Incon T/c
read my post here, it has a great breakdown of the costs 
https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...ighlight=incon
Ryan
https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...ighlight=incon
Ryan
One thing you gotta remember out Incon, is that they were tooling in Australia. I work in the auto industry, and the benchmarking we have done says that in the Pacific rim, you generally pay about 25% for piece cost and tooling compared to what we pay in the US. So do a little math on that:
Intercoolers - $400 in US are $100
Cast Manifolds - $300 in US is $75
Low Volume Casting Tooling - $70,000 in US is $18,000 in the rim (probably less).
So what I am saying is, that you couldn't even put that kit together in the US and make money on it for even close to what incon sold it for. You probably couldn't even buy all the parts for what incon sold a stage one setup for. That's why Rob's kit costs what it does. Not because he is trying to make a killing on his, but because it just costs a lot more to do business here.
-Geoff
Intercoolers - $400 in US are $100
Cast Manifolds - $300 in US is $75
Low Volume Casting Tooling - $70,000 in US is $18,000 in the rim (probably less).
So what I am saying is, that you couldn't even put that kit together in the US and make money on it for even close to what incon sold it for. You probably couldn't even buy all the parts for what incon sold a stage one setup for. That's why Rob's kit costs what it does. Not because he is trying to make a killing on his, but because it just costs a lot more to do business here.
-Geoff
Originally Posted by smokinHawk
If the original cast molds could be found, a small shop could do the pouring of those most would love extra business, i know lots that would do it.
anyone know how to track down the molds? anyone with contacts.
i bet they could be bought, there probably just collecting dust.
anyone know how to track down the molds? anyone with contacts.
i bet they could be bought, there probably just collecting dust.
It'd be a hellava lot easier to reverse engineer new molds from a kit than trying to chase down the tooling. After all tooling is created from patterns. And, there are tons of small shops in the industrial belt that can do this type of work.
bottom line, this is just hobbyist stuff, no one is going to get rich doing it.
I believe that the molds were kept by the company that poured the original manifolds, since they never received payment in full from Incon for the batch of manifolds that they delivered.
Scott
Scott
Originally Posted by Scott 98Z M6
I believe that the molds were kept by the company that poured the original manifolds, since they never received payment in full from Incon for the batch of manifolds that they delivered.
Scott
Scott
" Just as a side note...
Last time I talked to Dave he was in the midst of selling the kits to an Australian company. This was several months ago, so I have no idea what the current situation is. "
Followed by :
" Preston's right. Dave was looking to sell his tooling to another Australian company. Unfortunately, that company didn't want any part of Incon's responsibility to it's screwed over customers at Dave's asking price. Also, they did not want to go forward with the LS1 F body kit, nor the Mustang."
Ok. Heres my take. If this kit is truely such an awesome kit, or would be with slight modifications, then we need to find out
A) how much it would cost
B) how many ppl would be interested in say a "togethercon TT kit!"
Really now, if someone can take a manifold and have a machinist/metalurgist weld up / fab a new one, why not take an existing kit, and copy it, making any necessary changes to it? You can use upgraded turbos, all the stuff you already mentioned etc....
I'd be in with a few grand!
A) how much it would cost
B) how many ppl would be interested in say a "togethercon TT kit!"
Really now, if someone can take a manifold and have a machinist/metalurgist weld up / fab a new one, why not take an existing kit, and copy it, making any necessary changes to it? You can use upgraded turbos, all the stuff you already mentioned etc....
I'd be in with a few grand!
your talking $6000 minimum to get a kit copied. If not more, you need to find people who have connections with garret/honeywell to make this a reality. Otherwise, your paying a large premium for the turbos.
I know of new in box in box incon kits for 6K, so if i had the money, thats what i would do.
Ryan
I know of new in box in box incon kits for 6K, so if i had the money, thats what i would do.
Ryan
Ok, $6,000 for an awesome TT kit is nothing in my mind. I am certain even if there were only 5 of us that wanted this remade, it would be worth it, and the more ppl in, the cheaper we can do it. Or in better views, get a capital going and support the remanufacture of the kit for others as well.
And I tell you what, if there is a new in box Incon TT in about 7months, figure almost half way thru my depoyment, then I will buy it for asking price up to $6000, and then of course haggle shipping. So, Slow, you can save this one and in 7mo if we (board users wanting a proven performing TT kit) dont get this kit copied, then you let me know and the Paypal / cashiers check WTFE WILL be mailed!
Charlie.
not being a smartass, I am serious as a can be!
And I tell you what, if there is a new in box Incon TT in about 7months, figure almost half way thru my depoyment, then I will buy it for asking price up to $6000, and then of course haggle shipping. So, Slow, you can save this one and in 7mo if we (board users wanting a proven performing TT kit) dont get this kit copied, then you let me know and the Paypal / cashiers check WTFE WILL be mailed!
Charlie.
not being a smartass, I am serious as a can be!
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TECH Fanatic
Joined: Nov 2001
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From: Las Cruces, NM
I figured around $7000 a few years ago after I started trying to get parts, but I did not do a complete cost breakdown. I work aerospace design fixture and fluid test system were just about everything is super low volume, it gets expensive.
Manifolds actually would be pretty easy to do. You could use a simple process like lost wax to get a rough molds. These could then be cleaned up to remove some of the problems with the originals (poor fit, rough casting, etc). Followed by reverse process to get the outer molds.
The crappy hose setup could be simplified with some injected molding pieces at the alternator and A/C locations. That way you would not need to flatten the hoses.
The butt pipe could just be some welded tubing, instead of cast aluminum. You could also improve the design and ease of installation. I modified the oil return system to return the oil through the oil level sensor instead of drilling a hole in the pan.
The other parts that get expensive are fittings. If Incon had not used rejected Parker fittings, things would have been real expensive.
Not that much work to reproduce an make better, just expensive.
Gary
Manifolds actually would be pretty easy to do. You could use a simple process like lost wax to get a rough molds. These could then be cleaned up to remove some of the problems with the originals (poor fit, rough casting, etc). Followed by reverse process to get the outer molds.
The crappy hose setup could be simplified with some injected molding pieces at the alternator and A/C locations. That way you would not need to flatten the hoses.
The butt pipe could just be some welded tubing, instead of cast aluminum. You could also improve the design and ease of installation. I modified the oil return system to return the oil through the oil level sensor instead of drilling a hole in the pan.
The other parts that get expensive are fittings. If Incon had not used rejected Parker fittings, things would have been real expensive.
Not that much work to reproduce an make better, just expensive.
Gary