belt grip spray
made zero difference for me on my procharger. Making sure the belts are perfectly aligned is really important as well as the tensioners used on the bracket. The last thing is belt wrap, you want a bracket that has the belt riding on as much of the pulley as possible to reduce the amount of slip.
What bracket setup do you have? Any pics?
What bracket setup do you have? Any pics?
VHT on the belt will stop it from slipping. It does cause the belt to harden though and can make slipping problems worse after a period. We used to use this trick on the dyno to see if upper HP swings were belt slip or something else.
Belt alignment is the most important. You have to spend the time to get the alignment within a 1mm or so on the loaded side of the pulley to the crank. Once you have the alignment, then a good spring tensioner. With good alignment and a good spring tensioner you can get away with some pretty small pulleys. I run a 3.1" on a D1x and don't have a consistent slip problem.
RR 3.1 pulley, SDCE spring tensioner. 7" crank pulley and D1x.
Belt alignment is the most important. You have to spend the time to get the alignment within a 1mm or so on the loaded side of the pulley to the crank. Once you have the alignment, then a good spring tensioner. With good alignment and a good spring tensioner you can get away with some pretty small pulleys. I run a 3.1" on a D1x and don't have a consistent slip problem.
RR 3.1 pulley, SDCE spring tensioner. 7" crank pulley and D1x.
Thread Starter
TECH Apprentice
Joined: Nov 2016
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From: switzerland
vht traction compound? →https://www.thedrive.com/guides-and-gear/what-is-vht
i was wondering which belt sprays worked and which didnt. alignment is a different issue.
belt is always slipping, the question is how much. ecs 6-rib setup, btw.
i was wondering which belt sprays worked and which didnt. alignment is a different issue.
belt is always slipping, the question is how much. ecs 6-rib setup, btw.
vht traction compound? →https://www.thedrive.com/guides-and-gear/what-is-vht
i was wondering which belt sprays worked and which didnt. alignment is a different issue.
belt is always slipping, the question is how much. ecs 6-rib setup, btw.
i was wondering which belt sprays worked and which didnt. alignment is a different issue.
belt is always slipping, the question is how much. ecs 6-rib setup, btw.
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Makes me wonder how many people are out there running these blowers and don't even know that their belt is most likely slipping.
Does belt slip become only an issue when you start to lean on them or is it just part of the deal?
The guy I bought my car from had a D1SC on it originally iirc and it was fine when he was making 10-11lbs. but anything above that he ran into belt issues.
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Verdad Gallardo So glad I went turbo and not centri-blower.
Makes me wonder how many people are out there running these blowers and don't even know that their belt is most likely slipping.
Does belt slip become only an issue when you start to lean on them or is it just part of the deal?
The guy I bought my car from had a D1SC on it originally iirc and it was fine when he was making 10-11lbs. but anything above that he ran into belt issues.
Makes me wonder how many people are out there running these blowers and don't even know that their belt is most likely slipping.
Does belt slip become only an issue when you start to lean on them or is it just part of the deal?
The guy I bought my car from had a D1SC on it originally iirc and it was fine when he was making 10-11lbs. but anything above that he ran into belt issues.
Mainly when you lean on the lower level kits with the smaller pulleys and belts. A healthy setup (like the OEMs) doesn’t slip if you run it at the rated RPM. My old blower setup didn’t slip at all when I first installed it with an 8psi pulley config. When I went to 12psi, it slipped. An 8 rib belt can only put in so much work before it slips, even with great wrap. Really need to go to 12 rib, cogged, or even direct drive on the “big boy” power level blowers. Nothing against them really… hard to beat the sound some of them make! Our track record holder is a 3 sec Procharger setup.
I was just wondering how much drag is induced (HP lost) by putting traction compound on the belts is all. Be a neat test to do a back-to-back with a non-slipping belt setup. See if it’s a decent loss or negligible.
