So... Learning odd things at the Dyno. Need input.
WB reading. Do you trust the reading? Post turbine location? If it's real then it could be why you're breaking up, but there's nothing inherently wrong with running 4 bar of fuel and having it boost reference. However, your injector data will be different. The flow rate will no longer be sloped if you are boost referenced, it'll be a flat line. That's why I asked about the injector data.
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 88
Likes: 8
WB reading. Do you trust the reading? Post turbine location? If it's real then it could be why you're breaking up, but there's nothing inherently wrong with running 4 bar of fuel and having it boost reference. However, your injector data will be different. The flow rate will no longer be sloped if you are boost referenced, it'll be a flat line. That's why I asked about the injector data.
Before Dyno day I had my flow rate vs. kpa set 180lbs across the board and had regulator set to 58psi and referenced. Now I'm down to 43.5psi referenced and 156 across the board.
I performed the air recalibration to the WB to make sure it gave me the best reading and appeared to be staying in the same area as before. Dyno Tuner said his was a little off compared to mine though. But thats what I keep hearing from other peoples experiences.
Before Dyno day I had my flow rate vs. kpa set 180lbs across the board and had regulator set to 58psi and referenced. Now I'm down to 43.5psi referenced and 156 across the board.
Before Dyno day I had my flow rate vs. kpa set 180lbs across the board and had regulator set to 58psi and referenced. Now I'm down to 43.5psi referenced and 156 across the board.
Teching In
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 32
Likes: 7
I think there are a number of issues going on at once but I wouldn't run 43psi base and then boost on top without a boost referenced regulator. The differential pressure across the injector gets low real quick and the injectors will not appreciate that. The whole point of the boost reference is to retain the same differential pressure at all boost levels. Yes most modern cars with returnless fuel systems run without a a reference but they also run higher base pressures typically. Typically anything under 30-35 psi differenetial and injectors don't work well and you are severely limiting their flow.
If everything is setup correctly with regards to the tune and the injector data is correct and the fuel system is operating as it should a VE that falls off or flatlines as boost increases is telling you there is a restriction in the system. VE is a measurement of efficiency - it is in the name after all. It isn't ideal but in of itself isn't a problem.
If everything is setup correctly with regards to the tune and the injector data is correct and the fuel system is operating as it should a VE that falls off or flatlines as boost increases is telling you there is a restriction in the system. VE is a measurement of efficiency - it is in the name after all. It isn't ideal but in of itself isn't a problem.
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 88
Likes: 8
Also would like some input on miss matched wastegate sizes. I currently have a single 44mm gate and I was having a problem controlling the boost. The controller was off and the gate should of been opening at 7lbs. I have the gate positioned about as good as any gate could be. I'll be adding a gate regardless, so whats your alls opinions of placing the second gate on the turbine? Other option is in the crossover pipe under the truck.
Also if anyone has looked at my plug images, wheres the timing mark? looks like it hasnt even reached the bend of the strap. But would like an experienced opinion. I need to get some schooling on the plug reading.
Also if anyone has looked at my plug images, wheres the timing mark? looks like it hasnt even reached the bend of the strap. But would like an experienced opinion. I need to get some schooling on the plug reading.
Tune looks ok except for the Offset vs Volts vs VAC table.
At least it's not matching the FIC 1650 data I have from FIC.
For a boost referenced setup, which I think you should be running btw, you need to copy/paste the 0 KPA column from the FIC data into every column in your table.
This may make a difference.
Another thing.
You have 12.5: commanded in the PE table. I would make that table the same as the BE table.
I tend to use the BE table as a safety for the PE table because we don't know exactly when the BE table becomes active.
Is this a functioning flex fuel setup?
At least it's not matching the FIC 1650 data I have from FIC.
For a boost referenced setup, which I think you should be running btw, you need to copy/paste the 0 KPA column from the FIC data into every column in your table.
This may make a difference.
Another thing.
You have 12.5: commanded in the PE table. I would make that table the same as the BE table.
I tend to use the BE table as a safety for the PE table because we don't know exactly when the BE table becomes active.
Is this a functioning flex fuel setup?
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Staging Lane
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 88
Likes: 8
Tune looks ok except for the Offset vs Volts vs VAC table.
At least it's not matching the FIC 1650 data I have from FIC.
For a boost referenced setup, which I think you should be running btw, you need to copy/paste the 0 KPA column from the FIC data into every column in your table.
This may make a difference.
Another thing.
You have 12.5: commanded in the PE table. I would make that table the same as the BE table.
I tend to use the BE table as a safety for the PE table because we don't know exactly when the BE table becomes active.
Is this a functioning flex fuel setup?
At least it's not matching the FIC 1650 data I have from FIC.
For a boost referenced setup, which I think you should be running btw, you need to copy/paste the 0 KPA column from the FIC data into every column in your table.
This may make a difference.
Another thing.
