View Poll Results: Do you use Alky/Water Injection instead of IC?
Yes
4
20.00%
No
1
5.00%
Use Both
15
75.00%
No, because I don't know enough about it.
0
0%
Voters: 20. You may not vote on this poll
Who used Alk/Water injection?
Thread Starter
12 Second Truck Club
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 5,574
Likes: 0
From: Sacramento, CA
Who used Alk/Water injection? Just curious who here uses it because anytime I mention it's use it gets completely ignored as if I never typed it. 
I don't see why someone would want to go through all the effort and cost of fabbing in a huge intercooler or in the case of Vortech guys, buying this expensive kit for only 8psi. I know each form of intercooling has it's pros and cons and I plan on having both when I am done but just curious who uses it here. Feels like people think it is voodoo or something and wont mention it in this forum.
I don't see why someone would want to go through all the effort and cost of fabbing in a huge intercooler or in the case of Vortech guys, buying this expensive kit for only 8psi. I know each form of intercooling has it's pros and cons and I plan on having both when I am done but just curious who uses it here. Feels like people think it is voodoo or something and wont mention it in this forum.
TECH Resident
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 948
Likes: 0
From: orlando, florida
Our cars are hard enough to tune throwing the meth injection in the mix just adds one more factor to go wrong. Intercoolers are dependable cause their always there and there's no moving parts to break. If you count on the meth injection to cool the intake charge your playing with fire cause the first time the pump or something goes out your gonna go lean and kiss your motor good bye.
Thread Starter
12 Second Truck Club
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 5,574
Likes: 0
From: Sacramento, CA
I can understand that but with as many safe guards as you can run with the injection system I don't see it as all that unsafe. I also don't see many threads of people blowing something up when these safe guards are in effect.
I'm still for the idea of running both but on some systems it is very difficult and costly. There have been some very expensive machines run with this system in the past so it can't be all that unsafe when done right.
Anyway, it's not just abotu cooling the intake charge. It's added fuel from the Alky which allows you to run more boost on pump gas than normal, and the cleaning of the internal parts which helps to keep carbon buildup to a minimum also.
But I am not here to push the system so much as to see why people here don't really use it and to open more peoples eyes to other options. I see people complaining about not being able to run more boost because ..........(insert complaint ) when it could easily and cheaply be solved by going with injection. That's all
I'm still for the idea of running both but on some systems it is very difficult and costly. There have been some very expensive machines run with this system in the past so it can't be all that unsafe when done right.
Anyway, it's not just abotu cooling the intake charge. It's added fuel from the Alky which allows you to run more boost on pump gas than normal, and the cleaning of the internal parts which helps to keep carbon buildup to a minimum also.
But I am not here to push the system so much as to see why people here don't really use it and to open more peoples eyes to other options. I see people complaining about not being able to run more boost because ..........(insert complaint ) when it could easily and cheaply be solved by going with injection. That's all
Staging Lane
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 79
Likes: 0
From: cape cod
alky use
Originally Posted by MYTURBOT/A
Our cars are hard enough to tune throwing the meth injection in the mix just adds one more factor to go wrong. Intercoolers are dependable cause their always there and there's no moving parts to break. If you count on the meth injection to cool the intake charge your playing with fire cause the first time the pump or something goes out your gonna go lean and kiss your motor good bye.
When installed correctly, the system is very safe, and has many benefits as F8L has suggested. Althought an IC is easier to deal with, and you do not have to worry about anything going wrong, the meth/alky injection is going to allow more boost that an IC and allow more timing advance.
Our STS sequential meth systems have a sensor in the pump which flips a switch in the case of an empty tank or a pressure failure. This can be wired to flip a high boost solenoid back to wastegated boost immediately under failure...
Our STS sequential meth systems have a sensor in the pump which flips a switch in the case of an empty tank or a pressure failure. This can be wired to flip a high boost solenoid back to wastegated boost immediately under failure...