Mainly when you lean on the lower level kits with the smaller pulleys and belts. A healthy setup (like the OEMs) doesn’t slip if you run it at the rated RPM. My old blower setup didn’t slip at all when I first installed it with an 8psi pulley config. When I went to 12psi, it slipped. An 8 rib belt can only put in so much work before it slips, even with great wrap. Really need to go to 12 rib, cogged, or even direct drive on the “big boy” power level blowers. Nothing against them really… hard to beat the sound some of them make! Our track record holder is a 3 sec Procharger setup.
I was just wondering how much drag is induced (HP lost) by putting traction compound on the belts is all. Be a neat test to do a back-to-back with a non-slipping belt setup. See if it’s a decent loss or negligible.
I was just wondering how much drag is induced (HP lost) by putting traction compound on the belts is all. Be a neat test to do a back-to-back with a non-slipping belt setup. See if it’s a decent loss or negligible.
Either way you kill the belt faster and perhaps gain nothing.
So, then I guess the move would be to oversize the blower, so it doesn't have to work as hard using a larger pulley to hit your goals?
Or even a wash, the horsepower you gain eliminating slip is lost due to the grip compound.
Either way you kill the belt faster and perhaps gain nothing.
So, then I guess the move would be to oversize the blower, so it doesn't have to work as hard using a larger pulley to hit your goals?
Either way you kill the belt faster and perhaps gain nothing.
So, then I guess the move would be to oversize the blower, so it doesn't have to work as hard using a larger pulley to hit your goals?
It does kill the belt faster. If I had to use slip compound to get your belt to stop slipping on the dyno, you were told to swap the belt and either go to a bigger belt or get your alignment correct.
Getting a S/C belt to not slip is a pain in the ***, but as long as you the right-size the belt, proper alignment and a good spring tensioner it isn't a problem. I have setup many-many supercharged cars over the years that didn't have belt slip issues at elevated boost levels.
I run 22 psi on an 8-rib, very rarely do I have a slip issue. A good friend runs ~21 psi, similar situation - very rarely a slip issue. Tensioners and brackets have also come a long way from the early dark-ages of supercharging LS engines.
You don't lose HP with the grip compound on it. Used to do this on the dyno all the time to troubleshoot belt slip. Belt immediately sticks and the HP of the car goes way up.
It does kill the belt faster. If I had to use slip compound to get your belt to stop slipping on the dyno, you were told to swap the belt and either go to a bigger belt or get your alignment correct.
Getting a S/C belt to not slip is a pain in the ***, but as long as you the right-size the belt, proper alignment and a good spring tensioner it isn't a problem. I have setup many-many supercharged cars over the years that didn't have belt slip issues at elevated boost levels.
I run 22 psi on an 8-rib, very rarely do I have a slip issue. A good friend runs ~21 psi, similar situation - very rarely a slip issue. Tensioners and brackets have also come a long way from the early dark-ages of supercharging LS engines.
It does kill the belt faster. If I had to use slip compound to get your belt to stop slipping on the dyno, you were told to swap the belt and either go to a bigger belt or get your alignment correct.
Getting a S/C belt to not slip is a pain in the ***, but as long as you the right-size the belt, proper alignment and a good spring tensioner it isn't a problem. I have setup many-many supercharged cars over the years that didn't have belt slip issues at elevated boost levels.
I run 22 psi on an 8-rib, very rarely do I have a slip issue. A good friend runs ~21 psi, similar situation - very rarely a slip issue. Tensioners and brackets have also come a long way from the early dark-ages of supercharging LS engines.
Huh, not doubting you, as I have never done it. But that's crazy to me.
Would have to create a bunch of additional heat and drag. Not sure how physics would allow it not to. Maybe just not enough to translate into noticeable HP lost.
Super common to see TC pull the soles off shoes at our track. Literally tears shoes in half! Poor bike guys leave there shoe at the starting line more often than you'd think!
Would have to create a bunch of additional heat and drag. Not sure how physics would allow it not to. Maybe just not enough to translate into noticeable HP lost.
