Water to Air Intercooler @ -100F
09-28-2011 | 10:06 AM
#21
Yes purely rocket powered.
Used 90% H2O2 made by FMC but production problems, NASA cutbacks and other problems caused the price of a 28 gallon drum of fuel to rise from $180 in 1977 to over $2000 before they quit making it.
It takes almost a full drum of fuel per run.
It weighed 1010 empty and as long as you lined it up straight it went straight.
On 1/4 mile runs, using 24 gallons it would burn out of fuel before 1000 feet and still record 320+ speeds every time with an ET in the 4.80 range using 600 pounds of pressure at launch.
In the 1/8th I'd crank it up to 750 and using only 18 gallons it would burn out just before the lights.
I want to tell that 0 to 300 in the 1/8th, in under 3 seconds is quite a ride!
The chassis and body was built by Minnesota Custom Fabricators, Ky Michaelson built the rocket engine and Frank Hussar of Race Car Specialties in Tarzana California helped finish up the car.
Got my licence at Irindale Raceway same day as Jim Hodges(rocket funny) Kitty O'Neil and her husband Duffy Hambilton a famous stuntman.
They were driving Kys rocket dragster.
Kitty went over 600 at Bonneville in Bill Fredricks rocket and was the most famous stunt person in the world at the time.
Also renting the track then was The California Flash, Butch Leal with a mopar pro stock of some kind.
Bernie Partridge was the NHRA rep in charge of thrust vehicles.
We had a speed limit too, 275 for funnies and 330 for rails.
If you exceeded that speed you got one warning, second offense you lost you ticket for 3 months.
When Fred went 353 he told Bernie "It was dark and I couldn't see the speedometer,"
Jarhead
Used 90% H2O2 made by FMC but production problems, NASA cutbacks and other problems caused the price of a 28 gallon drum of fuel to rise from $180 in 1977 to over $2000 before they quit making it.
It takes almost a full drum of fuel per run.
It weighed 1010 empty and as long as you lined it up straight it went straight.
On 1/4 mile runs, using 24 gallons it would burn out of fuel before 1000 feet and still record 320+ speeds every time with an ET in the 4.80 range using 600 pounds of pressure at launch.
In the 1/8th I'd crank it up to 750 and using only 18 gallons it would burn out just before the lights.
I want to tell that 0 to 300 in the 1/8th, in under 3 seconds is quite a ride!
The chassis and body was built by Minnesota Custom Fabricators, Ky Michaelson built the rocket engine and Frank Hussar of Race Car Specialties in Tarzana California helped finish up the car.
Got my licence at Irindale Raceway same day as Jim Hodges(rocket funny) Kitty O'Neil and her husband Duffy Hambilton a famous stuntman.
They were driving Kys rocket dragster.
Kitty went over 600 at Bonneville in Bill Fredricks rocket and was the most famous stunt person in the world at the time.
Also renting the track then was The California Flash, Butch Leal with a mopar pro stock of some kind.
Bernie Partridge was the NHRA rep in charge of thrust vehicles.
We had a speed limit too, 275 for funnies and 330 for rails.
If you exceeded that speed you got one warning, second offense you lost you ticket for 3 months.
When Fred went 353 he told Bernie "It was dark and I couldn't see the speedometer,"
Jarhead
09-28-2011 | 11:24 AM
#23
TECH Addict
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 2,866
Likes: 4
Some impresive stuff Jarhead. Are you ssaying it only took 600lbs of trust to deilver those times???
How do you feel the solid fuel rockets often used today compear to these liquid fuel ones? If im not mistaken they still use Hydrogen Peroxied as the oxidizer but a rubber type compound as the fuel.
Chris.
How do you feel the solid fuel rockets often used today compear to these liquid fuel ones? If im not mistaken they still use Hydrogen Peroxied as the oxidizer but a rubber type compound as the fuel.
Chris.
09-28-2011 | 11:35 AM
#24
No it took 600 lbs of pressure in the tank.
My car had a 12" pack and made 5000 lbs thrust at 600PSI.
At 750 PSI it made about 7500 lbs of thrust.
