Turbo Cam Help Please!!!
05-28-2009, 02:25 PM
#41
I have a WB on both driver and passenger side, I had the EGT's within 2" of number 7, and number 4. I would think if I had a misefire at rpm I would see a code or one of the WB's would go stupid.
The valve springs are the 26918 Comp Beehive springs set up by the builder, and the pushrods are 7.350"
I do not have any way to messure backpressure now that I have removed my entire exhaust. I did not see any issues there but I do still need to look at the 2 chamber flowmaster I took off it.
Throttle does goi WO.
Only possible restriction could be in the whisper lid and K/N air filter.
The valve springs are the 26918 Comp Beehive springs set up by the builder, and the pushrods are 7.350"
I do not have any way to messure backpressure now that I have removed my entire exhaust. I did not see any issues there but I do still need to look at the 2 chamber flowmaster I took off it.
Throttle does goi WO.
Only possible restriction could be in the whisper lid and K/N air filter.
05-28-2009, 02:30 PM
#42
9 Second Club
Missfires show lean on the wideband if they can be detected. The WB doesnt go stupid ( although Innovate's can go stupid at random...thats a different matter lol )
Do both banks read the same AFR ?
PR length means little without actually checking pre-load.
Aside from anything else. How does it feel ? Does it rev cleanly, freely ? Does it hld back...where in the rpm range does it feel good..or bad ?
Really...Even a single run on a dyno might reveal a lot.
Do both banks read the same AFR ?
PR length means little without actually checking pre-load.
Aside from anything else. How does it feel ? Does it rev cleanly, freely ? Does it hld back...where in the rpm range does it feel good..or bad ?
Really...Even a single run on a dyno might reveal a lot.
05-28-2009, 03:01 PM
#43
The WB's read within .5 of eachother most of the time. I watched the builder check and messure the PR length.
It revese clean, it acts like it has no power on the top end well anything above 4000rpm. I have a 3600 stall in it. First day out at the track it ripped the teeth off of the ring gear in the old 10 bolt, I installed a 9" after that. Same gears basicly, 3.73 to 3.70. I never had a problem with the cam only 346 while shooting 150 shot off the line at it. It seams to leave hard but the 60ft is only 1.85 on slicks. I can see no wheel spin looking in the data log. It just does not feel like it is making power from 4000 up. I tried shift points from 5500 to 7000 rpm, not realy any difference.
It revese clean, it acts like it has no power on the top end well anything above 4000rpm. I have a 3600 stall in it. First day out at the track it ripped the teeth off of the ring gear in the old 10 bolt, I installed a 9" after that. Same gears basicly, 3.73 to 3.70. I never had a problem with the cam only 346 while shooting 150 shot off the line at it. It seams to leave hard but the 60ft is only 1.85 on slicks. I can see no wheel spin looking in the data log. It just does not feel like it is making power from 4000 up. I tried shift points from 5500 to 7000 rpm, not realy any difference.
05-28-2009, 03:29 PM
#44
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I have ridden in this car and it feels good until it hits third really, then it quits pulling
you can also see the good climbs through first and second on the datalogger but once it hits third it kind of just hangs there slowly gaining rpm
you can also see the good climbs through first and second on the datalogger but once it hits third it kind of just hangs there slowly gaining rpm
05-28-2009, 04:08 PM
#46
I can't see the elbow in that picture but if it is the low profile Edelbrock cast piece, that's a big chunk of your missing ET right there. So you have a short runner intake on a short/big runner head and a choke on top. Basically you got no velocity and then on the top end you are restricted by the elbow which is where that intake wants to start making power. For instance, if I were to run your setup NA or with nitrous, I would put a sheetmetal elbow on that thing, real free flowing exhaust, 5500+ stall converter, gear it to trap over 7500 RPM and spin it there.
Fast forward to turbo land and all these problems will likely go away as the air velocity is provided by the turbo so you are just packing cylinders, I would still change the low pro elbow though if that is indeed the one you are using.
Don't mess with the cam yet unless you planned on it anyway for the turbo swap.
Fast forward to turbo land and all these problems will likely go away as the air velocity is provided by the turbo so you are just packing cylinders, I would still change the low pro elbow though if that is indeed the one you are using.
Don't mess with the cam yet unless you planned on it anyway for the turbo swap.
05-28-2009, 05:02 PM
#47
05-28-2009, 05:18 PM
#48
I can't see the elbow in that picture but if it is the low profile Edelbrock cast piece, that's a big chunk of your missing ET right there. So you have a short runner intake on a short/big runner head and a choke on top. Basically you got no velocity and then on the top end you are restricted by the elbow which is where that intake wants to start making power. For instance, if I were to run your setup NA or with nitrous, I would put a sheetmetal elbow on that thing, real free flowing exhaust, 5500+ stall converter, gear it to trap over 7500 RPM and spin it there.