Super common to see TC pull the soles off shoes at our track. Literally tears shoes in half! Poor bike guys leave there shoe at the starting line more often than you'd think!
I have no way to know how much belt slip I may or may not have. 377 hitting 20 psi peak at 7200 rpm shift point with an 8 rib regular belt not even the hd or rpm belts. 8.25 crank pulley and 4.13 blower regular procharger pulleys no grip tech or any tricks. Never been on a dyno but did trap 118 in the 1/8th at 3850 race weight on 26 x 10 x 15 stiff wall slicks with 2500 DA leaving off idle and rolling into it. Didn't have to build boost at the line or anything just left like I was leaving a stop light no prep.
It's a GTO so it's never going to be "fast", but it's a super simple combo and fun to drive around. I just use the shortest belt I can barely got on it with good pulley alignment and proper tension.
It's a GTO so it's never going to be "fast", but it's a super simple combo and fun to drive around. I just use the shortest belt I can barely got on it with good pulley alignment and proper tension.
Huh, not doubting you, as I have never done it. But that's crazy to me.
Would have to create a bunch of additional heat and drag. Not sure how physics would allow it not to. Maybe just not enough to translate into noticeable HP lost.
Super common to see TC pull the soles off shoes at our track. Literally tears shoes in half! Poor bike guys leave there shoe at the starting line more often than you'd think!
Would have to create a bunch of additional heat and drag. Not sure how physics would allow it not to. Maybe just not enough to translate into noticeable HP lost.
Super common to see TC pull the soles off shoes at our track. Literally tears shoes in half! Poor bike guys leave there shoe at the starting line more often than you'd think!
Belts load (or are capable of loading) about 20 HP per rib. So, a maxed 8 rib is transmitting 160 HP to the supercharger - introducing even 20 HP from belt tackiness won't show up in the big picture. If you are feeding 160 HP to a supercharger you are making ~1300 HP at the motor.
Thread Starter
TECH Apprentice
Joined: Nov 2016
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From: switzerland
i actualy do not have any "problems" with the setup. its a standard 6-rib ecs kit.
belt slip is when the whole area is covered in black dust. this starts as soon as you go above 7-8 psi. alignment (i have my own opinion on that), rpm belt and making my own stand-offs helped. im now around 20 psi max with little dust.
"20 HP per rib": interesting, where does it come from? im thinking in that case oem would be using a 2-rib belt. a street blower is consuming anywhere brtween 50 and 100 hp, so its not that far off.
i personnaly am very glad i took the centri route (disregarding the difficulties with turbos on a corvette): i now have flat or even rising tq between 5000 and 6500rm, the blower compensating for falling vol. eff. i strongly doubt a stock engine (like mine) could take that kind of boost in the midrange for very long.
belt slip is when the whole area is covered in black dust. this starts as soon as you go above 7-8 psi. alignment (i have my own opinion on that), rpm belt and making my own stand-offs helped. im now around 20 psi max with little dust.
"20 HP per rib": interesting, where does it come from? im thinking in that case oem would be using a 2-rib belt. a street blower is consuming anywhere brtween 50 and 100 hp, so its not that far off.
i personnaly am very glad i took the centri route (disregarding the difficulties with turbos on a corvette): i now have flat or even rising tq between 5000 and 6500rm, the blower compensating for falling vol. eff. i strongly doubt a stock engine (like mine) could take that kind of boost in the midrange for very long.
Being nerdy in the shop. You can determine the maximum torque a given supercharger belt assembly can hold with a tape measure and a torque wrench. From there some belt engineering math to calculate the maximum power that can be transmitted. It is also a good way to check that you have enough tensioner and tensioner travel.
Most setups use belt wraps around 180 deg (+/- 20 deg) and spring tensioners - so it is going to be close for most people but it is a function of belt wrap and belt tension.
Most setups use belt wraps around 180 deg (+/- 20 deg) and spring tensioners - so it is going to be close for most people but it is a function of belt wrap and belt tension.