You have 12.5: commanded in the PE table. I would make that table the same as the BE table.
I tend to use the BE table as a safety for the PE table because we don't know exactly when the BE table becomes active.
Is this a functioning flex fuel setup?
The flex system shows to be operating properly. Running gm’s sensor. The computer I’m using had everything available which I lucked into.
For initial tuning, I want all the fuel in as soon as it’s floored.
You can taper etc after it’s calibrated in the boost areas.
I also start off at 11:1 commanded just to be safe.
The goal being get actual to match commanded. Then change commanded to say 11.5:1. I run 11.3 on E.
It should all track.
It’s unclear why making values in your VE table smaller isn’t leaning the AFR.
One more thing. Use the BCM control to reset fuel trims. Sometimes you can end up with added fuel from the trims that you aren’t aware of.
You can taper etc after it’s calibrated in the boost areas.
I also start off at 11:1 commanded just to be safe.
The goal being get actual to match commanded. Then change commanded to say 11.5:1. I run 11.3 on E.
It should all track.
It’s unclear why making values in your VE table smaller isn’t leaning the AFR.
One more thing. Use the BCM control to reset fuel trims. Sometimes you can end up with added fuel from the trims that you aren’t aware of.
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 88
Likes: 8
For initial tuning, I want all the fuel in as soon as it’s floored.
You can taper etc after it’s calibrated in the boost areas.
I also start off at 11:1 commanded just to be safe.
The goal being get actual to match commanded. Then change commanded to say 11.5:1. I run 11.3 on E.
It should all track.
It’s unclear why making values in your VE table smaller isn’t leaning the AFR.
One more thing. Use the BCM control to reset fuel trims. Sometimes you can end up with added fuel from the trims that you aren’t aware of.
You can taper etc after it’s calibrated in the boost areas.
I also start off at 11:1 commanded just to be safe.
The goal being get actual to match commanded. Then change commanded to say 11.5:1. I run 11.3 on E.
It should all track.
It’s unclear why making values in your VE table smaller isn’t leaning the AFR.
One more thing. Use the BCM control to reset fuel trims. Sometimes you can end up with added fuel from the trims that you aren’t aware of.
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 88
Likes: 8
I noticed the data is different. I pulled up the data one more time to make sure I hadnt grabbed the wrong thing.
I went ahead and copied the 0 column and pasted thought out to 80. I'm sure this bit of info will help with dialing in fueling. I went ahead and moved my injector flow rate to 179 and I'll reset my fuel pressure to 58psi. Fic rates the injectors at 180lbs at 58psi, but in the data for flow rate the 0 column is 179. I guess 180 sounds better than 179. Now that's squared away, I'll see how much my fueling is off once again.
I went ahead and copied the 0 column and pasted thought out to 80. I'm sure this bit of info will help with dialing in fueling. I went ahead and moved my injector flow rate to 179 and I'll reset my fuel pressure to 58psi. Fic rates the injectors at 180lbs at 58psi, but in the data for flow rate the 0 column is 179. I guess 180 sounds better than 179. Now that's squared away, I'll see how much my fueling is off once again.
I noticed the data is different. I pulled up the data one more time to make sure I hadnt grabbed the wrong thing.
I went ahead and copied the 0 column and pasted thought out to 80. I'm sure this bit of info will help with dialing in fueling. I went ahead and moved my injector flow rate to 179 and I'll reset my fuel pressure to 58psi. Fic rates the injectors at 180lbs at 58psi, but in the data for flow rate the 0 column is 179. I guess 180 sounds better than 179. Now that's squared away, I'll see how much my fueling is off once again.
I went ahead and copied the 0 column and pasted thought out to 80. I'm sure this bit of info will help with dialing in fueling. I went ahead and moved my injector flow rate to 179 and I'll reset my fuel pressure to 58psi. Fic rates the injectors at 180lbs at 58psi, but in the data for flow rate the 0 column is 179. I guess 180 sounds better than 179. Now that's squared away, I'll see how much my fueling is off once again.
Just a couple of thoughts...
- For something like this I always recommend a reference and flatten your injector data tables
- You don't need 58 psi of base pressure with such a large injector if you aren't getting close to 90% duty cycle up top, drop that base down to like 40 to use more of the dynamic range of the injector and that also helps keep you away from the minimum pulse width and muddy fueling at idle and light part throttle cruise
- For the love of jeebus stop using the boost enrichment table on P59s in HPT, just use PE to avoid weird fueling delay loops
- For something like this I always recommend a reference and flatten your injector data tables
- You don't need 58 psi of base pressure with such a large injector if you aren't getting close to 90% duty cycle up top, drop that base down to like 40 to use more of the dynamic range of the injector and that also helps keep you away from the minimum pulse width and muddy fueling at idle and light part throttle cruise
- For the love of jeebus stop using the boost enrichment table on P59s in HPT, just use PE to avoid weird fueling delay loops