I talked with Ky the other day, he's still building rocket vehicles.
The rockets you are talking about use plastic inside and nitros oxide, not hydrogen peroxide.
Ky has made several small ones and used them on bikes and even a wheel chair!
He says he can make one that would be about the same size and power as my old unit but it would cost a bunch.
BTW my car complete, paint and chutes included cost 21K back in 77.
And that included John Kosmoske himself of House of Color painting the car.
Of course that was alot of money back then.
Jarhead
My car had a 12" pack and made 5000 lbs thrust at 600PSI.
At 750 PSI it made about 7500 lbs of thrust.
I talked with Ky the other day, he's still building rocket vehicles.
The rockets you are talking about use plastic inside and nitros oxide, not hydrogen peroxide.
Ky has made several small ones and used them on bikes and even a wheel chair!
He says he can make one that would be about the same size and power as my old unit but it would cost a bunch.
BTW my car complete, paint and chutes included cost 21K back in 77.
And that included John Kosmoske himself of House of Color painting the car.
Of course that was alot of money back then.
Jarhead
09-28-2011 | 02:58 PM
#27
Ky Michaelson has some pictures of me on his web site.
I googled Big Willie Robinson and he had a poster from the Star Wars Drags but no pictures that I could see of my car.
I've seen photos on the web of the car at Garlits museum but I don't know how to copy and post them.
If you can post some please do.
Jarhead
I googled Big Willie Robinson and he had a poster from the Star Wars Drags but no pictures that I could see of my car.
I've seen photos on the web of the car at Garlits museum but I don't know how to copy and post them.
If you can post some please do.
Jarhead
09-28-2011 | 04:14 PM
#28
09-28-2011 | 05:56 PM
#29
The film is so dark it's hard to tell but I guess it was my car.
We had two bookings there , 15 and 29 Oct 1977.
The jets were the Oddasay and The Traveling Man, I ran them both and they ran each other a few times.
Big Willie was friends with one of the producers and they turned out a bunch of characters in costume for the 1st event but I'm not sure about the 29th.
When I ran the Oddesay on the 29th the lights failed as we hit the traps and we were darkness at 300+.
The shutdown area lighting was powered by a gas generator and it ran out of gas just as I hit the traps, it looked so starange I could see the lights of the bay and nothing else.
I was in the left lane and moved over a bit just as the jet roared by in the shutdown with his tailpipe glowing.
I'd beat them on track but they were so heavy that they took a lot longer to stop so they'd pass me in the shutdown.
I wish the video was better quality and thanks alot.
Jarhead
We had two bookings there , 15 and 29 Oct 1977.
The jets were the Oddasay and The Traveling Man, I ran them both and they ran each other a few times.
Big Willie was friends with one of the producers and they turned out a bunch of characters in costume for the 1st event but I'm not sure about the 29th.
When I ran the Oddesay on the 29th the lights failed as we hit the traps and we were darkness at 300+.
The shutdown area lighting was powered by a gas generator and it ran out of gas just as I hit the traps, it looked so starange I could see the lights of the bay and nothing else.
I was in the left lane and moved over a bit just as the jet roared by in the shutdown with his tailpipe glowing.
I'd beat them on track but they were so heavy that they took a lot longer to stop so they'd pass me in the shutdown.
I wish the video was better quality and thanks alot.
Jarhead
09-29-2011 | 10:35 AM
#30
After watching the two videos many times I decided that it WAS NOT my rocket car. It is in fact Fred Goeske's rocket with George Hedebek driving in about 1980.
The poster for the 1977 race is when my car ran there.
I kept looking at the video and I finally realized that it was Fred's car.
I called Fred this morning and he confirmed that they ran there.
I wish it had been my car so that I'd have a video of it but too bad it's not.
Thanks again for posting the video, Fred says he loved seeing it.
Jarhead
PS For those who don't know about Fred Goeske he is a longtime professional drag racer and in the mid to late 1960s he was a leader and front runner in funny cars.
His rear engine barracuda was the most sucessful rear engine funny in history, held the NHRA record and still the safest with the engine behind the driver.
