microsquirt
The Microsquirt is the same ECU as the MSII/Extra 3.57. It's just in a smaller water resistant case. It's designed for motorcycles, snowmobiles, etc. But, all of the hardware and tuning that works on the MSII will work with the Microsquirt.
The MSII is not capable of sequential injection or spark control. The injectors are batch fired, and the spark is wasted spark only. If it's set up correctl;y, it can run the coils directly from the ECU. If not, you'll have to use an external EDIS module for the coils.
You can use the stock LS coil set as a wasted spark. But now you're firing the spark twice as many times as they're designed for. Coil saturation and dwell time will be cut in half. Your spark will not be as strong as a stock LS system provides. Since you're running a turbo, that's really not going to work well for you. You need the strongest spark you can get.
DIY Auto tune sells a set of coils specifically for this application. I'm not sure if they're strong enough for a turbo, though. You should call them and ask.
Late model Mustangs use a wasted spark coil pack. And there are some high performance replacements available, like this one: http://www.summitracing.com/parts/msd-8241/overview/
The problem with Ford coils is that Ford uses this weird locking mechanism for the wires. You'll have to use wires designed for the Ford 4.6l mod motor. Those may or may not fit the way you'de like them too.
I used the coils from DIY Auto Tune. http://www.diyautotune.com/catalog/i...ack-p-409.html I like these because they use standard HEI plug boots. You can mount them anywhere, and run whatever wires you want. The down side is that you can only get these coils from one place. So I carry a spare.
The MSII is not capable of sequential injection or spark control. The injectors are batch fired, and the spark is wasted spark only. If it's set up correctl;y, it can run the coils directly from the ECU. If not, you'll have to use an external EDIS module for the coils.
You can use the stock LS coil set as a wasted spark. But now you're firing the spark twice as many times as they're designed for. Coil saturation and dwell time will be cut in half. Your spark will not be as strong as a stock LS system provides. Since you're running a turbo, that's really not going to work well for you. You need the strongest spark you can get.
DIY Auto tune sells a set of coils specifically for this application. I'm not sure if they're strong enough for a turbo, though. You should call them and ask.
Late model Mustangs use a wasted spark coil pack. And there are some high performance replacements available, like this one: http://www.summitracing.com/parts/msd-8241/overview/
The problem with Ford coils is that Ford uses this weird locking mechanism for the wires. You'll have to use wires designed for the Ford 4.6l mod motor. Those may or may not fit the way you'de like them too.
I used the coils from DIY Auto Tune. http://www.diyautotune.com/catalog/i...ack-p-409.html I like these because they use standard HEI plug boots. You can mount them anywhere, and run whatever wires you want. The down side is that you can only get these coils from one place. So I carry a spare.
9 Second Club
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 13,616
Likes: 185
From: Norn Iron
With the rpm's most LS motors turn, dwell time is not an issue, especially with the D585 coils as these can only tolerate around 4700us at most anyway, and most coils saturate around 5000us anyway
The fact the coils fire twice as often is no big deal. It would be like driving at 2000rpm instead of 1000rpm...they fire twice as often at 2000rpm too.
The OEM coils are very reliable.
Moving to EDIS or any 4 tower type setup would be a huge backwards step compared to an LS coil.
And any setup based on 4 tower coils will have very long leads than need to criss-cross across the engine.
Ive been running OEM coils firing as "wasted" spark for around 8-9 years and never had a single problem.
The fact the coils fire twice as often is no big deal. It would be like driving at 2000rpm instead of 1000rpm...they fire twice as often at 2000rpm too.
The OEM coils are very reliable.
Moving to EDIS or any 4 tower type setup would be a huge backwards step compared to an LS coil.
And any setup based on 4 tower coils will have very long leads than need to criss-cross across the engine.
Ive been running OEM coils firing as "wasted" spark for around 8-9 years and never had a single problem.
dot bob, you make a good point. However, ask Denmah how much the wasted spark affected his Microsquirt setup performance. Looks like it work quite well for him. Does not seem to me to have any negative affects on old gold either with over 800 hp to the wheels. I have not seen any drawbacks on the multiple mega and Microsquirt set ups if have run.
the ls coils dwell saturation time is from 3.5 to 2.7 milliseconds id try them first and i am running them myself. there are plenty of cars running 9 and 8 second cars on stock coils and waste spark at 20 plus #boost.
Mine is a 1650ish lbs 4 link dragster that I am trying to get in the 6s with. I am using methanol as my fuel with filled block and heads. Just want to make sure I have enough spark to get me there. I was going to use a 16/12v battery and put 16v on the coils and run my 6012/ms1 on 12v. Now I have read that the mega/micros will run on 16v.
The fact the coils fire twice as often is no big deal. It would be like driving at 2000rpm instead of 1000rpm...they fire twice as often at 2000rpm too.
