TomQ

Hello,

I can't decide if i should go to my 450+rwhp naturally aspired or do a blower, such as ATI or magnusson.

Which car would win the race, if equal drivers and conditions are given?

Or let's say would a 450rwhp N/A car beat a 480/490 blowed car?
Or even better ~490RWHP naturally aspired beat a ~520rwhp blowed car?

Type of racing - highway racing(everytime i drive on a highway i feel like it will be sin if i don't accelerate hard at least ones, mostly for fun), drag racing(somewhat rarely), open road racing(somewhat rarely).

Please share your thoughts or summarize your impressions from your experience (if you had a blower car before and went to a N/A equal power or vise versa).

My Goals:

My only, present mods(This is 2003 Z06):
TR 224/224/114 cam
FLPs off-road setup (will go to street setup in case of blower)
Blackwing and tunning
I'm at 400rwhp even right now.

I want power, not shooting for anything crazy but 500rwhp that's what i will be shooting with blower and my setup (with about 5lbs of boost)

I don't see myself achieving 500rwhp N/A but going big cubes or with crazy cam. This is my Only car and driven daily, city driving mostly - so loudness of the car and stinkness should be mere

Please help
Thank you

KHShapiro

iTrader: (10)

if 5lbs is your goal go FI as you wont need to upgrade your internals.
IMO

qqwqeqwrqwqtq

I've had 450rwhp naturally aspirated, 630rwhp supercharged, and now 760rwhp turbocharged. All have their strong and weak points.

A 490rwhp N/A car, would have no trouble beating a 520rwhp blower car IMHO. Centrifugally supercharged cars make a good peak HP number on the dyno, but from what I've seen, a naturally aspirated setup with similar peak horsepower will have alot more average HP.

If I owned a ZO6, I would go with a naturally aspirated 427 hands down, no question.

The Guy in MY 99TA

Well if you want to make power....... keep your set up and puit 7psi on it and ride.(5psi wouldn't be worth the money and trouble IMO and 7psi still won't hurt the engine)

Josh S.

BIGBOS

After seeing what the shop car did I would too......

If I had to do it all over again I would of went the big cube N/A/Spray route....

MYTURBOT/A

450hp FI would be alot more street freindly then NA, but i`d have to agree that NA would be faster.

TomQ

oh you guys drive me nuts LOL

Can someone explain me why N/A is faster? I mean it's still the same horse power, it's not like one way of getting horse power gets "weaker" power and another way of getting horse power is stronger.

What's the trick, where is the weak link of FI?

qqwqeqwrqwqtq

Comparing a centrifugally supercharged setup to a naturally aspirated setup with the same peak horsepower, the naturally aspirated engine will tend to have more average horsepower and torque, whereas the supercharged engine will tend to be more peaky.

TomQ

ok, so basically it means that if i will be able to get fast enough into my power band my blower car will be as fast as N/A car right?


Also, is ATI prochargers, what kind of blower are they? Centrifugal or "root"?

Magnusson superchargers are root superchargers as far as i know... does that changes things?

TWS

iTrader: (63)

NA cars are sometimes faster than an FI car with the "same" RWHP. That's because the "same" RWHP is only the peak HP that was achieved on the dyno. The NA car has more "area under the curve" when you look at the dyno chart. Meaning it is making better power across the whole RPM band, while the FI car delivers an impressive peak number that is a little misleading.

I have gone both routes. IMHO NA cars are "cooler". It's pure motor producing the power, and I love the sound of an agressively cammed motor.
HOWEVER, a quality, well-installed FI system is better in some ways. Especially for a daily driver.

1. You only go into boost when you put your foot in it, so when you are driving around calmly, your fuel mileage is hardly affected (no so on a built NA motor).

2. Related to #1. FI systems are not constantly "hard" on your motor, because you are only going into boost when you get on it. If the amount of boost is reasonable and all the auxillary systems are properly matched (PCM tune, fuel system, etc.), I feel an FI system on an otherwise basically stock motored car is going to be even more durable than a built up NA motor. Even well-built "radical" NA motors tend to have a shorter life span than stock ones. Most people I know who have worn out/damaged their motors with FI applications did so because they didn't set things up properly or did so initially and then got greedy with the boost.

TomQ

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Good observation!
I hear you. But i must tell you that, well, from my setup right now.
My power does not come up until ~4500rpm, may be because i don't have heads and that's why no power under the curve, or may be because 400 is just not that much

So, in Any case, when i race:
1. From a dead stop (don't race on streets) and on a drag strip i can lunch at 2500rpm (stock F1) or 3000+ drag radials...
2. If i race from a roll, i'll make sure to downshift low enough to go into my power band, right? Unless of course my powerband lasts only 2000 RPMs at any given gear.
And we always downshift to get into our powerband whether we N/A or blowed, right?

