has anyone got the new hotrod magazine?
07-15-2011, 04:45 PM
#21
+1, im on TGO alot, and ppl always talk about building up their TPI engines, or getting a carb crate motor, its impossible to talk sense into those people, i tell them you can get a 5.3 for like $700, and it will handle tons of power, and get better millage than their other engines, but it just goes in one ear and out the other...
1 Question, how do the ls motors handle boost compared to the iron block engines? ive got an ls1 in my 88 trans am and will be throwing a magnacharger on it soon, should be around 8-10psi.
1 Question, how do the ls motors handle boost compared to the iron block engines? ive got an ls1 in my 88 trans am and will be throwing a magnacharger on it soon, should be around 8-10psi.
07-15-2011, 04:58 PM
#22
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I just read this article about the future of performance cars...... I thought it would be perfect for this conversation and too see what GM's predictions are for its future..... Seems BBC will be more of a practicality of ego vs. go........
http://autos.yahoo.com/news/the-futu...ance-cars.html
Bozz
http://autos.yahoo.com/news/the-futu...ance-cars.html
GM: A DIFFERENT FORMULA
What will be the key performance-enabling technologies of the next decade?
To the extent that we can boost small-displacement engines, I think it's not just engine technology, because the power-to-weight ratio needs to be good. We have to do things in the industry relative to performance cars to really enable a different formula.
But I also think there are a lot of things yet to come on internal-combustion engines that will be helpful and enable that as well. So it's not over, but it will change, and it will change quite dramatically. The displacement and horsepower piece of that will only get better, in terms of how much we get out of lower displacements, but also it will move to lower displacements, and numbers of cylinders. Because we're going to go after the car -- with a vengeance. -Mark Reuss, General Motors North America President
What will be the key performance-enabling technologies of the next decade?
To the extent that we can boost small-displacement engines, I think it's not just engine technology, because the power-to-weight ratio needs to be good. We have to do things in the industry relative to performance cars to really enable a different formula.
But I also think there are a lot of things yet to come on internal-combustion engines that will be helpful and enable that as well. So it's not over, but it will change, and it will change quite dramatically. The displacement and horsepower piece of that will only get better, in terms of how much we get out of lower displacements, but also it will move to lower displacements, and numbers of cylinders. Because we're going to go after the car -- with a vengeance. -Mark Reuss, General Motors North America President
Bozz
07-15-2011, 07:23 PM
#26
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07-15-2011, 09:58 PM
#27
I read the article too. The question is, don't you have to essentially tear apart the whole shortblock to get to the top rings? So if you're at that point, why not just spring for a set of forged pistons and rods.
It's not like changing rod bolts where you can do it with the motor in the car. Well, I guess technically you can drop the pan, pull the heads, and remove each rod cap and push out the piston and regap the top ring.
So unless someone has an easier way to increase the top ring gap, I'll stick with my plan to pull the motor and have it forged later this year.
It's not like changing rod bolts where you can do it with the motor in the car. Well, I guess technically you can drop the pan, pull the heads, and remove each rod cap and push out the piston and regap the top ring.
So unless someone has an easier way to increase the top ring gap, I'll stick with my plan to pull the motor and have it forged later this year.
07-15-2011, 10:35 PM
#28
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Seems to me rpm is more of a killer than hp. Quite a few guys running around on 800rwhp but theyre shifting close to 6K also. The 4.8 also has a shorter stroke so it has a better rod angle and therefore less stress. I think its a better candidate for really high boost as far as stock motors go.
07-15-2011, 11:02 PM
#29
I read the article too. The question is, don't you have to essentially tear apart the whole shortblock to get to the top rings? So if you're at that point, why not just spring for a set of forged pistons and rods.
It's not like changing rod bolts where you can do it with the motor in the car. Well, I guess technically you can drop the pan, pull the heads, and remove each rod cap and push out the piston and regap the top ring.
So unless someone has an easier way to increase the top ring gap, I'll stick with my plan to pull the motor and have it forged later this year.
It's not like changing rod bolts where you can do it with the motor in the car. Well, I guess technically you can drop the pan, pull the heads, and remove each rod cap and push out the piston and regap the top ring.
So unless someone has an easier way to increase the top ring gap, I'll stick with my plan to pull the motor and have it forged later this year.
does anyone know how the aluminum motors compare as far as bottom end strength? ive got an 02 ls1 w/ 55k in an 88 trans am, and want to throw this magnacharger i have on it, ill be around 8-10 psi.
