Pushing water through copper HG
08-08-2011, 02:36 PM
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Pushing water through copper HG Hi Guys I need some help on where to start. I have a 98 camaro 406LSX th400 ptc converter, 106mm turbo with a victor JR intake and wilson elbow. After about 8 passes I keep blowing water through my over fill, I have had the head off twice. It keeps pushing water through #8 cyl, Last year it was #7, but twice so far on eight, car runs good went 791@181 so far at 21lbs of boost. First time was pretty bad and i had 13 passes on ituntil I realized it was pushing, this time i had 8 passes on it and i pulled the spark plugs and found water on the plug after it sat for a couple days. What should I be lookin for??
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08-08-2011, 03:19 PM
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O-ringed block and Reciever groove Head, I used some Ford diesl grey the last two times, I have a feelin maybe the intake i had on was crap, I just put on a CFE sheetmetal intake and o2 in the last 3 cylinders on each side. Gonna try to monitor them through the racepak, Hopefully maybe it was the intake. we have 17 degrees of timing at that boost level, do you think thats enough to detonate
08-09-2011, 05:23 PM
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c16 fuel
air fuel on the 7.91 pass was 11.6 11.8 and hit 12.0 on the shifts
No knock sensor on car
I'm beginning to think that if my average ratio was 11.6-11.8 on all cylinder that would mean that my rear 2 cylinders were worse do to that victor jr intake, but theres a new intake on it now and goin back out thursday so we'll see
air fuel on the 7.91 pass was 11.6 11.8 and hit 12.0 on the shifts
No knock sensor on car
I'm beginning to think that if my average ratio was 11.6-11.8 on all cylinder that would mean that my rear 2 cylinders were worse do to that victor jr intake, but theres a new intake on it now and goin back out thursday so we'll see
08-09-2011, 05:48 PM
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c16 fuel
air fuel on the 7.91 pass was 11.6 11.8 and hit 12.0 on the shifts
No knock sensor on car
I'm beginning to think that if my average ratio was 11.6-11.8 on all cylinder that would mean that my rear 2 cylinders were worse do to that victor jr intake, but theres a new intake on it now and goin back out thursday so we'll see
air fuel on the 7.91 pass was 11.6 11.8 and hit 12.0 on the shifts
No knock sensor on car
I'm beginning to think that if my average ratio was 11.6-11.8 on all cylinder that would mean that my rear 2 cylinders were worse do to that victor jr intake, but theres a new intake on it now and goin back out thursday so we'll see
You said a sheetmetal intake was going on it also right?
If not you may need to add more fuel. Keep the timing where it is.
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08-09-2011, 06:10 PM
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Sheet metal yes
Yea thats what we r going to do is add fuel prob get it between 11.2-11.4
I think the timing will be good at 17 also. we will see thursday hopefully i dont have to take these heads off again.
Yea thats what we r going to do is add fuel prob get it between 11.2-11.4
I think the timing will be good at 17 also. we will see thursday hopefully i dont have to take these heads off again.
08-09-2011, 08:17 PM
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you are running way to lean for a cast intake if you don't have egts. More than likely your rear cylinders are way too lean. not sure of you compression or cam but 17 degrees is really light for only 20 lbs of boost.
you never mentioned what cylinder heads you have. Also i have had no luck over the years with reciever grooves.
you never mentioned what cylinder heads you have. Also i have had no luck over the years with reciever grooves.
08-09-2011, 09:09 PM
#11
When you say no luck what do you mean? My 406 s10 with a fogger had o rings in the block copper head basket and receivers in he head and sealed really well. Sprayed a very big shot with 14:1 compression ratio and never had an issue. Do you not run a register groove any more and run a thinner o ring? I am curious. To the op. With a cast intake and seeing that much boost and afr at 11.7 the rear cylinder were probably mid to high 12's my guess.
08-09-2011, 10:14 PM
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When you say no luck what do you mean? My 406 s10 with a fogger had o rings in the block copper head basket and receivers in he head and sealed really well. Sprayed a very big shot with 14:1 compression ratio and never had an issue. Do you not run a register groove any more and run a thinner o ring? I am curious. To the op. With a cast intake and seeing that much boost and afr at 11.7 the rear cylinder were probably mid to high 12's my guess.
08-09-2011, 10:21 PM
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Vic jr with elbow and 12 to 1 air fuel sounds like a bad mix. He's hasn't heard of the problems with those intakes and elbows until recent. Guys by us like to run em lean and mean,,,,, at the cost of a few parts.
08-10-2011, 08:28 AM
#14
Yes, but a copper head gasket is still the same material and so is a stainless o ring. I was looking for a response from Shawn and his experience with reciever grooves on an lsx. I worked in a machine shop and built many engines and wanting to learn why he had bad luck with them. Thanks for identifying the obvious that a sbc and a lsx are different, though. It was very helpful.
08-10-2011, 08:50 PM
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When you say no luck what do you mean? My 406 s10 with a fogger had o rings in the block copper head basket and receivers in he head and sealed really well. Sprayed a very big shot with 14:1 compression ratio and never had an issue. Do you not run a register groove any more and run a thinner o ring? I am curious. To the op. With a cast intake and seeing that much boost and afr at 11.7 the rear cylinder were probably mid to high 12's my guess.
Not a very fair comparison. My old 421 sbc had 14.5 compression and 450-500hp n2o. Sealed it with std felpro gaskets. If you couldn't seal that engine with the copper headgaskets you need to get a new tuner. FI engines are alot trickier to seal and the LSx engines are way different that sbc's.
We experimented with about 10 different oring configurations about 12 years ago when i first went supercharged. the oring/ receiver groove setup wasn't even in the top 5.