The OEM coils are very reliable.
How well does a stock coil do at 12,000 rpm? IDK, but I don't think they're really designed for that.
Moving to EDIS or any 4 tower type setup would be a huge backwards step compared to an LS coil.
I don't see how that's a huge step backwards. Unless you're talking about a stock Ford EDIs coil. That would be a step or two backwards.
And any setup based on 4 tower coils will have very long leads than need to criss-cross across the engine.
dot bob, you make a good point. However, ask Denmah how much the wasted spark affected his Microsquirt setup performance. Looks like it work quite well for him. Does not seem to me to have any negative affects on old gold either with over 800 hp to the wheels. I have not seen any drawbacks on the multiple mega and Microsquirt set ups if have run.
I'm not drag racing, either. There the engine is pushed hard for <13 seconds at a time. Not enough time to overheat the coil.
I cranked up my dwell to 4.0 ms just recently from 2.5 ms. No bad side effects as of yet. With Micro, I have learned that proper grounds are incredibly important. I spent some time last week fixing grounds and the results have been very impressive.
Mike
Mike
I used EDIS on this ZZ383 and hid the coils right behind the motor mounts. Ran the wires under the oilpan to hide them. We used a sprint car distributor plug in place of a distributor. Factory Ford crank trigger sensor and two laser cut 36-1 trigger wheels with with zink coated spacers between the wheels to make it look like a chain. This video is before we tidy'd up the plug wiring. Mega and Micro are more that capapble of riunning most any engine.
Worked pretty well on that engine.
Not sure if these video links work but if not just click on the link in my sig block.
Worked pretty well on that engine.
Not sure if these video links work but if not just click on the link in my sig block.
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Verdad Gallardo 9 Second Club
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 13,616
Likes: 185
From: Norn Iron
Ive never had any issues. I also know guys using them on motorbikes to similar rpm's in real life. Not wasted spark rpm's.
Zero issues.
As for overheating the coil, it wont happen. Dwell time is the same regardless of them doing 1000rpm or 5000rpm, or even 10,000rpm.
The only time dwell will be reduced is when there physically isnt time to fully charge for the specified period.
If YOU specify a dwell time that will overheat the coil, then that is YOUR fault, nothing elses.
I cant see any conditions where you would need to do that
Now if you're talking about spinning an LS motor to 8, 9, 10,000 rpm or so, then yes maybe LS coils arent 100% ideal for a wasted setup. But I suspect you arent intending to do that
9 Second Club
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 13,616
Likes: 185
From: Norn Iron
There are plenty of USB-serial convertors, but some can be hit or miss. I know on the ecu I use, most prefer the Prolific chipset, but even then drivers can vary
PCMCIA or Express - serial tend to be more reliable, and still very cheap on egay etc.
The connectors used on some arent great though.
Safest bet....buy a cheap laptop with a serial port. Then it will be 100% reliable as far as ecu comms go.
PCMCIA or Express - serial tend to be more reliable, and still very cheap on egay etc.
The connectors used on some arent great though.
Safest bet....buy a cheap laptop with a serial port. Then it will be 100% reliable as far as ecu comms go.
9 Second Club
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 13,616
Likes: 185
From: Norn Iron
There are plenty of USB-serial convertors, but some can be hit or miss. I know on the ecu I use, most prefer the Prolific chipset, but even then drivers can vary
PCMCIA or Express - serial tend to be more reliable, and still very cheap on egay etc.
The connectors used on some arent great though.
Safest bet....buy a cheap laptop with a serial port. Then it will be 100% reliable as far as ecu comms go.
PCMCIA or Express - serial tend to be more reliable, and still very cheap on egay etc.
The connectors used on some arent great though.
Safest bet....buy a cheap laptop with a serial port. Then it will be 100% reliable as far as ecu comms go.
I use the FTDI chipset adapters with perfect success. I use that chip in the LT1 custom programming cables and I have built over 250 of them without any failures.
BTW, I am working on integrating a USB adapter into the Micro case using a mini detachable cable to elinimate the adapters. It's just difficult to solder to the interal circuit card runs when you tun 50 your eyes go all to crap.
BTW, I am working on integrating a USB adapter into the Micro case using a mini detachable cable to elinimate the adapters. It's just difficult to solder to the interal circuit card runs when you tun 50 your eyes go all to crap.
also we found a spark issue on like 2% of cars, they have trouble with the 4.7k ohm resistors, we have tested 3.24k working the best so far, and he changed his production line to use those instead.
I wonder if it is a case of newer coils. mine had this issue and it has 2005 coils.but the 3.24 resistors fixed it . runs perfect now.
great support from mike @efi source. great guy to deal with.
great support from mike @efi source. great guy to deal with.