Fast forward to turbo land and all these problems will likely go away as the air velocity is provided by the turbo so you are just packing cylinders, I would still change the low pro elbow though if that is indeed the one you are using.
Don't mess with the cam yet unless you planned on it anyway for the turbo swap.
Fast forward to turbo land and all these problems will likely go away as the air velocity is provided by the turbo so you are just packing cylinders, I would still change the low pro elbow though if that is indeed the one you are using.
Don't mess with the cam yet unless you planned on it anyway for the turbo swap.
As for the elbow, yes it is the the low profile one, not the lowest profile one Edelbrock makes, but it is the next one up. My builder chose this one over the sheet metal one. He had both there when he was porting the heads. The heads flowed 340cfm with nothing on it, then 327cfm with the intake on it. When he installed the sheet metal intake it hurt the flow (I do not know how much) but when he installed the Edelbrock elbow it had no negetive efect on the flow rate. So we went with the Edelbrock elbow do to his test. Also it would clear the cowling and hood with no modification. You are the second person to bring up that elbow. I will post a pic of the elbow so you can see which one it is. We were supprised it did not show to hurt the flow on his bench and the sheet metal one did. But the flow bench is not the engine, so I guess at high rpm it could all change. Still if the sheet metal one shows to hurt the flow on a bench then it would seam to hurt it on the engine as well. Are you thinking it will not matter once the turbo is installed?
05-28-2009, 05:27 PM
#50
Here is my best time slip so far with this engine NA.
Reaction time-------.1376
60 Ft---------------1.8318
330 ft--------------5.2283
1/8 ET--------------8.1138
1/8 MPH------------84.83
1000 ET------------10.6376
1000 MPH-----------NONE
1/4 ET--------------12.7853
1/4 MPH------------104.85
We are at an elevation of 3500 and I think the DA that day was a little over 6000ft. I was shifting that day at 6800rpm.
Reaction time-------.1376
60 Ft---------------1.8318
330 ft--------------5.2283
1/8 ET--------------8.1138
1/8 MPH------------84.83
1000 ET------------10.6376
1000 MPH-----------NONE
1/4 ET--------------12.7853
1/4 MPH------------104.85
We are at an elevation of 3500 and I think the DA that day was a little over 6000ft. I was shifting that day at 6800rpm.
05-29-2009, 09:18 AM
#52
On a back to back comparison on an engine dyno with a 427ci engine we saw over 50hp loss with that elbow vs an accufab TB right on the intake.
Regardless, if you have good leak down and good compression and your ultimate goal is to go turbo, then dont worry about it until you have everything plumbed in and ready to go. No point in figuring this out now only to then change the entire setup around.
Regardless, if you have good leak down and good compression and your ultimate goal is to go turbo, then dont worry about it until you have everything plumbed in and ready to go. No point in figuring this out now only to then change the entire setup around.
05-29-2009, 09:49 AM
#53
On a back to back comparison on an engine dyno with a 427ci engine we saw over 50hp loss with that elbow vs an accufab TB right on the intake.
Regardless, if you have good leak down and good compression and your ultimate goal is to go turbo, then dont worry about it until you have everything plumbed in and ready to go. No point in figuring this out now only to then change the entire setup around.
Regardless, if you have good leak down and good compression and your ultimate goal is to go turbo, then dont worry about it until you have everything plumbed in and ready to go. No point in figuring this out now only to then change the entire setup around.
05-29-2009, 01:15 PM
#58
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I just read through this entire thread and keep coming back to one thing. If I read it correctly, you're using a Whisper lid and a rectangular K&N filter in the front of the car as in a N/A setup to feed a rear mount turbo? If this is the case I think you are really starving that turbo of air. You said it felt like it didn't have any top end right? There were several threads awhile ago where the Procharger guys would replace the standard intake elbow with a larger and straighter one and gaining 50-100 hp. Maybe I missed something but if you do have a pipe running from the front of the car back to the turbo, this may be your problem.
05-29-2009, 01:21 PM
#59
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I just read through this entire thread and keep coming back to one thing. If I read it correctly, you're using a Whisper lid and a rectangular K&N filter in the front of the car as in a N/A setup to feed a rear mount turbo? If this is the case I think you are really starving that turbo of air. You said it felt like it didn't have any top end right? There were several threads awhile ago where the Procharger guys would replace the standard intake elbow with a larger and straighter one and gaining 50-100 hp. Maybe I missed something but if you do have a pipe running from the front of the car back to the turbo, this may be your problem.