MelloYellow

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by VINCE:
<strong>I am confused.. There are people running stock heads and cam and they dyno 470rwhp plus and people with H/C packages only dyno'ing 40 to 60rwhp more.. The #'s do not add up.. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Could be intake related?
I'd def want a nice cam and headers.

CoopDog

iTrader: (17)

Charlie,

Yes it was a mail order tune,so you can't compare it directly. I do think the tune I have leaves a little to be desired. You can pull the file and look at it, I know it is running way lean at the top. One way or another, I need to get something done. Car is inop at the moment, probably be another 2 weeks or so before I can do anything.

VINCE

iTrader: (1)

I have to say that MMS setup sounds more like it.. That setup only needed 9psi to make 592rwhp on a H/C package.. This was years ago.. Everyone questioned this secondary to MMS always dyno'ing higher than the norm.., but all of a sudden everyone is dyno'ing those high #'s. Could it be MMS had already discovered something, but with every business all the supporting porters cant keep up and the quality seemed to suffer..? I personally would love to only run 9psi and get close to 600rwhp.. With a forged shortblock the engine would last forever.. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

MFBA dynoed a 98 WS6 A4 totally stock with a Vortech 9 lb Vince, in early 1999.

Did 395rwhp on a dyno we all feel is low.

Now that was three years ago. The 00 has a lot more going for it. And it was tuned in person.

I know that headers, cats, y pipe, and catback are all worth about 30-40rwhp, so what's not to believe.

Larry, remember that the 98 you are doing does not have an LS6 intake (Doug Roderick's car right?).

VINCE

iTrader: (1)

John you said that car dyno'd 502rwhp.. I agree a lot has changed since 99.. The ls6 intake with all the bolt ons make that much of a difference..? Just with the mods you put in your above statement I am only around 440 to 450rwhp.. Ls6 and tuning will pick up another 50 to 62 rwhp..? I am not trying to start an arguement. I just would like to understand what was the important factor that changed between the two years..

<small>[ April 21, 2002, 06:45 PM: Message edited by: VINCE ]</small>

LS1 SPEED INC.

iTrader: (1)

John we will be putting a ls6 or possibly a holley on if they it arrives on time.

YES the car is Doug's

talk to you soon.

Larry

SC 98 Mecham

I believe!! All I have is Super Chips Mail order programming and stock internals.. Jason

MelloYellow

Maybe the other car was too rich, not enuff timing or belt was slipping?

Not sure about the Vortechs, but the ATI's at 9psi are putting down about the same power.

Sears

What was the correction factor? And what were the uncorrected numbers?

Justin

VINCE

iTrader: (1)

Ok.. Its kind of falling together.. In 99' people were still learning and now the tuning is more accessible. Plus who knows all the affects of the bolt ons when it comes to FI..

ChrisB

With a blower your CFM is pretty much fixed at whatever the blower is pullied at. When you reduce restriction with a fixed set of pullies you decrease the observed manifold pressure, so the engine is somewhat more efficient, but there is only so much power you can make when at a fixed CFM level (increasing effeciency).

If you matched boost levels with the h/c setup vs. the stock motor setup than the h/c setup will make much more power (tuned appropriately) - but then the h/c setup will also be flowing more CFM.

When you go to a FI setup things don't work the same as they do NA - with a NA setup you have a fixed input pressure (atmospheric) but CFM is only a function of the restriction in the motor.

Chris

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

Vince, LS1 Speed has dynoed a few Vortech and ATI blown cars. Even an Incon TT car. So the #'s are strong for the car in the subject line but this is not the only blower car they have done.

I think that on the spot tuning does help a lot. I recall back in early 99 when we dynoed that one car, that guy only had 16 degrees of timing advance. I wonder how much this 500rwhp car has.

I dyno on the same dyno too.

John
ARE 422ci iron
450rwhp unlocked, 502rwtq

VINCE

iTrader: (1)

I just want to know if you built a nice shortblock with forged pistons and lowered the compression to 9.1:1. How much boost could you run w/out lifting the heads and what kind of horsepower could I expect with a nice blower cam as well?

Terry Burger

iTrader: (4)

John wants us to believe that Speed, Inc.'s tuning is the only difference between the 460rwhp most guys get and this guys 500rwhp. I know the Vortech tuning is pretty poor, so it could be legit.

<small>[ April 29, 2002, 03:03 PM: Message edited by: Terry Burger ]</small>

RyanJ

VINCE, remember, adding a free flowing H/C will decrease boost. so its hard to compare a properly tuned actual 9lb 500rwhp stock motor car to a slightly differently tuned actual 5-7lb 5xxrwhp h/c car. altitude and driveline have to do with that too.

cablebandit

iTrader: (37)

Terry, I hope I meet you in person one day. You are almost as big of an *** as me. I think we'd be great drinking buddies!! Keep calling em like you see em...even if I dont always agree <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
<img border="0" alt="[cheers]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_cheers.gif" />

Nickn20

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by VINCE:
<strong>I have to say that MMS setup sounds more like it.. That setup only needed 9psi to make 592rwhp on a H/C package.. This was years ago.. Everyone questioned this secondary to MMS always dyno'ing higher than the norm.., but all of a sudden everyone is dyno'ing those high #'s. Could it be MMS had already discovered something, but with every business all the supporting porters cant keep up and the quality seemed to suffer..? I personally would love to only run 9psi and get close to 600rwhp.. With a forged shortblock the engine would last forever.. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">they actually lost a few PSI of boost, those numbers were on 7 pounds.

Crazyquik

I think its perfectly believable, its the "magic" of on-the-site tuning. For as long as I can remember people have questioned MMS dyno #s. Most all the time, these were cars that had MMS tuning done on the dyno by Mike opposed to the conventional mail order tuning.

Now that lots of people are playing with LS1 Edit, they're picking up power and those MMS #s dont seem so far fetched. I just think Mike Morgan was onto it the whole time.

J.

VINCE

iTrader: (1)

Dyno tuning is the only way to go in my opinion.. It is worth driving across the country to get it right the first time.. Otherwise you have somebody guessing on what would work..

dougr

Yep, mine is the black '98 they just did.

I picked it up tonite. The dyno sheet says 485 RWHP. Ok, but what does that mean? My right foot says first gear is worthless. The rev limiter comes up way faster than is sane. Second gear is near as bad. Wheelspin is crazy bad. Third gear is 60 MPH to a big brown stain in my shorts in less time than it takes me to type this.

There are still a couple of things to be ironed out, but I'm pretty happy so far. I'll let you all know how it turns out.

Doug

315 RWHP, 330 FT/LBS TQ NA
485 RWHP, 460 FT/LBS TQ SuperNaturally Aspirated

<small>[ April 30, 2002, 10:19 PM: Message edited by: dougr ]</small>