07-16-2011, 01:51 AM
#31
An engine dyno can put much more load on an engine than a car ever could. When is the last time you seen a engine at WOT screaming at 6000 rpm be pulled down a few 1000 rpm like it was nothing. Ya a chassis dyno may not have near the load but a proper engine dyno can snap an engine in half if not operated properly.
07-16-2011, 02:38 AM
#32
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+1, im on TGO alot, and ppl always talk about building up their TPI engines, or getting a carb crate motor, its impossible to talk sense into those people, i tell them you can get a 5.3 for like $700, and it will handle tons of power, and get better millage than their other engines, but it just goes in one ear and out the other...
07-16-2011, 05:04 AM
#33
it was just a test to see how far they could push the bottom end, i get what your saying, but honestly if its making 1200hp on the stock bottom, maybe it doesnt need new rods and pistons, i guess it all depends on how much and how long you want to run that power, obviously if you run 800hp the motor will last alot longer than 1200hp, if 1200 is your goal, then yea, forged bottom end would be the way to go, im interested in seeing how much they could get away with before the engine blew up, they got 1200 and ran out of dyno time lol, so maybe it could of went another 10hp and blew up or maybe another 100hp, who knows!
does anyone know how the aluminum motors compare as far as bottom end strength? ive got an 02 ls1 w/ 55k in an 88 trans am, and want to throw this magnacharger i have on it, ill be around 8-10 psi.
does anyone know how the aluminum motors compare as far as bottom end strength? ive got an 02 ls1 w/ 55k in an 88 trans am, and want to throw this magnacharger i have on it, ill be around 8-10 psi.
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07-16-2011, 06:36 AM
#34
An engine dyno can put much more load on an engine than a car ever could. When is the last time you seen a engine at WOT screaming at 6000 rpm be pulled down a few 1000 rpm like it was nothing. Ya a chassis dyno may not have near the load but a proper engine dyno can snap an engine in half if not operated properly.
But your right, an engine dyno can load the hell out of a motor, i wonder if it mentioned any load on the engine or not....
Either way, im gonna find out, i will regap the top ring .028 or whatever it was they did and throw alot of boost at and see what happens. sub 3000lb rx7.
Ill be out a whopping hundred bucks if something goes terribly wrong, lol Not like this is the final motor anyway, or turbo
Last edited by JAX04; 07-16-2011 at 06:47 AM.
07-16-2011, 06:49 AM
#35
I've always seen when guys put boost to a stock shortblock, the first thing to go is the top ringland. According to the article, quote "the change we made to the short-block was increasing the gap of the top rings from 0.015" to 0.028". Piston failures can usually be traced back to the rings butting, sticking on the bore, and snapping the ring land. Extra ring gap cures this issue."
So my question is this. I have a stock shortblock as well, and have a D1 that I'd like to safely run to roughly 650-700 horsepower, and would it be something reasonable to do to take out each piston and increase the ring gap to 0.028? Essentially it would only cost materials for oil, gaskets, etc, so it's essentially a free mod other than time/labor.
So my question is this. I have a stock shortblock as well, and have a D1 that I'd like to safely run to roughly 650-700 horsepower, and would it be something reasonable to do to take out each piston and increase the ring gap to 0.028? Essentially it would only cost materials for oil, gaskets, etc, so it's essentially a free mod other than time/labor.
Last edited by The Alchemist; 07-16-2011 at 07:15 AM.
07-16-2011, 08:53 AM
#36
Also, if they thought it was a 5.3 and it wasn't, the tune would be pretty messed up. I remember when I engine swapped, I started it for the first time, and it would barely idle. I had to keep my foot on the throttle. Until I changed in HpTuners the displacement from 5.7 to 6.0. Then it ran awesome. The ls1's use engine displacement for the calculated cylinder airmass measurement.
07-16-2011, 10:29 AM
#38
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Seems like it would be a good time to give it a quick hone with a "dinggle berry" and install fresh rings with said ring gap. Or is this getting away from the "budget" dealio? How much are stock rings anyway?
07-16-2011, 01:39 PM
#39
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I stop subscribing to those magazines at least a decade ago. I was tired of reading BS . You have to remember a magazine is there to make money and push their advertisements. Dont believe everything you read . If you want to
build a race engine or street engine i suggest you go to your local machine shop /engine builder.
build a race engine or street engine i suggest you go to your local machine shop /engine builder.
07-16-2011, 02:04 PM
#40
I stop subscribing to those magazines at least a decade ago. I was tired of reading BS . You have to remember a magazine is there to make money and push their advertisements. Dont believe everything you read . If you want to
build a race engine or street engine i suggest you go to your local machine shop /engine builder.
build a race engine or street engine i suggest you go to your local machine shop /engine builder.