressrel/pressrel...tat101705.htm).
13. Note 10. Condensed at www.nraila.org, click on "Research," then "Crime Statistics."
14. Note 12.
15. BJS (http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov./bjs/pub/press/cv04pr.htm).
03-07-2007, 04:02 PM
#148
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Originally Posted by Quick1998Z28
in the 20s and 30s, gangsters went into their hardware store and bought them, 100% legal, but there was no paperwork or anything. The paperwork came in the 60s
03-07-2007, 05:01 PM
#149
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Originally Posted by sb427f-car
Well...there ya go...
Definately NOT the thread to get into, lol if you are abvilant to politics.
Interesting thoughts...
An interesting letter in the Australian Shooter Magazine, quote:
"If you consider that there has been an average of 160,000 troops in the
Iraq theatre of operations during the past 22 months, and a total of 2112
deaths, that gives a firearm death rate of 60 per 100,000 soldiers.
The firearm death rate in Washington DC is 80.6 per 100,000 for the same
period. That means you are about 25 percent more likely to be shot and
killed in the US capital, which has some of the strictest gun control laws
in the US, than you are in Iraq.
Conclusion? "The U.S. should pull out of Washington DC".
Definately NOT the thread to get into, lol
if you are abvilant to politics.Interesting thoughts...
An interesting letter in the Australian Shooter Magazine, quote:
"If you consider that there has been an average of 160,000 troops in the
Iraq theatre of operations during the past 22 months, and a total of 2112
deaths, that gives a firearm death rate of 60 per 100,000 soldiers.
The firearm death rate in Washington DC is 80.6 per 100,000 for the same
period. That means you are about 25 percent more likely to be shot and
killed in the US capital, which has some of the strictest gun control laws
in the US, than you are in Iraq.
Conclusion? "The U.S. should pull out of Washington DC".
The South averages 7 Per 100k Inhabitants.
The Northeast averages 4 Per 100k Inhabitants.
The Midwest Averages 5 Per 100k Inhabitants.
The West averages 6 Per 100k Inhabitants.
So if you don't want to get murdered the Northeast isn't that bad after all.
Also as per the origin of weapons used in a homicide 60% of them can be traced to Legal Gun Dealers (Many located in the South)
Many of them obtained via a "Straw Purchase".
ATF has statistics on this but there has been a issue with this Data being made public.
And I hope we laided the Car comparison to rest.
Yes a Sports Car is a Over Indulgence but still serves to transport the owner.
You can speed in any vehicle, hybrid or otherwise.
Car serves a purpose other than indulgence...Like a 24k Rolex....Yes it's more than one man needs but still tells him the time.
A guns sole purpose is to destroy. Some of them do it a lot better than others.
03-07-2007, 06:08 PM
#150
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"A guns sole purpose is to destroy. Some of them do it a lot better than others."
Destroy is a relative word depending on the person and the use. So many people are stuck on the idea that guns are a "bad" thing (not directed towards anyone) because they can destroy. But I can go "destroy" a target or some other object at a gun range (not bad; FUN) and then destroy would carry an entirely different association if I went and blew some schmucks head off from 1000yds away. A gun is a TOOL; its that simple. A TOOL in the hands of a negligent operator can become dangerous whether it be a car, plane, train, gun, heavy machinery, etc. Stop blaming the gun and look at the people using it and blame them and work to keep guns out of THEIR hands not someone who simply wants to go out and have a good time on the weekend with their friends in a safe and NON-DANGEROUS method.
Destroy is a relative word depending on the person and the use. So many people are stuck on the idea that guns are a "bad" thing (not directed towards anyone) because they can destroy. But I can go "destroy" a target or some other object at a gun range (not bad; FUN) and then destroy would carry an entirely different association if I went and blew some schmucks head off from 1000yds away. A gun is a TOOL; its that simple. A TOOL in the hands of a negligent operator can become dangerous whether it be a car, plane, train, gun, heavy machinery, etc. Stop blaming the gun and look at the people using it and blame them and work to keep guns out of THEIR hands not someone who simply wants to go out and have a good time on the weekend with their friends in a safe and NON-DANGEROUS method.
03-07-2007, 06:54 PM
#153
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Originally Posted by Quick1998Z28
Long Range Target Shooting, big game hunting, because if some retard COP can have one, a law-abiding civilian should be allowed to have one too. I haven't been remotely impressed with the average police officers knowledge or ability to handle a firearm safely or fire it accurately or properly, so I'll be damned if I am going to give up my gun rights and put these blundering fools in charge of my safety.
03-07-2007, 09:17 PM
#154
Originally Posted by sb427f-car
blah blah blah I can't shut my **** holster
Here’s my reply direct to your post: here you go
In your little tirade you rarely addressed what I was actually saying and misunderstood a **** ton of it. Your points are puked up drivel that rarely encompasses an actual reply to the meaning of what was said. You’re like a person that never listens and just thinks of what they’re gonna say next. Except this is the internet and you can take however much time you want to reply. So the only excuse for your errant replies is either you lack comprehension or you’re just using it as an excuse vomit your “brilliant” ideas with little care for the actual point. What, do you just want to see your ideas in type? Or are you just trying to get your e-dick rubbed by all the kids that like to see the “big bad liberal educator” really stick it to those pesky, faggoty, liberals? I can picture you sitting there all close to the screen feverishly typing away, "oooooo this will really get them, the guys will LOVE this". *******.