TWS

iTrader: (63)

You don't have a signature block to indicate what car we are talking about.

You should be making "good" power earlier than 4500 RPM, but it depends on what your definition of "good" is. LS1 heads are very good for stock heads (if you have an LS1)

I am inferring that you have an M6 car. For roll racing, like a 30 or 40 punch, start in 2nd gear.

TomQ

I wrote what car i ahve in my first post

(This is 2003 Z06):
My only, present mods
TR 224/224/114 cam
FLP LTs off-road setup (will go to street setup in case of blower)
Blackwing and tunning
I'm at 400rwhp even right now.

TWS

iTrader: (63)

I'm too lazy to reread an entire thread. I usually just look for a signature block. Most guys have their ride(s) described there.

Now that I've been reminded you have a Vette, I have heard about guys having good results with the Magnuson systems, but no exp. myself. You may want to look into them.

Good luck

TomQ

yup, i would love to get magnusson, but it requires an aftemarket raised hood.

VINCE

iTrader: (1)

If I had a Z06 I would go 427ci.. Your power to weight ratio would easily beat a 520rwhp SC'd car. I will give you an example of how NA setups ride out. I have a 01 SS. On my old setup that dyno'd 423rwhp with 4.10's I killed 03 Cobras that dyno'd from 400rwhp to 480rwhp.. I beat them from a stop and from a roll going up to 130mph. My last 03 Cobra race was with a 480rwhp/500rwtq car. He showed me his dynograph before the race. I was like this should be a good run. We both had drag radials and went from a stop first. I put 3 cars on him by mid 2nd gear and held it all the way to the top of my 4th which is about 130mph. Then we went from a 30 mph roll and I put 2 cars on him instantly and held it to the top of my 4th. I thought maybe he is not a good driver, but he also showed me his timeslip. 11.6 at 123mph on a 1.9 60ft. Now my car is a tank with me in it.. A buddy of mine has a H/C Z06 that dynos 430rwhp/425rwtq according to his dyno. We raced from a stop and he caught me by mid 2nd and rolled right by. We raced from a roll and I got out 3 cars and he caught me by mid 4th. You ask what happened? Less weight helps the Z06 roll right by. Now save for the bigger motor and get a mild cam and it will ride out. If you still think you need more. Get a nice nitrous kit and set it up right and NEVER have to worry about ANYONE during a roll race. When I say ANYONE, I mean turbo's and superchargers alike.. This does not include cars built strictly for the track and not for street use, but you will hand some of them their azz as well..

Evil F1 SS

I would go both....Find a good FI set up tha can be mod'ed to feed a built motor. Put it on your Z06, when the motor blows, build one for serious boost and turn it up.

INTMD8- Hows my car coming along? I have not chatted w/ you guys in a while.

qqwqeqwrqwqtq

We just installed the k-member and since it hadn't been run much for a while, I decided to put it up on the dyno to get some more time on the motor.

Rolled into the gas while datalogging a few times and there was a symphony of blower-belt destruction. (destroyed the blower belt). Not sure why yet. Havn't done any measuring of the pullies or anything, but it seems the ATI systems are very prone to belt problems with higher HP cars.

11 Bravo

iTrader: (3)

Go n/a. More reliable, less tuning issues, lighter.

TomQ

well, to clear things up - no tunning problems so ever with FI.

Weight - good point, but i don't think by adding another 50 lbs would change things (i'm going to gym so, i'm getting sexier, duh, lighter every day)

Another consideration - car daily driver and my Only car - stroker would be nice - no questions, with stroker i would easily jump at ~550 mark, but cam that will match that stroker won't be too driveable, gas milage will go to nothing too.

I will have to bust my *** to pass smog.

I'm not looking forward to go extreme, i'm looking for a "mild" package. Even with my "poor" 400 rwhp - i can kill almost anything out there (if race is N/A vs N/A), even if you're not N/A - i still get "you" on the top end - pass 150 (i love high speeds).

Even Z06 owners have budget limits , otherwise i would go LPE 427 TT (well, 725HPs - is no play), but the cost is like 50 gran and may get higher.

I'm going to some well known corvette shop (A&A - they've done more supercharged corvettes they i have seen) after holidays. I'll see if i can compare N/A power to supercharged power.

I used to own a f-body (2k1 trans am) - f-body and y-body are apples and orange - they lay the power down differently. i really hope ~500 rwhp will make me happy, besides how many cars out there with that kind of power and characteristics like mine anyways.

My decision is not firm yet, it will be when i come back from this shop and compare both N/A and blower cars.

Thanks for you input guys. I really appriciate it!