Fred still has the Cuda and several rocket cars too and is the best friend I have from my rocket car days.
The poster for the 1977 race is when my car ran there.
I kept looking at the video and I finally realized that it was Fred's car.
I called Fred this morning and he confirmed that they ran there.
I wish it had been my car so that I'd have a video of it but too bad it's not.
Thanks again for posting the video, Fred says he loved seeing it.
Jarhead
PS For those who don't know about Fred Goeske he is a longtime professional drag racer and in the mid to late 1960s he was a leader and front runner in funny cars.
His rear engine barracuda was the most sucessful rear engine funny in history, held the NHRA record and still the safest with the engine behind the driver.
Fred still has the Cuda and several rocket cars too and is the best friend I have from my rocket car days.
09-29-2011 | 11:50 AM
#31
TECH Addict
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 2,866
Likes: 4
Im the one that tuned the 5.3 with the nitrous in the turbo s10. Since then there has been many PM's, more testing, and more than a few actually running it. (especially here local) One has to understand that the cooling effect is all in relation to the gross amount of nitrous sprayed and the CFM of air flowing into the intake as well as the turbo's effeciancy levels at that cfm. Too small a compressor or a reversion issue (air backing up thru the engine, sometimes even due to exaust backpressure) will create higher than "standard" air inlet temps.
My background is from outlaw 10.5, dragradial ect and a typical Air inlet temp that we like to see is 60-70 degrees (thats obtainable with a large Air/water) A good example is Enzo Peccihini's NMRA dragradial mustang. I was involved with the chassis build from the ground up and everything on that combination was built for peak effeciancy. So much so that 3 years ago we started with a filled block, and ran icewater pumped thru the cylinderheads down the track from a secondary intercooler tank. The water temp in the heads and top of the block was 45 degrees on the start of the pass and 60 thru the quarter mile. We held the world record for an F1R procharger for a year with a 5.03 in the 1.8th mile with 342 cubic inches and trick flow heads.
ANYWAY you can cool the intake charge, with inlet temp or even block temp... it drives away detonation. When I tuned that car we ran 23 lbs of boost and 29 degrees of timing at 10300 rpm over spinning the F1r 30%.
Similar... lastnight we ran the s10 with the same stock 5.3 we have always ran. 250 shot on two stages... 27lbs of boost. Wild ride and spun damn near the length of the track. But we drove the truck home still alive and well.
The turbo heats up the air while it compresses it... THATS where the heat is created. If you spray 1 inch away from the compressor with nitrous thats -150 degrees... thusly cooling DIRECTLY the compressed charge. You will see big inlet temp drops.
My background is from outlaw 10.5, dragradial ect and a typical Air inlet temp that we like to see is 60-70 degrees (thats obtainable with a large Air/water) A good example is Enzo Peccihini's NMRA dragradial mustang. I was involved with the chassis build from the ground up and everything on that combination was built for peak effeciancy. So much so that 3 years ago we started with a filled block, and ran icewater pumped thru the cylinderheads down the track from a secondary intercooler tank. The water temp in the heads and top of the block was 45 degrees on the start of the pass and 60 thru the quarter mile. We held the world record for an F1R procharger for a year with a 5.03 in the 1.8th mile with 342 cubic inches and trick flow heads.
ANYWAY you can cool the intake charge, with inlet temp or even block temp... it drives away detonation. When I tuned that car we ran 23 lbs of boost and 29 degrees of timing at 10300 rpm over spinning the F1r 30%.
Similar... lastnight we ran the s10 with the same stock 5.3 we have always ran. 250 shot on two stages... 27lbs of boost. Wild ride and spun damn near the length of the track. But we drove the truck home still alive and well.
The turbo heats up the air while it compresses it... THATS where the heat is created. If you spray 1 inch away from the compressor with nitrous thats -150 degrees... thusly cooling DIRECTLY the compressed charge. You will see big inlet temp drops.
Also have you got a link or any more info on the nitros cooled turboed 5.3? Sound slike some intresting stuff.
Chris,