TECH Resident
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 948
Likes: 0
From: orlando, florida
I'll agree that using both could work great but I just think that with my luck if I was depending on the meth injection alone somthing would happen. There's just to many mechanical parts to not have a sort of saftey net like an intercooler incase the unexpected happens.
But I would like to see more discussions on it because it is somthing i want to look into using with my current setup.
But I would like to see more discussions on it because it is somthing i want to look into using with my current setup.
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TECH Enthusiast
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 596
Likes: 0
From: Downers Grove,IL
It works well but you have to run a good amount of meth to get any sort of real charge cooling. I ran various alky/water systems for 3 years on my blown ls1 with no intercooler. I used from 1 to 4 nozzles. Injected Pressures up to 150psi. Tried it through the blower, near the throttle body and right after the blower outlet.
At a 15GPH flow rate and 13psi with no intercooler my IAT's would still hit 160+ degrees. At 20+ gph it begain to cool well into the 135' range on a 80 degree day.
If you have the nozzles to close to the IAT sensor you get tricked into thinking the charge is cooler than it is. That's because the fluid wets the sensor.
I have since built my own water/air intercooler from scratch. Iat is now about the same as with a 20+GPH alky spray and no intercooler.
Alky injection works well if you use enough of it.
I won't be going back to using it anytime soon though.
Steve
At a 15GPH flow rate and 13psi with no intercooler my IAT's would still hit 160+ degrees. At 20+ gph it begain to cool well into the 135' range on a 80 degree day.
If you have the nozzles to close to the IAT sensor you get tricked into thinking the charge is cooler than it is. That's because the fluid wets the sensor.
I have since built my own water/air intercooler from scratch. Iat is now about the same as with a 20+GPH alky spray and no intercooler.
Alky injection works well if you use enough of it.
I won't be going back to using it anytime soon though.
Steve
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Verdad Gallardo Thread Starter
12 Second Truck Club
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 5,574
Likes: 0
From: Sacramento, CA
Originally Posted by MYTURBOT/A
I'd like to try it not for it's cooling effect but for it's octain.
Of course that is ideal and will allow you to make a hell of a lot of power!
Originally Posted by F8LPONY
I think the best combo is to run both the intercooler AND the Alky. You get constant relaible cooling from the IC and once it does it's job and gets the IATs decently low the Alk will lower it even further AND add octane
TECH Apprentice
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 308
Likes: 0
From: Austin, TX
I'm running methanol injection on my c5 with an ATI d1-sc with about 10psi of boost.
It works great, but I also have a big front mount intercooler.
Right now I'm making 670RWHP on pump gas with the alky injection. I'll be turning up the boost soon and hope to make well over 700rhwp. This is all with the stock short block running a static compression of about 9.7:1. My IATs rarely go over 100 and I measure that at the MAF before the alky spray.
I'm not shy with the alky, I pump in quite a bit with a 2 stage setup running about 200psi. I keep my AF in the low 11 range right now.
You really have to be able to tune your own setup if you are going to run this stuff. I think most people shy away from it because you really have to be constantly on top of the tune. You also have to spend some serious time to get your system setup correctly.
It is a great substitute for race gas. I don't think it is a great substitute for an intercooler.
It works great, but I also have a big front mount intercooler.
Right now I'm making 670RWHP on pump gas with the alky injection. I'll be turning up the boost soon and hope to make well over 700rhwp. This is all with the stock short block running a static compression of about 9.7:1. My IATs rarely go over 100 and I measure that at the MAF before the alky spray.
I'm not shy with the alky, I pump in quite a bit with a 2 stage setup running about 200psi. I keep my AF in the low 11 range right now.
You really have to be able to tune your own setup if you are going to run this stuff. I think most people shy away from it because you really have to be constantly on top of the tune. You also have to spend some serious time to get your system setup correctly.
It is a great substitute for race gas. I don't think it is a great substitute for an intercooler.